Jars of Clay & SSM

[graceandpeace]

Jars of Clay's Christian Fans Lash Out after the Lead Singer Tweets for Same-sex Marriage

 

[Water Cross]

Yes, I read of this. Very surprising he's arrive at this conclusion. Perhaps he's gay.

 

[andy b]

Yes, I read of this. Very surprising he's arrive at this conclusion. Perhaps he's gay.

Or just very happy.Really does it matter in the big picture if gays marry,I think not when you look at the problems on the planet this is way down on the list of problems that need to be solved.

 

[graceandpeace]

I think many evangelicals, particularly younger ones, are coming to similar conclusions.

I'm not an evangelical, but I've arrived to a place of neutrality - at least concerning what churches decide to do with the issue. I plan to join TEC & in general they are very accepting of gay Christians. In the culture at large, however, I don't see the problem with allowing gays to marry. In the U.S. the precedent is now set, so the dominoes will all fall. It's just a matter of how long it takes.

I hope this is not perceived as "promoting homosexuality," I'm just commenting on the given situation the church & culture is in, evidenced by yet another news story.

 

[Water Cross]

Or just very happy.Really does it matter in the big picture if gays marry,I think not when you look at the problems on the planet this is way down on the list of problems that need to be solved.

I don't think happy would be a factor when someone attempts to concede that God is wrong and the secular sins have rights over and above what God finds tolerable.

 

[Sunshine Locket]

And while the singer has since apologized for his "poor choice of words" on the role of scripture in his thinking, he has yet to walk back his questions on same-sex marriage itself.

I've never heard of this band. But according to the article they were popular in the 90's? Maybe this was their way of becoming relevant again. That old saying? "There's no such thing as bad publicity."
Now while he's apologized for what he's said in some parts he and his band are popular again. Even in this fire storm.

Sounds like a publicity stunt.

 

[SG9]

I've never heard of this band. But according to the article they were popular in the 90's? Maybe this was their way of becoming relevant again. That old saying? "There's no such thing as bad publicity."
Now while he's apologized for what he's said in some parts he and his band are popular again. Even in this fire storm.

Sounds like a publicity stunt.

You may have heard their music. The lyrics are tricky
jars of clay flood lyrics - YouTube

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

my brother is a big jars of clay fan. He still listen to them and the news boys.


I am in the "don't care" category of gay marriage, since they all marry through the court and current "gay marriage states" are just changing the name from civil union for vote pandering. it is the same thing, just a different name. You can call yourself married all you want, just like I can wear a chicken suit and call myself a chicken all I want. They are fooling themselves.

 

[revanneosl]

my brother is a big jars of clay fan. He still listen to them and the news boys.


I am in the "don't care" category of gay marriage, since they all marry through the court and current "gay marriage states" are just changing the name from civil union for vote pandering. it is the same thing, just a different name. You can call yourself married all you want, just like I can wear a chicken suit and call myself a chicken all I want. They are fooling themselves.

No sweetie, they are married and too busy taking the kids to clarinet lessons and football practice, making things for the church craft fair and collecting donations for the leukemia/lymphoma foundation to care what you think.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Denying same sex couples the right to marry isn't something that makes any sense to me. Given that, at least in my country--the United States--marriage is a legal contract made with the state, and has been declared a fundamental human right by the US Supreme Court the opposition to it is, somewhat, mind boggling.

It literally has no impact on how religious groups define marriage for themselves, such as a sacramental, covenantal union as it is in Christianity. We are, as a matter of civil law, talking about a state recognized social contract.

Even if you are morally opposed to how homosexual persons live their lives, they are still equal citizens under the law of a secular republic who are deserving of the same fair treatment under that law as all citizens are. As such they are entitled to the basic civil liberties all its citizens are entitled to. One of those civil liberties is marriage, that's not up for debate, that right was recognized by the Supreme Court decades ago when the US Supreme Court ruled that anti-miscegenation laws were unconstitutional--on the grounds that the right to marry is a fundamental right of man.

It is, as a point of fact, unconstitutional for the state to prohibit two consenting adults the right to marry; no less so than denying mixed-race couples the right to marry.

And no, this doesn't lead to a "slippery slope" toward men marrying toasters or their ostriches. The issue is, and always has been, about consenting adults; not toasters, ostriches or whatever else. But consenting adults protected by and beholden to the Constitution.

And note: None of this has to do with the morality of how homosexual persons live their lives--that topic is verboten and I understand that. I am instead speaking rather specifically on a matter of secular, civil law, specifically US law.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[High Fidelity]

We are, as a matter of civil law, talking about a state recognized social contract.

-CryptoLutheran

So why not just get a civil union(Assuming they exist in the US)?

Why would you want to force an institution to abandon core beliefs in order to satisfy your petty wants when there are alternatives available?

 

[ViaCrucis]

So why not just get a civil union(Assuming they exist in the US)?

Why would you want to force an institution to abandon core beliefs in order to satisfy your petty wants when there are alternatives available?

Depending on the jurisdiction, a civil union may or may not grant the same rights as are extended to married persons. Thus the issue is, fundamentally, one of granting the same rights to same sex couples as opposite sex couples. In some US states civil unions/domestic partnerships did/do grant most of those same rights, but not necessarily all. By granting the right to marry, there is true equity under the law.

The issue isn't in what it's called; the issue is a matter of rights guaranteed under the law.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[High Fidelity]

Depending on the jurisdiction, a civil union may or may not grant the same rights as are extended to married persons. Thus the issue is, fundamentally, one of granting the same rights to same sex couples as opposite sex couples. In some US states civil unions/domestic partnerships did/do grant most of those same rights, but not necessarily all. By granting the right to marry, there is true equity under the law.

The issue isn't in what it's called; the issue is a matter of rights guaranteed under the law.

-CryptoLutheran

I suspected that would be the issue, which I'd rather rectify than alienate an entire belief system to facilitate a group of people which in turn challenges the integrity of a church and belief system itself.

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

No sweetie, they are married and too busy taking the kids to clarinet lessons and football practice, making things for the church craft fair and collecting donations for the leukemia/lymphoma foundation to care what you think.

So the feelings mutual? ..yay?
I say again. court marriages aren't marriages in my eyes. If a church married them than more power to them.

 

[dies-l]

Yes, I read of this. Very surprising he's arrive at this conclusion. Perhaps he's gay.

Yep. That must be it. Coming to the conclusion that SSM is not going destroy society is a strong indicator that one is gay. Makes sense.

 

[revanneosl]

So the feelings mutual? ..yay?
I say again. court marriages aren't marriages in my eyes. If a church married them than more power to them.

Excellent! So you are supportive the same-sex marriages blessed by the Lutheran, Presbyterian, Episcopalian and United Church of Christ congregations?

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

Excellent! So you are supportive the same-sex marriages blessed by the Lutheran, Presbyterian, Episcopalian and United Church of Christ congregations?

Churches marry consistent liars, thieves, and adulterers all the time. Whats one sin over another? Thats my viewpoint on the matter. I don't know why some christians focus on one sin over another. I guess homosexuals getting married is contributiing to the destruction of our country 10x more than every single lying greedy politician current in seat? If only we were as vocal on the other sins that have a mutiplying effect of misery upon christian and non christian alike.

Has there been some sort of new warped teaching that certain sins are more evil than others I am not aware of? I was taught and still thing under the assumption that all sins are equal in offense to God. There are not "little" sins and 'big" sins. I guess our legal punitive actions in relation to the crime of the last 500 years has warped our perception of sin.

I believe James 2:10 is the main verse that backs me up on this. I believe Jesus taught a parable about it as well. I cannot think of of the top of my head which one.

Honestly, whenever I'm done with my schooling and officially get ordained. I will not marry anybody period. Americans in general have no appreciation for marriage. If I am sent as a missionary to another country I might re-think and marry someone there.

 

[revanneosl]

I understand your frustration dude, but speaking as someone with 29 years of pastoring under her belt, you have to believe me that any church you pastor will place incredible pressure on you to perform weddings.

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

I understand your frustration dude, but speaking as someone with 29 years of pastoring under her belt, you have to believe me that any church you pastor will place incredible pressure on you to perform weddings.

I think thats why I'm going to try the missionary field first. I just need to try and focus on a specific language to try and learn now and whatever country I feel like God is leading me too. I have a specific country in mind but I still prayer over whether it is me wanting to go or God telling me to go.

 

[kymphony]

Was it ever decided whether the band's leader is pro gay marriage or not?