Existential Age vs Physical Age

[Freodin]

You mean like existential and physical?

I asked you before for the difference between these two and got a calculation instead of a definition. Yes, I can find definitions on myself, but knowing your ways with words, I can never be certain if I hit yours.

So I am asking again, without quibs and references, in your own words please: what is the definitional difference between existential and physical age?

I really would like you to answer that. Else I am left with trying to find my own definitions, work from them, and then have you accuse me of "arab phoning" you.
It is just simpler for both of us if you take the time to answer my question.

 

[Delphiki]

Put another way, the earth came into existence 6000 years ago as a 4.57 billion year old object.

Was the earth created 6000 years ago? Yes or no?

 

[Psudopod]

Originally Posted by Psudopod

Again, I disagree. The bike is new. It might have 35 year old tyres and gears and brakes, but the entity that is your bike only became a bike when you put it together. It's not 35 years old.
​

So will it last as long as a brand new bicycle, or will it last as long as a 35 year old bicycle?

It will last as long as its components last. This doesn't really have any baring on the age of the object. A rubbish bike might fall apart in a day if its made with new but poor parts.

You mean like existential and physical?

These don't really define age differently, they're just indicators that you are using to differentiate between two versions.

And you do realize that if we look at the word "age" on answers.com, it will have 5 definitiions?

And I can tell you, without looking, that it is definition #4 I'm using.

ETA: Looks like I was wrong -- it has 7 definitions; and #4 is the one I use:

1. The length of time that one has existed; duration of life: 23 years of age.
2. The time of life when a person becomes qualified to assume certain civil and personal rights and responsibilities, usually at 18 or 21 years; legal age: under age; of age.
3. One of the stages of life: the age of adolescence; at an awkward age.
4. The state of being old; old age: hair white with age.
5. often Age
   1. A period in the history of humankind marked by a distinctive characteristic or achievement: the Stone Age; the computer age.
   2. A period in the history of the earth, usually shorter than an epoch: the Ice Age.
   3. A period of time marked by the presence or influence of a dominant figure: the Elizabethan Age. See synonyms at period.
6. 1. The period of history during which a person lives: a product of his age.
   2. A generation: ages yet unborn.
7. ages Informal. An extended period of time: left ages ago.

Words have different meanings if you use them in different contexts, but you are using age in the same context but giving it two different meanings. Even above, you can pretty much classify each of those definitions as either the period something has been in existance, or a time period. The second definition doesn't work in the context we are using it.

 

[AV1611VET]

Erm, no. I've clearly labelled myself as "Agnostic".

Good, because I've clearly labeled myself "Embedded Age".

Perhaps you could show me the same courtesy you show yourself?

 

[AV1611VET]

That depends. How long do brand new bicycles last, and how long do 35 year old bicycles last? What if the new bicycle is made of old and shoddy parts but the 35 year old bicycle is pristine from sitting in storage? What if I had a 200 year-old bike that has had constant maintenance and repair?

Silliness...

Ya -- now it's time to start acting like you guys don't have enough information, isn't it?

 

[AV1611VET]

Was the earth created 6000 years ago? Yes or no?

Yes

 

[Freodin]

Yes

So you are a YEC. Because that is the foundational belief (give or take a few thousand years) of YEC.

 

[Jazer]

I don't think it's a matter of point of view, the only way you can have two different ages is by having two differenet definitions of age, which doesn't really work.

Often when they restore an old car they well be VERY meticulous. They will grind and sand everything better then the factory. So where they are done the car is better then new. Even though the car has the appearance of one that was built 35 years ago. I have heard of people that will put 25 coats of paint on the car. They sand out each and every layer. So you end up with a better looking car, but also a car that cost a lot more then the original cost to make.

I did repair and renovation work for well over 25 years. I would challenge you to find the repair. There are ways to blend the old and the new so you can not tell that a repair was ever made. In fact some people pretty much expect you to be able to do a repair in a way you can never tell it was broken or there was a problem. That is why when God does a miracle people question is there was ever a problem in the first place. He just restores everything back to His original purpose and intention.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Put another way, the earth came into existence 6000 years ago as a 4.57 billion year old object.

This makes zero sense. It is impossible for a 4.57 billion year old object to have existed for only 6000 years.

One could, perhaps, create an object that appears older than it has been around for, but it can never be older than that.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[AV1611VET]

This makes zero sense.

And walking on water does?

It is impossible for a 4.57 billion year old object to have existed for only 6000 years.

Impossible for whom?

Luke 1:37 For with God nothing shall be impossible.

One could, perhaps, create an object...

Not the way God did it -- (ex nihilo).

 

[TheReasoner]

And walking on water does?

Impossible for whom?

Luke 1:37 For with God nothing shall be impossible.

Not the way God did it -- (ex nihilo).

So - God lied?

 

[Freodin]

And walking on water does?

Impossible for whom?

Luke 1:37 For with God nothing shall be impossible.

Not the way God did it -- (ex nihilo).

Perhaps now that you are back, you can answer my question, instead of simply repeating your claims?

I understand that your you like to cover your base with "God did it".... but it would be nice if you could explain WHAT God did.


So what are your definitions for existential and physical age? I am most interested in the physical age.

 

[AV1611VET]

So what are your definitions for existential and physical age?

Existential Age = the amount of time an object has been in existence.

Physical Age = the amount of age contained in an object; how old it actually is.

 

[Freodin]

Existential Age = the amount of time an object has been in existence.

Physical Age = the amount of age contained in an object; how old it actually is.

What is "the amount of age"? What is "age" in this regard, and how would you measure it?

 

[AV1611VET]

What is "the amount of age"? What is "age" in this regard, and how would you measure it?

I'll tell you what, Freodin; I'll consider you too Socratic to understand any of this.

How's that?

 

[Eudaimonist]

And walking on water does?

Yes, it does. Some animals can do this. There's nothing logically contradictory about that.

Impossible for whom?

Impossible for anyone. As impossible as square circles.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[AV1611VET]

Yes, it does. Some animals can do this. There's nothing logically contradictory about that.

There's nothing 'logically contradictory' about two men walking on water?

(I could make this much harder, you know? like resurrecting?)

 

[Freodin]

I'll tell you what, Freodin; I'll consider you too Socratic to understand any of this.

How's that?

So I simplify the question: how would you measure this "age"?

 

[AV1611VET]

So I simplify the question: how would you measure this "age"?

Of what? the Challenger or the earth?

 

[Freodin]

Of what? the Challenger or the earth?

Whatever. In this case, you claim that the physical age of the earth is different from it's existential age.

How would you measure the physical age?

How would you measure the physical age of the car in your OP?