Amen. Romans 10:9-19 are good proofs. Why would God provoke Israel to jealousy if they didn't have a free will to choose to believe? Why would he say we need to hear and believe and confess?
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No such thing as free will.
- Thread starter JackSparrow
- Start date
Settle down, don't be alarmed; God ordained this to come to pass from all eternity.
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I have to leave now cos her upstairs has decreed.
In a nutshell here is where I am.
I am convinced that man must have some real free will. Not enough to upset God's ultimate plan. Not enough to save himself either.
I am biased cos although I am a lowly engineer I have a good grasp of maths which prove ( absolutely proves) parodox in the most surprising and simple way. Hence I believe God can give man some genuine free will with no risk.
Ill post again but :
1. God bless you all.
2. Cygnus, what do you think of pear cider ?
In a nutshell here is where I am.
I am convinced that man must have some real free will. Not enough to upset God's ultimate plan. Not enough to save himself either.
I am biased cos although I am a lowly engineer I have a good grasp of maths which prove ( absolutely proves) parodox in the most surprising and simple way. Hence I believe God can give man some genuine free will with no risk.
Ill post again but :
1. God bless you all.
2. Cygnus, what do you think of pear cider ?
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I see it somewhat differently. God intervenes when we ask him to. We have not because we ask not.
God can do anything he wants, but he gave us free will. If he overrides our free will it would be for a serious situation, like Jonah preaching to Nineveh. Normally he wouldn't override our free-will.
Agreed.
Agreed.
God knows everything before it happens, but gave us free-will. If we create a free-will mess in a situation, we can repent and use our free-will to get his wisdom on what to do from now on. God meant for us to use our free-will to seek and worship him, not be independently stupid.
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How about the decrees of God, which finite man seems to know so well and accredits to Him?
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Oh no he didn't ...... Only some steps are foreordained
It's the unforeordained steps you gotta watch out for
I know, those unforeordained actions are like missing steps on the front porch stairs.
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Neither does free will. Free will was given to Adam. Where was it revoked? Divine Grace was given to Adam before and after he used his free will to believe the devil rather than God. Grace and free will have been available to all since the day Adam was created.
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DeaconDean
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My problem with your statement is:
"And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." -Jn. 8:32 (KJV)
Man's will is not truely free until after the point of salvation.
I have maintained, and always will maintain, that man is in bondage to sin, and only after salvation is man's will truely free from the bondage of sin.
Until then, man does not have free will.
God Bless
Till all are one.
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DeaconDean
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"How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?" -Rom. 10:14 (KJV)
Which just so happens to reinforce what I said earlier.
Nobody has ever been walking down a sidewalk and decided "of their own free will" to accept, believe, and repent.
Thank you for helping me to make my point.
God Bless
Till all are one.
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DeaconDean
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OP friend, please post here the exact post where I said man has a "free will".
I said man has a will. What was debatable is to just how free is actually is.
So post here for the forums to see where I said man has a "free will".
Or let it be known you are a goader.
God Bless
Till all are one.
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