Staff and Member discussion thread.

[Tishri1]

There you go! A discuss or debate tag. D and D. Let the thread starter decide which tag they want for their thread.

Very nice

 

[anisavta]

It looks good Tish.

 

[Avodat]

How's this for a start - Debate Rules:

No personal attacks on other members of the forum; only comments relating to the subject being debated will be tolerated. Do not attack your fellow debaters!
Do not join in a debate unless you are at least somewhat knowledgeable about the subject. Also, do not post opinions or declarations without explaining your reasoning and (wherever possible) providing supporting evidence. Please try to keep an open mind when debating! And do not join a debate just for the sake of debating.
No harsh wording or labeling. You can debate without being inflammatory.
Do not assume that opposing posts are a personal attack on you. Tone is very difficult to interpret online especially in a debate setting.
Discussion of posts made in the Debate Forum in other forums will not be tolerated. When we're outside the Debate Forum we're all neutrals! Posts in the Debate Forum are not relevant to conversations outside of the Debate Forum.
Please PM a fellow member to get permission before using their link, quotation, or ideas to begin a new debate.
Do not create threads here for the specific purpose of inciting another member.
Do not try to change someones opinions and/or beliefs.
People have different opinions and beliefs. It is fine to share yours with the understanding that they will also share theirs - and you may never come to common ground. This is OK. Respect is key here.
Be mature and responsible. Don't make assumptions. Try not to take comments personally.
Avoid typing in all CAPS just to get your point across. (Netiquette: avoid the use of all CAPITAL LETTERS in posts. ALL CAPS is considered "shouting" and causes readability issues.)
Lastly, use common sense. This is not a place to vent; it is a place to rationally discuss topics of interest. If you feel yourself getting upset by a comment...take a step back and post later. Passion is great but don't let it get out of hand. Please behave accordingly!

Labels or name calling

• Non Jew
• Two house
• One law
• Gracer

If all we are doing is to reduce all activity here to the lowest common denominator of ultra-polite conversational English about non-contentious items of mutual interest, it is pointless being here. It is not debating that is at fault - it is posters' attitudes when debating. The sole purpose of debate IS to change the other persons mind - have you guys never been to Uni debating societies etc etc?

 

[Avodat]

There you go! A discuss or debate tag. D and D. Let the thread starter decide which tag they want for their thread.

How would you know which D means Debate and which means Discuss - is there a real difference between debating and discussing?

 

[Tishri1]

If all we are doing is to reduce all activity here to the lowest common denominator of ultra-polite conversational English about non-contentious items of mutual interest, it is pointless being here. It is not debating that is at fault - it is posters' attitudes when debating. The sole purpose of debate IS to change the other persons mind - have you guys never been to Uni debating societies etc etc?

Well that's why I'm not for debates in these community forums

I'm thinking more posting ediquite is in line and needed here...not for solid rules but as a request and suggestion post by the members themselves. Some of those items are in line withCF rules but coming from all you it is even better for those willing to read it

 

[Tishri1]

How would you know which D means Debate and which means Discuss - is there a real difference between debating and discussing?

I would spell out each one


Thoughts?

 

[Yahudim]

If all we are doing is to reduce all activity here to the lowest common denominator of ultra-polite conversational English about non-contentious items of mutual interest, it is pointless being here. It is not debating that is at fault - it is posters' attitudes when debating. The sole purpose of debate IS to change the other persons mind - have you guys never been to Uni debating societies etc etc?

This does seem a little over-the-top. I beginning to think that the pendulum has swung a bit too far. Let's see how things shake out now that we have put an end to the fussing first.

There is nothing wrong with a healthy debate. It was all the derailing and the Torah/non-Torah agenda that was causing problems. Also, with the new procedures in place, everyone feels a little more comfortable that the rules will be better enforced We can remain with the grown-ups and not be forced back into kindergarten.

I think making things work first is a better plan than initiating a lot of new and untested changes. You were right Tish. No kicking. That's my two shekels anyway.

Good Night

 

[Tishri1]

This does seem a little over-the-top. I beginning to think that the pendulum has swung a bit too far. Let's see how things shake out now that we have put an end to the fussing first.

There is nothing wrong with a healthy debate. It was all the derailing and the Torah/non-Torah agenda that was causing problems. Also, with the new procedures in place, everyone feels a little more comfortable that the rules will be better enforced We can remain with the grown-ups and not be forced back into kindergarten.

I think making things work first is a better plan than initiating a lot of new and untested changes. You were right Tish. No kicking. That's my two shekels anyway.

Cool well here is something tried I the GT area....anyone ever notice a sticky in there by the members, if not go see it, tell me what you think

 

[Avodat]

I would spell out each one


Thoughts?

Sorry, but you miss my point - if you have two threads both with a symbol 'D' tagged, how would the reader know which 'D' the tag means. You say you would spell it out, but how would that work?

So you write somewhere these are the tags and their meanings:

D tag = debate - rules follow for debate (although it is to be made illegal)

D tag = discuss - rules follow for discussion

 

[Tishri1]

Sorry, but you miss my point - if you have two threads both with a symbol 'D' tagged, how would the reader know which 'D' the tag means. You say you would spell it out, but how would that work?

So you write somewhere these are the tags and their meanings:

D tag = debate - rules follow for debate (although it is to be made illegal)

D tag = discuss - rules follow for discussion

Two tags one says "discussion only"

The other says"soft debate allowed "

 

[Avodat]

This does seem a little over-the-top. I beginning to think that the pendulum has swung a bit too far. Let's see how things shake out now that we have put an end to the fussing first.

There is nothing wrong with a healthy debate. It was all the derailing and the Torah/non-Torah agenda that was causing problems. Also, with the new procedures in place, everyone feels a little more comfortable that the rules will be better enforced We can remain with the grown-ups and not be forced back into kindergarten.

I think making things work first is a better plan than initiating a lot of new and untested changes. You were right Tish. No kicking. That's my two shekels anyway.

Good Night

You imply that my comments are OTT then you proceed to support what I said - that debate is OK? I was purposely stating the extreme to make the point.

 

[Avodat]

Two tags one says "discussion only"

The other says"soft debate allowed "

I know it's Monday morning but...

At the moment we can put an 'MJ Only' tag on posts. The new suggestion is that we can, instead (or as well as), put a single letter 'D' that means either Debate or Discuss. Given that only one letter (a 'D') is suggested how can one tell which is which.

Examples for thread tags being used, as has been proposed:

MJ Only Can I wear coloured socks to Shul?
MJ Only D Can I wear coloured socks to Shul? (does the 'D' mean debate?)
MJ Only D Can I wear coloured socks to Shul? (does the 'D' mean discuss?)

That is what I am asking.

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

How's this for a start -

Debate Rules:

• No personal attacks on other members of the forum; only comments relating to the subject being debated will be tolerated. Do not attack your fellow debaters!
• Do not join in a debate unless you are at least somewhat knowledgeable about the subject. Also, do not post opinions or declarations without explaining your reasoning and (wherever possible) providing supporting evidence. Please try to keep an open mind when debating! And do not join a debate just for the sake of debating.
• No harsh wording or labeling*. You can debate without being inflammatory.
• Do not assume that opposing posts are a personal attack on you. Tone is very difficult to interpret online especially in a debate setting.
• Discussion of posts made in the Debate Forum in other forums will not be tolerated. When we're outside the Debate Forum we're all neutrals! Posts in the Debate Forum are not relevant to conversations outside of the Debate Forum.
• Please PM a fellow member to get permission before using their link, quotation, or ideas to begin a new debate.
• Do not create threads here for the specific purpose of inciting another member.
• Do not try to change someones opinions and/or beliefs: People have different opinions and beliefs. It is fine to share yours with the understanding that they will also share theirs - and you may never come to common ground. This is OK. Respect is key here.
• Be mature and responsible. Don't make assumptions. Try not to take comments personally.
• Avoid typing in all CAPS just to get your point across. (Netiquette: avoid the use of all CAPITAL LETTERS in posts. ALL CAPS is considered "shouting" and causes readability issues.)

• Lastly, use common sense. This is not a place to vent; it is a place to rationally discuss topics of interest. If you feel yourself getting upset by a comment...take a step back and post later. Passion is great but don't let it get out of hand. Please behave accordingly!

*Labels or name calling

• Non Jew
• Two house
• One law
• Gracer

off topic /no debate topics

• Kosher diet
• MJ observance of torah
• Who is MJ enough
• Trinity

Ugggg my IPad loses the bullet point format can some one fix it for me

How's that Tish?

BTW, this looks good!

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

Two tags one says "discussion only"

The other says"soft debate allowed "

I like these tags; however with the proposed rules for debate, I think we could omit "soft".

From a staff POV, when moderating it may be difficult to discern where "Discussion" crosses the line to "Debate". I think that such discernment would be quite subjective, and would therefore make "level" moderation difficult.

For these tags to work I think we would need to define where and how the line is crossed.

Would a discussion thread be limited only to those who post in agreement to the OP? If such would be the case, then only a debate tag would be needed.

Thoughts?

 

[ContraMundum]

I have been in your face thru this whole thread CM,

You have? I haven't really noticed it.

what do you think about what I had to say?

About what? I responded a while back to something you misunderstood about a post...but that's about all.

To hard , or do you think you have some things to work on?

I think you missed my response...and no, I'm just fine.

 

[Chaplain David]

This is a great day in the Lord, Monday, 3-26-2012. We're going to do good things today and get a lot accomplished. I am looking forward to taking with all of you, staff and members and the work we will do together. God bless you.

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

This is a great day in the Lord, Monday, 3-26-2012. We're going to do good things today and get a lot accomplished. I am looking forward to taking with all of you, staff and members and the work we will do together. God bless you.

I think that the whole essence is all should stay away from telling one whether or not they should or must keep the commandments. In my experience this is what Messianic does and leadership that I know stays out of these types of issues it seems.

 

[Avodat]

I like these tags; however with the proposed rules for debate, I think we could omit "soft".

From a staff POV, when moderating it may be difficult to discern where "Discussion" crosses the line to "Debate". I think that such discernment would be quite subjective, and would therefore make "level" moderation difficult.

For these tags to work I think we would need to define where and how the line is crossed.

Would a discussion thread be limited only to those who post in agreement to the OP? If such would be the case, then only a debate tag would be needed.

Thoughts?

If everyone agreed with a post there would be no discussion except, perhaps, finding as many synonyms as possible that signify agreement. What's the point - long threads with lots of all over the place? In any case it is Biblical to disagree (read 1 Corinthians 11:19)

 

[Chaplain David]

I think that the whole essence is all should stay away from telling one whether or not they should or must keep the commandments. In my experience this is what Messianic does and leadership that I know stays out of these types of issues it seems.

Let's just say I started going to the Happytown Messianic Fellowship. I didn't know a lot about MJ so was naturally inquiring what I needed to do. The Teacher would say, well, we believe in observing the Sabbath in this manner, and other things etc........Because things resonated with me and I wanted to belong to the Fellowship I began observing and doing the things the Teacher recommended and that other believers were doing in my fellowship.

Going to a forum venue, we are allowed to express our opinions but that is what they are unless they are read from Scripture for example. And if a person continues to be a pain about "you're not an MJ because you don't" or real "MJ's do this, not that" then ask that person to stop nicely (if you feel you're being harassed). If that doesn't work then give one of the staff assigned to the forum a jingle (pm) and we'll help get things worked out.

 

[Yahudim]

You imply that my comments are OTT then you proceed to support what I said - that debate is OK? I was purposely stating the extreme to make the point.

No Brother,

Not your comments. The whole reaction to the debate thing. Thought that was apparent from my comments. Sorry for the confusion.