Different state past

[Cromulent]

You may interpret it that way, but that is not what is written.

Methinks AV is too vain to realise there is a difference between his flawed human interpretations and the truth.

Again with the arrogance of thinking he's one of the few people out of the 7 billion on the planet that God has hand-picked to be the official Understanders of the Bible

 

[dad]

ps dad...
I enjoy your posts where you present yourself as the internet discussion forum equivalent of a bombastic blowhard wrestler making all kinds of stupid claims about how great your arguments are and how awful your opponent's argument is. The only difference, I suppose is that, eventually, a wrestler gets into the ring...

So get in.

 

[dad]

You've made a lot of claims, and demanded proofs of others; perhaps we should (re)establish a baseline here:

Do you believe that the Earth rotates and orbits the Sun?

Yes. At least for the last 4400 years.

 

[dad]

Dad,
In your alternate reality, wouldn't there be PERVERSE amounts of physical evidence that clearly indicate a different state past if there was one?

No. Just the written history. Why would there be? But hey, it is pretty perverse. We are close on this.

And I don't mean inferential, or "I can't explain 'x' in current state therefore it MUST have been different" logic. And certainly, if there was a different state, then written records from around the world would all directly and precisely corroborate these differences.

They do. Remember only the earliest records matter.

You yourself seem to indicate there is only SOME corroboration (assuming you didn't make it up).

There is all God's record. And there is the pagan record, which agrees in major details, like long lives and spirits.

Another question: Why do you have to PROVE a same state past?

I don't. There wasn't one. You do since you claim there was!

For the atomic theory to be true today, does not require that it was true 10,000 years ago.

Bingo. So do not offer dates 10,000 years old!

But if atomic models were different pre-flood, there would certainly be evidence indicating that.

?? Like..? If we are in one nature how would we know what the other was?

One can assume a same state past until evidence indicates a different state past (which it does not).

No. One can not any more, since you are busted.

Really, the onus is on you to prove different state....and seems like a pretty poor job is being done so far.

I have ALL the records. That works. You have zero. Nada. Squat. Nothing.


Work on that.

 

[Elendur]

They do. Remember only the earliest records matter.

But not those earlier than the bible, right?

I have ALL the records. That works. You have zero. Nada. Squat. Nothing.

Only the earliest records matters.
Those before the bible doesn't matter.
You have the bible.

Therefore you have ALL the records.

Logic at it's finest.

 

[rambot]

No. Just the written history. Why would there be? But hey, it is pretty perverse. We are close on this.


They do. Remember only the earliest records matter.



There is all God's record. And there is the pagan record, which agrees in major details, like long lives and spirits.
I don't. There wasn't one. You do since you claim there was!

Bingo. So do not offer dates 10,000 years old!

?? Like..? If we are in one nature how would we know what the other was?

No. One can not any more, since you are busted.
I have ALL the records. That works. You have zero. Nada. Squat. Nothing.


Work on that.

What's to work on? This post is a fart.

 

[dad]

But not those earlier than the bible, right?

Sumer and Egypt were post flood. So there are none before it.

 

[dad]

What's to work on? ...

Your 10,000 fantasy years. Support the dating. Otherwise it is gas.

 

[Davian]

You've made a lot of claims, and demanded proofs of others; perhaps we should (re)establish a baseline here:

Do you believe that the Earth rotates and orbits the Sun?

Yes.

Can you prove it? I don't think you can, even something as simple as this.

Just like you can't prove any of your bible stories.

 

[rambot]

Your 10,000 fantasy years. Support the dating. Otherwise it is gas.

Support different state with physical evidence. You made the claim.

 

[Tiberius]

Excuse me dad. You have completely ignored me. Post 18 please, dad! Explain why what I said is flawed.

 

[AV1611VET]

Excuse me dad. You have completely ignored me. Post 18 please, dad! Explain why what I said is flawed.

For one thing, don't you use calibrated equipment that you built yourselves?

Let's use your example: trips around the sun vs birthdays.

If you assume one birthday per year, then you calibrate the birthday as one exact trip around the sun; this includes automatically accounting for leap year, adjusting for sideral time and whatever else.

But if the person is having a second birthday based on lunar years, then you say, "oops", and readjust for solar years.

 

[CabVet]

I say that this "different state past" was everything before last Thursday. I say the universe was created last Thursday, with everything in it, including memories. Everything was created with embedded age and embedded history. Now, prove me wrong.

 

[chilehed]

The bible past does not align with present state laws and forces, nor does the future it mentions. We are told this is a temporary state even. With different laws in place the creation and evolving from kinds and the flood etc make perfect sense. Science cannot prove what laws used to exist. I have given people the opportunity for years to prove a same state past. It is now very clear that science cannot do that and does not know.

If someone is new to the concept and would like to step up into the ring and try......here is your chance.

Are you a friend of Gene Ray?

 

[Hobz]

I say that this "different state past" was everything before last Thursday. I say the universe was created last Thursday, with everything in it, including memories. Everything was created with embedded age and embedded history. Now, prove me wrong.

Bah! It wasn't last Thursday, it's every third day from the summer solstice not counting any days in which the relative humidity is above 45%.

 

[Jazer]

About as much as someone who wasn't there, but argues the Flood was only local.

Yet you admit that the evidence shows there was no world wide flood. For those that can not accept your embedded age theory then it is very logical to accept that there was no world wide flood. Noah was there and his testimony was preserved for us by Moses and to some degree by the Epic of Gilgamesh.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yet you admit that the evidence shows there was no world wide flood.

Are you kidding me?

I have never said that, and never will.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

What I say is: There is no evidence that shows a world-wide flood.

That's different from saying: Evidence shows there was no world-wide flood.

 

[Elendur]

Are you kidding me?

I have never said that, and never will.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

What I say is: There is no evidence that shows a world-wide flood.

That's different from saying: Evidence shows there was no world-wide flood.

Yes totally correct!
"Edit: Sorry, my bad. See post #94"

But there is evidence that no world-wide flood occurred.
A lot of observable objects, properties and traces would be affected by a flood that massive (ignoring whether it's violent or peaceful). Those speak against.

 

[AV1611VET]

But there is evidence that no world-wide flood occurred.

I don't believe that.

A lot of observable objects, properties and traces would be affected by a flood that massive (ignoring whether it's violent or peaceful).

Not if God placed a hedge of protection around them and/or cleaned up the mess afterward.

Take the burning bush for example.

What scientist back then would have believed Moses' account of that bush that burned, without burning up?

They would look at it and say the same thing you guys say about the Flood, viz., "This bush was never on fire, there's evidence that says otherwise."

Same with Daniel's three friends in the fiery furnace.

In fact, in that account, Daniel goes out of his way to mention there was no evidence generated.

Daniel 3:27 And the princes, governors, and captains, and the king's counsellors, being gathered together, saw these men, upon whose bodies the fire had no power, nor was an hair of their head singed, neither were their coats changed, nor the smell of fire had passed on them.

Again, you guys would say evidence shows they were not cast into that furnace.

 

[Split Rock]

How would you do that? Step right up, give the science...?


How sweet victory is.

Wow. It only took dad 10 posts to unilaterally declare victory. I'm impressed...