A Pondering of the Peculiar

[Mr Strawberry]

I think you can answer that yourself. I am not God, so it doesn't matter. But God is God and a very loving one indeed.

So loving in fact that he sends all those who reject him to hell. Very grown up of him. And of course, that wouldn't be at all the sort of story that a culture 2 or 3 thousand years ago would invent to make sure people followed their religion would it? No, of course not.

If we actually just took a moment to think about what He has done for us, we would not hesitate to love the One that cares about us.

Oh yes, your unevidenced god cares about us so much in fact that he willingly creates billions of us with the full foreknowledge that we will reject him and spend eternity in hell. Oh, but of course, he's all about caring is your god.

 

[EternalDragon]

So loving in fact that he sends all those who reject him to hell. Very grown up of him. And of course, that wouldn't be at all the sort of story that a culture 2 or 3 thousand years ago would invent to make sure people followed their religion would it? No, of course not.

Oh yes, your unevidenced god cares about us so much in fact that he willingly creates billions of us with the full foreknowledge that we will reject him and spend eternity in hell. Oh but of course, he's all about caring is your god.

God doesn't send people to hell nor does he want them to go there.
In fact he came to earth and suffered as one of us to make it easy
to get out of hell. It is a free gift for the asking.

If people reject him, they reject him. That is their choice.

 

[Mr Strawberry]

God doesn't send people to hell nor does he want them to go there.

Why does an omniscient god create people that he knows will go to hell then? remember, omniscience means knowing everything, no exceptions.

In fact he came to earth and suffered as one of us to make it easy
to get out of hell.

How does that work again? God is paying the price of our sins, correct? Paying the price to who exactly?

It is a free gift for the asking.

So he couldn't just pardon everyone without going through the pointless exercise of pretending to have himself murdered by humans then? I mean, is he omnipotent or not?

If people reject him, they reject him. That is their choice.

And he would have known exactly what each person would choose before he even created the universe, being omniscient. He knew what every person who has ever lived, is alive now and who is yet to live will choose before he even started on his creation. But he carried on and made each of them anyway knowing they would spend eternity in hell. That's rather difficult to justify.

 

[Delphiki]

Why does an omniscient god create people that he knows will go to hell then? remember, omniscience means knowing everything, no exceptions.

This is the bit I've been trying to get through to them this whole thread, but it's just impossible.

God doesn't want people to go to hell... Yet he's the one who both "prepared" a hell and made people. Such foresight for an omnipotent and omniscient deity.

 

[anyathesword]

So loving in fact that he sends all those who reject him to hell. Very grown up of him. And of course, that wouldn't be at all the sort of story that a culture 2 or 3 thousand years ago would invent to make sure people followed their religion would it? No, of course not.

Oh yes, your unevidenced god cares about us so much in fact that he willingly creates billions of us with the full foreknowledge that we will reject him and spend eternity in hell. Oh, but of course, he's all about caring is your god.

The question is, is why would you reject God?

People send themselves there.

 

[anyathesword]

Why does an omniscient god create people that he knows will go to hell then? remember, omniscience means knowing everything, no exceptions.

How does that work again? God is paying the price of our sins, correct? Paying the price to who exactly?

So he couldn't just pardon everyone without going through the pointless exercise of pretending to have himself murdered by humans then? I mean, is he omnipotent or not?



And he would have known exactly what each person would choose before he even created the universe, being omniscient. He knew what every person who has ever lived, is alive now and who is yet to live will choose before he even started on his creation. But he carried on and made each of them anyway knowing they would spend eternity in hell. That's rather difficult to justify.

Like I said, love is not love if you force someone to love you.

Parents have kids don't they? (I have 3 now). Would you still have the kids knowing that they might walk away from you or suffer or get hurt during their life? Or do you have kids to have a nice Relationship with them and to see them grow closer to you?

God isn't forcing anyone to follow Him, its a choice.

 

[Delphiki]

The question is, is why would you reject God?

People send themselves there.

According to the stories, he's killed millions and ordered the deaths of more. He says he doesn't want people to go to hell, yet he's prepared hell and made people and people still go there. The Christian God expects a 3-day field trip to hell to make up for the millions he's sent there for eternity.

Because hell is unjust, and the only reason all Christians agree is a certain cause to be sentenced there is not acknowledging his existence. It's insecure, tyrannical, evil, and sadistic.

Let me put it this way: If I were born in North Korea, I'd already be dead for spreading sentiments of revolt. That's just who I am. I don't worship something evil just because I'm scared of it. So, if the Christian God were real, I still wouldn't worship him.

Luckily, I don't need a deity to scare me into being a good person... I do it just fine on empathy alone.

 

[anyathesword]

According to the stories, he's killed millions and ordered the deaths of more. He says he doesn't want people to go to hell, yet he's prepared hell and made people and people still go there. The Christian God expects a 3-day field trip to hell to make up for the millions he's sent there for eternity.

Because hell is unjust, and the only reason all Christians agree is a certain cause to be sentenced there is not acknowledging his existence. It's insecure, tyrannical, evil, and sadistic.

Let me put it this way: If I were born in North Korea, I'd already be dead for spreading sentiments of revolt. That's just who I am. I don't worship something evil just because I'm scared of it. So, if the Christian God were real, I still wouldn't worship him.

Luckily, I don't need a deity to scare me into being a good person... I do it just fine on empathy alone.

So let's look at it this way. You all like to use the Bible to justify that God likes to kill, He is cruel and uncaring.


So why did God order the Israelites to kill the Nations around them??? WHY??

 

[anyathesword]

According to the stories, he's killed millions and ordered the deaths of more. He says he doesn't want people to go to hell, yet he's prepared hell and made people and people still go there. The Christian God expects a 3-day field trip to hell to make up for the millions he's sent there for eternity.

Because hell is unjust, and the only reason all Christians agree is a certain cause to be sentenced there is not acknowledging his existence. It's insecure, tyrannical, evil, and sadistic.

Let me put it this way: If I were born in North Korea, I'd already be dead for spreading sentiments of revolt. That's just who I am. I don't worship something evil just because I'm scared of it. So, if the Christian God were real, I still wouldn't worship him.

Luckily, I don't need a deity to scare me into being a good person... I do it just fine on empathy alone.

People still go there but why????

 

[Delphiki]

People still go there but why????

Because God "prepared" it, then set the rules for people to go there.

 

[Mr Strawberry]

The question is, is why would you reject God?

People send themselves there.

You keep saying this but it doesn't match up with the big picture of your belief system. Your god is omniscient. He knows before he creates each person what they will 'choose' to do and what their fate is. Does this stop him creating those he knows are going to hell for the rest of eternity? No. Your god clearly thinks it's fine to create billions of people, each of whom he knows beyond a shadow of a doubt, because he is omniscient, is going to hell. He knew it before he even started making the universe. He could name every single person who would spend eternity in hell before anything existed at all. Did this stop him creating them? No. So who is ultimately responsible for them being in hell given that, being omnipotent, he had a choice whether to create those people who will suffer unmeasurable torment?

And how does that not register in your mind as being a problem?

 

[Mr Strawberry]

Like I said, love is not love if you force someone to love you.

Like saying "Love me or spend eternity in hell" you mean? Like that?

Parents have kids don't they? (I have 3 now). Would you still have the kids knowing that they might walk away from you or suffer or get hurt during their life? Or do you have kids to have a nice Relationship with them and to see them grow closer to you?

Would you decide to conceive a child you know without a shadow of a doubt is destined to spend eternity in hell? Given the choice I mean, like your omniscient god. Would you say, "yes, I'm going to create a soul that is destined to spend all of time in indescribable torment." Would you knowingly do that like your god? And then would you try and blame it on the child for apparently exerting its freewill even though you knew before you had the child what choices it would exert its freewill to make? Would you think that parent was a good person? Or would you think that parent was a not very nice person?

God isn't forcing anyone to follow Him, its a choice.

Which is made totally irrelevant by the choice your omniscient god made, because he already knew what choice each person would make before he made them. But he still made them.

 

[Mr Strawberry]

So let's look at it this way. You all like to use the Bible to justify that God likes to kill, He is cruel and uncaring.


So why did God order the Israelites to kill the Nations around them??? WHY??

Because he's a god of love? No?

 

[46AND2]

So let's look at it this way. You all like to use the Bible to justify that God likes to kill, He is cruel and uncaring.


So why did God order the Israelites to kill the Nations around them??? WHY??

Good question, Anya. Why DID he order them murdered? Why didn't he wait to see if they would change from their evil ways?

Because he already knew they wouldn't, right?

But he knew that before they were born, so why didn't he just NOT create them in the first place? Instead of sealing their eternal torment fate?

As a matter of fact, why even bother murdering them? They're going to hell, anyway, and hell is eternal. The Israelites, on the other hand were going to heaven, which is eternal. Why "punish" the non-Israelites with earthly death, when in the grand scheme of time, it's entirely irrelevant?

It makes absolutely no sense.

 

[SkyWriting]

Good question, Anya. Why DID he order them murdered? Why didn't he wait to see if they would change from their evil ways? Because he already knew they wouldn't, right?
But he knew that before they were born, so why didn't he just NOT create them in the first place? Instead of sealing their eternal torment fate?

Gog has chosen to give man choice in his destiny
rather than be an angelic type of slave with no
soul or freedoms.

Every moment alive is a gift, especially if one has
no afterlife to look forward to. Hell and Hades will be
destroyed as well in the end.

 

[SkyWriting]

Because hell is unjust,

But it's not. Hell is where we all deserve to be.
God can only accept perfection in His presence.
And we are not quite there yet.

 

[bhsmte]

I understand the approach you are taking. If that is the case? Then, why are you here?

Why am I here?

Mostly for the entertainment value.

Now, can you answer my questions?

 

[bhsmte]

I understand the approach you are taking. If that is the case? Then, why are you here?

What approach would that be?

 

[bhsmte]

Well... I said:

He placed himself in a position of vulnerability. One that you could be free to love, or hate. Same thing happened with the angels in a different way. They were made free to love the Lord, or to hate him.

Then you asked..



With Christ you could not remain indifferent if you heard him.

Thats your opinion. Others, may have different takes on it.

 

[Herman Hedning]

I think you can answer that yourself. I am not God, so it doesn't matter. But God is God and a very loving one indeed. If we actually just took a moment to think about what He has done for us, we would not hesitate to love the One that cares about us.

Mhm. One who loves me so much that he will condemn me to eternal torment if I don't love him back.There's no way I can even fathom how any one can think that is a good thing.