Protestants: What do you believe happens when you take communion?

[MoreCoffee]

Yoda. That you?

chuckle chuckle

 

[Bob Carabbio]

"Do you believe it is merely symbolic, or does it actually change into the Body and Blood?"

It's "Symbolic" Jesus said to do it "IN REMEMBERANCE" - not because of some supposed "Sacramental" magic.

And the "Lord's Body" is the other Christians that you're partaking WITH.

"Transubstantiation" is an "Orthodox", and "Catholic" belief.

 

[PaladinValer]

"Do you believe it is merely symbolic, or does it actually change into the Body and Blood?"

It's "Symbolic" Jesus said to do it "IN REMEMBERANCE" - not because of some supposed "Sacramental" magic.

And the "Lord's Body" is the other Christians that you're partaking WITH.

"Transubstantiation" is an "Orthodox", and "Catholic" belief.

Transubstantiationism is NOT an Eastern or Oriental Orthodox belief; they utterly reject Aristotelian logic when it comes to Real Presence theology.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I am curious to see what effect (if any) is received (when communion is taken) by those who take the bread as a metaphorical representation of the body of Christ and the wine (or grape juice) as a metaphorical representation of the blood of Christ?

"Do you believe it is merely symbolic, or does it actually change into the Body and Blood?"

It's "Symbolic" Jesus said to do it "IN REMEMBERANCE" - not because of some supposed "Sacramental" magic.

And the "Lord's Body" is the other Christians that you're partaking WITH.

"Transubstantiation" is an "Orthodox", and "Catholic" belief.

No sacramental "magic"?

Is God present in the holy eucharist?

Does God answer prayer when the faithful pray that God may send down His Holy Spirit to change the bread and wine into the Body and Blood of His Son?

 

[Philothei]

How wonderfully ambiguity serves your reality.
I'm almost jealous, except the juxtaposition of "real" & "mystery" creates a dangerous tension in my mind. If the "real" in Real Presence were being used as an ordinary adjective, it's intent would be to emphasize the impressiveness of it's actuality.
On the other hand, the way it is used in the religious context, with capitalization strongly suggesting divine title, it hits me like a redundancy iterated out of insecurity, as if guilding the lily would improve rather than destroy it.
Thank you for the bolded parts.
So you assert EOs claim change occurs, but decline to articulate physical &/or spiritual mechanics & timing (beyond duration of liturgical presentation)?

Yes that is what I imply....Before a certain time either EO or RC had no interest in "articulation" of the Eucharist....then after the 12 century suddenly all western scholasticism made it "mandatory" that we play with their "rules" and articulate the sacrament

 

[Philothei]

Originally Posted by Bob Carabbio

"Do you believe it is merely symbolic, or does it actually change into the Body and Blood?"

It's "Symbolic" Jesus said to do it "IN REMEMBERANCE" - not because of some supposed "Sacramental" magic.

And the "Lord's Body" is the other Christians that you're partaking WITH.

"Transubstantiation" is an "Orthodox", and "Catholic" belief.
​

Please do not call our Eucharist magic.....thanks

 

[MJohn7]

Its not like we can prove what happens in the Lords supper, he told the disciples to take it in remembrance of Him. I would rather not take the Lords supper at all if it meant arguing over it without end, that misses the whole point of how we obey the Lord. Love.

john 15:12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. 13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command.


The Vine and the Branches

John 15 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes[a] so that it will be even more fruitful. 3 You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4 Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

 

[ebia]

Its not like we can prove what happens in the Lords supper, he told the disciples to take it in remembrance of Him. I would rather not take the Lords supper at all if it meant arguing over it without end, that misses the whole point of how we obey the Lord. Love.

The salvos tried that.
Doesn't help - you only end up arguing about not doing it.

 

[MJohn7]

The salvos tried that.
Doesn't help - you only end up arguing about not doing it.

Not me, Im not interested in arguing it. I dont care what anyone believes about the Lords supper.

 

[Standing Up]

I am curious to see what effect (if any) is received (when communion is taken) by those who take the bread as a metaphorical representation of the body of Christ and the wine (or grape juice) as a metaphorical representation of the blood of Christ?

What effect? We already know in the NT it is a mortal sin of unbelief to offer the blood of others (no sacrifice left). We know the veil (flesh) has been torn, opening the way to God (holy of holies). We know we can't undo circumcision (the incorruptible seed, as Peter put it). We know Christ sat down (no representing of the same sacrifice).

So, what effect? We remember Him and show forth His death, until He come. That's what He asked of us.

 

[Standing Up]

Please do not call our Eucharist magic.....thanks

Right.

 

[Rhamiel]

He also said that he was a door and a vine. Do you take those statements in the same superliteral manner?

how many times did He call Himself a door in the gospels?
how many times a vine?
how many times was bread and/or wine used?

it is clear that the first two are metaphors
but the bread talk goes over and over and over again.

I am the bread of life
I am the bread come down from heaven
Eat my body and drink my blood
ect ect ect

if you think Jesus was just speaking metaphorically, then you are calling Jesus a horrible public speaker
you do not use metaphors over and over again, changing them twisting them up, confusing them
one minuet calling yourself bread, the next saying that people have to eat your body, and then latter calling yourself bread again...

speaking of bread, how much bread was on the boat in Mark 8:14-21?

 

[MrLuther]

It's "Symbolic" Jesus said to do it "IN REMEMBERANCE" - not because of some supposed "Sacramental" magic.

This is where knowing your Greek comes in handy.
The meaning of the words εἰς τὴν ἐμὴν ἀνάμνησιν is much deeper than just "Yo, remember me".

 

[MJohn7]

I dont say this to be disrespectful but only to give people hope. The Lord himself is our strength, not bread and wine, hope and faith are what we lean on, not food. I dont need to debate greek words to know the hope in me. Praise the Lord for hope and faith which sustains us daily, his promises and instructions guide us.

1 I love you, Lord, my strength.

2 The Lord is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer;
my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge,
my shield[b] and the horn[c] of my salvation, my stronghold.

3 I called to the Lord, who is worthy of praise,
and I have been saved from my enemies.
4 The cords of death entangled me;
the torrents of destruction overwhelmed me.
5 The cords of the grave coiled around me;
the snares of death confronted me.

6 In my distress I called to the Lord;
I cried to my God for help.
From his temple he heard my voice;
my cry came before him, into his ears

 

[Rick Otto]

I am curious to see what effect (if any) is received (when communion is taken) by those who take the bread as a metaphorical representation of the body of Christ and the wine (or grape juice) as a metaphorical representation of the blood of Christ?

I thought you've already decided you know.

 

[Rick Otto]

Please do not call our Eucharist magic.....thanks

Sure. As soon as mine stops getting called "mere" symbolism.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

This is where knowing your Greek comes in handy.
The meaning of the words εἰς τὴν ἐμὴν ἀνάμνησιν is much deeper than just "Yo, remember me".

Anamnesis! (How is this not in the dictionary here?)



God be gracious to me a sinner.

 

[Albion]

Heck, I can't even understand everything you just said in your second
paragraph.

Well, Sunlover, the point is just that the wording of Scripture indicates that there's more at work there than symbolism. Exactly what that is, I was not attemting to define for you, but I think you can see that some of the wording suggests more than symbolism or remembrance. Of course also, if you don't bother with all the words but instead just cherry-pick the passages, as it looks to me that Optimax did in the verses we were working with, you can MAKE it look like symbolism is the beginning and the end of it.

All I know is if He said it, then that's what it means.
That's enough for me.
I'm blessed to be able to sit at His table
and sup with Him.
ONLY by His shed blood, am I worthy
to partake.
Never mind what men tell me.
Amen?

I have no problem with that.

 

[Rhamiel]

Sure. As soon as mine stops getting called "mere" symbolism.

what is wrong with calling it a mere symbol?
I thought that was what you believed about it?

you get offended with terms like "just a symbol", and I am not sure why

we believe it is something far greater then a symbol
so if the two options are
A. Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ
or
B. A Symbol

then calling it just a symbol is not degrading it, it is an accurate description of the two possibilities
it is like saying "is this ring gold or is it just plastic?"
gold is of greater value then plastic so calling it "just plastic" is accurate way of denoting the worth of the two

now, a bunch of people treating a piece of plastic as if it were really gold would be foolish, but the foolishness would lay in their not being able to tell the difference between the two.
valuing gold above plastic is not foolish

 

[Albion]

what is wrong with calling it a mere symbol?
I thought that was what you believed about it?

you get offended with terms like "just a symbol", and I am not sure why

Apparently it seems--to Rick--to demean the idea of symbolism, as though symbolism is shallow or meaningless. But the problem is that we all believe it to be a symbol--Catholics, Anglicans, Lutherans, Presbyterians, etc etc. in addition to other Christians who see it as a symbol and a remembrance but without any Real Presence. That is the reason I have prefaced "symbol" with something like "mere" or "just a."

On the other hand, some have another reason:

we believe it is something far greater then a symbol
so if the two options are
A. Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ
or
B. A Symbol

it is an accurate description of the two possibilities
it is like saying "is this ring gold or is it just plastic?"
gold is of greater value then plastic so calling it "just plastic" is accurate way of denoting the worth of the two