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Isaiah 53: A Contextual Discussion
- Thread starter muffler dragon
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Yah, and there are plenty of places in that same work you are quoting there the servant is identified as Israel. You can't have it both ways.
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hamashiachagape
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There is absolutely nothing in the Targums that identify Isaiah 53 as Israel.
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hamashiachagape
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Doesn't have to. Its quite clear what the passages are referring to.
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53:10. But it is the Lord's good pleasure to try and to purify the remnant of his people, so as to cleanse their souls from sin; these shall look on the Kingdom of their Messiah, their sons and their daughters shall be multiplied, they shall prolong their days, and those who perform the Law of the Lord shall prosper in his good pleasure.
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hamashiachagape
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Why aren't there 30,000 mashiachs named in the Tanakh from the line of David?
Out of all the candidates mentioned for this obscure mashiach being referenced, who fits the bill? I'm not concerned about Jews for Judaism taking mashiach out of context for this very reason.
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Where did you pull 30,000 from?
Anytime you see "anointed one" and it's speaking of someone who is not the future king, that's a messiah.
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Nobody has ruled as king over Israel during a time of universal peace and knowledge of God. Did I miss a news report?
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hamashiachagape
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Seriously, who in this room is going to go out of their way to state that Cyrus was from the line of David?
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I'm not changing my reply to your original quote. You want to continue to play the edit games, I'll let everybody see exactly what you are doing.
When did I suggest there would be 30,000 of then named from the line of David?
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hamashiachagape
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At the same time, part of Isaiah 61:1-2 has been fulfilled already. One of the two roles designated by the ancient rabbis has been fulfilled, and the other half will be fulfilled later. Thats what is being argued, not that all of it has been fulfilled. The intent of Yeshua is that he is fulfilling one role, then in Acts 1, its evident he's returning to fulfill the other half.
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hamashiachagape
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Well thats the problem essentially. The references of importance to us are in regards to a Mashiach from the line of David.
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hamashiachagape
Newbie
This is another reason that the stories do not appear fabricated. Had it been intended that the Gospels were to be fabricated, wouldn't it be more likely that both roles would have been fulfilled at once?
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When did I suggest otherwise?
Here's me: "Apples are a fruit, but so are oranges"
You: "Oranges?! Apples are fruit"
Me: "Yes....."
You: "Why would you suggest that apples are oranges?"
Me: "...."
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No, because the "second role" is obvious to everybody. They couldn't claim that they were living in an age of universal peace and knowledge of God when those conditions were not met.
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hamashiachagape
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More stuff has to happen than just that though...you and I both know this.
They never mentioned for instance, the Torah going forth from Zion, and also all of the Gentiles coming up to celebrate Sukkot.
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