Another queston for those who like answering questions

[jamantc]

If the altar call is so scriptural, why did it take almost 1800 years to show up in the church? If it were so scriptural, would not the apostles themselves given altar calls? Just asking. Not even Jonathon Edwards, George Whitfield, or John Wesley (to name a short few) would give an altar call, stating it wasn't necessary and a few stating it wasn't scriptural.

 

[Willie T]

Did someone say "The Altar Call" was scriptural?

 

[jamantc]

Not as of yet on here they haven't Willie. I am simply asking questions is all. If this is not ok to do on the forums, I will gladly stop. However, many pastors claim it is scriptural. I am just asking what others think. Again, if this practice in the forum is not ok, I will stop asking questions

 

[SeventhValley]

It is and also is not.

From www.gotquestions.org

What does the Bible say about altar calls? Are altar calls biblical?
" Just like the sinner’s prayer, altar calls can be
an outward expression of genuine repentance
and faith in Christ. The danger is in looking to
the prayer or the response as evidence of
salvation (Matthew 7:22 ). True salvation results
in a life of continual sanctification as the Holy
Spirit within the true believer produces more
and more of His fruit (Galatians 5:22-23 ) as
evidence of the reality of saving faith."

 

[Willie T]

No, it's fine. I was just not aware of anyone seeing it as much more than just a matter of convenience.

By all means, ask all the questions you feel you need to. Usually we really don't have truthfully good answers anyway.

 

[Willie T]

At our church we try to always include it because it might be the only opportunity some people there will have to respond, one way or another, to anything said during the service.

Although we usually also ask if anyone has any needs or questions, too.

 

[Willie T]

We even tell people we will come to their seat, and/or call them on the phone/email/Facebook if they leave a way to contact them.

Almost every other Sunday, my wife is off praying with someone where they are seated.

 

[jamantc]

Willie, please do not think I was being smart about the questions, I was not. I continually get the don't be legalistic, discuss things that matter, etc.. I love asking questions because it provokes tand scriptural study to do so.
Seventh Valley, gotquestions.org is a great site, but even they fail at answering some questions. Again, I will ask: If it is so scriptural, why didn't the apostles figure that out and why did it take 1800 years to come into the church? Surely, if was scriptural Jesus Himself would have hosted an altar call. The site also denies the sinner's prayer as saying it "can" be scriptural but most likely not. I have had many correspondence with gotquestions.org and it depends on who is writing the answer to the questions asked at the site was the answer they have given me in email and the majority of their staff sees neither altar calls or the ABC sinner's prayer as scriptural. The only formula in scripture to salvation is repent and believe not what sits on the back of some handout stating the ABC's of salvation.

 

[Willie T]

I guess it depends upon what you mean by, "scriptural".. Does that mean, "You gotta do it"... or "You can't do it?"

 

[jamantc]

I don't see it in scripture, period. It's been around less than 200 years and became popular in America by George Finney. Charles Spurgeon stated if it was the basis to one's salvation, then surely it would have been preached by the apostles and Christ Himself. Do I think it's wrong? Not sure. Do I see it as helpful or hurtful? I can see it as helpful that it will reach those who belong to Christ, but I can see it as hurtful by giving those who have been moved by mere emotions a false salvation.

 

[Willie T]

Guess what? You won't find pews in scripture either. Or microphones. Or singing choirs as we have today... nor organs... nor light bulbs... not collection plates, either... nor carpets.... Or even Children's Church. No nurseries. No crosses on top of buildings. No marquis (signs out front). You won't find worship programs.

Probably won't find "Greeters". Pretty sure you won't find toilets or water fountains.

You won't even find "preaching" the way we do it.

Jesus didn't even have His own building, period.

 

[jamantc]

Then why do we do so much found in tradition then instead of what's in scripture? I suppose that would be a more possible question than my original, why do we do so much non scriptural stuff that has become mere tradition rather than straight forward scripture? Possibly because scripture does have an order to it, it speaks of singing songs and psalms and playing the harps and stringed instruments, it even gives a structural order to the church I would suppose it why we so some things. I guess my question still points to why do we do so much that is it not scriptural? I guess the answer could be because we are under grace and not the law so where sin abounds more, grace abound even more maybe

 

[SeventhValley]

Mark 6:12-13 KJV

And they went out, and preached that men should repent. And they cast out many devils, and anointed with oil many that were sick, and healed them.

 

[Bluelion]

Jam it sounds like you are frustrated with the church. What i disagree with the church on and here i think we will agree, is with preachers telling all kinds of stories about themselves and saying one or two line from the Bible, as a result many people go to church to be entertain and can not tell you very much about the Bible. People spend 10 or more years in a church and they vaguely know the stories of the Bible, many don't even know the fully story of Joseph. Or Abraham. When they go to quote the Bible they ask a question like didn't Jesus say something about washing peoples feet, but they don't know what he said or the message of the story. This is the preachers fault.

I just had a class I did not like very much because in the text book the preacher kept telling all kinds of stories about himself and very little about the Bible. I got sick of it, but I never get sick of hearing Gods word. It is not a popularity contest. WHat it comes down to is preaching glorifying themselves instead of allowing themselves to be used to bring glory to God.

Well that is what get me any way, and not all preachers are this way, but it is the few which the rest suffer for.

 

[Keachian]

I have gotten in trouble for expressing my opinion on decision theology before in this forum so I am replying to let people know that they can contact me via PM if they wish to know.

-- Unsubscribing --

 

[jamantc]

Got in trouble with who? They may feel free to boot me from the forum if I can't express my views or disagreements of decision theology, which is unbiblical and unscriptural! I am not ashamed of my view before no man and if they feel control is the possession which they must sway over my head, then I shall be like Christ Himself and not back down from the Pharisees

 

[Willie T]

Then why do we do so much found in tradition then instead of what's in scripture? I suppose that would be a more possible question than my original, why do we do so much non scriptural stuff that has become mere tradition rather than straight forward scripture? Possibly because scripture does have an order to it, it speaks of singing songs and psalms and playing the harps and stringed instruments, it even gives a structural order to the church I would suppose it why we so some things. I guess my question still points to why do we do so much that is it not scriptural? I guess the answer could be because we are under grace and not the law so where sin abounds more, grace abound even more maybe

Yep, it sure sounds like you need to get yourself out of that environment.

 

[jamantc]

I did exactly that when I left the Arminian church I once belonged to

 

[iambren]

The most powerful,Spirit-moving churches in my 40 years as a Christian was a group of about 60-70 people. It was in a house where they had removed a partition fo a meeting area. There was no altar and if someone wanted to give their heart to the Lord they did so at their seat or took about 8 steps to be closer to the pastor. We surrounded him/her with hugs and prayer.

Probably in the early history of the church they met in homes and knew each other intimately. Close fellowship and community were not "concepts" to them;they lived it out. There's a lot to miss in the megachurch movement IMHO. I STILL remember the spiritual tone,the living presence of God to this day that I've experienced nowhere else. You don't need an altar,nor do you need an altar call.

 

[jamantc]

The most powerful,Spirit-moving churches in my 40 years as a Christian was a group of about 60-70 people. It was in a house where they had removed a partition fo a meeting area. There was no altar and if someone wanted to give their heart to the Lord they did so at their seat or took about 8 steps to be closer to the pastor. We surrounded him/her with hugs and prayer.

Probably in the early history of the church they met in homes and knew each other intimately. Close fellowship and community were not "concepts" to them;they lived it out. There's a lot to miss in the megachurch movement IMHO. I STILL remember the spiritual tone,the living presence of God to this day that I've experienced nowhere else. You don't need an altar,nor do you need an altar call.

Point on! Thanks!