Evolution is a Fact

[CoderHead]

It is not thinking the same thing, it is believing what is in the Bible as fact. Any translation other than the literal one is "of man", not "of God".

So any Christian who doesn't take a complete, 100% literal translation of the Bible is ... Not a True Christian™?

The side that has the most supporters wins?...that's not fact, just majority opinion.

Like Christianity?

That is what every evolution argument comes down to in the end. More scientist believe me than you.

Actually, it comes down to all of the cosmological, geological, and biological models being supported by evidence and repeatable testing. Evolution is not a product of bullying, regardless of how you may think of yourself as the underdog hero.

 

[AV1611VET]

No it's not. You said you would question their salvation because they are going against the bible. Where does the bible say you should deny God's handiwork?

This is what he said, Psudopod:

I would question their salvation, which the Scripture tells me to do anytime someone claims to be Christian but has views that go against what is in the Bible. Maybe, they are saved but it is just a "kink", a man thought, that needs to be worked out...or it could be that they are lying to both God and themselves.

I would pray for them just like I do for all of you.

What's wrong with questioning a person's salvation to see if they're saved or not?

We do it as a matter of routine, just before we baptize them.

We ask, "Have you accepted Jesus Christ as your personal Savior?"

And before we send a missionary out on the field, believe me, more than his salvation gets questioned.

 

[Belk]

I would question their salvation, which the Scripture tells me to do anytime someone claims to be Christian but has views that go against what is in the Bible. Maybe, they are saved but it is just a "kink", a man thought, that needs to be worked out...or it could be that they are lying to both God and themselves.

I would pray for them just like I do for all of you.

Or, just possibly, you could be wrong and evolution is in fact true. Which might explain the fact of how it has survived in the highly competitive world of scientific ideas for a couple hundred years. Just a thought.

 

[AV1611VET]

Or, just possibly, you could be wrong and evolution is in fact true. Which might explain the fact of how it has survived in the highly competitive world of scientific ideas for a couple hundred years. Just a thought.

Aristotle stunted the growth of science for 2000 years.

 

[jpcedotal]

So any Christian who doesn't take a complete, 100% literal translation of the Bible is ... Not a True Christian™?

That is not what I am saying. I ,personally, do not know everything that is stated or revealed in the Bible AND I, personally, still have some vague areas to work out......yet I am a Christian.

I can have some things wrong, and still be a Christian, but the Bible is the only place to find the right answers and the Bible CLEARLY makes a separation between man and everything else.

Creation is the foundation that everything else is built on. A Christian who does not have this right starts of with the wrong view of God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

 

[jpcedotal]

Or, just possibly, you could be wrong and evolution is in fact true. Which might explain the fact of how it has survived in the highly competitive world of scientific ideas for a couple hundred years. Just a thought.

The Bible tells me I am right and that is all the proof I need.

 

[Nathan Poe]

And there is the final argument....when all else fails, go personal. I have no problem remaining the "ignorant fool", when it come to evolution. Don't mind me, I will be standing over here with Jesus.

I'm sure he could use a good laugh too.

God Bless and I hope you have not run out of chances to come to know Jesus Christ. I found out the hard way that you don't get to choose the "when".

You know, a lot of the people here who accept evolution are already well acquainted with Jesus Christ.

 

[CoderHead]

That is not what I am saying. I ,personally, do not know everything that is stated or revealed in the Bible AND I, personally, still have some vague areas to work out......yet I am a Christian.

Then it's feasible - since you don't know everything revealed in the Bible - that the Bible actually agrees with evolution and our scientific pursuits, yes?

I can have some things wrong, and still be a Christian, but the Bible is the only place to find the right answers and the Bible CLEARLY makes a separation between man and everything else.

No it doesn't. It says God formed man from the dust of the Earth. To me, that clearly marks a connection with the Earth (and possibly every other living thing). Since you openly admit that you could be wrong, don't you think this is a fair appraisal?

A Christian who does not have this right starts of with the wrong view of God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

And how does one become certain, beyond a reasonable doubt, that your view is the right one in light of differing opinions within Bible-believing Christians?

 

[Nathan Poe]

Aristotle stunted the growth of science for 2000 years.

True, he was a creationist -- but let's not hold that mistake against him.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Creation is the foundation that everything else is built on.

Jesus who?

 

[TerranceL]

Hawk007, no use trying. These cats are more closed minded than we Christians are. They will always discredit any facts that contradict them.

YEAH MAN THESE CATS ARE CRAZY BRO! I MEAN LOOK HOW THEY ATTACK THE FACTS THAT WE PROVIDE, EVEN THE WRONG ONES.

WHAT ARE THEY THINKING?

 

[jpcedotal]

Then it's feasible - since you don't know everything revealed in the Bible - that the Bible actually agrees with evolution and our scientific pursuits, yes?

God commanded the water and the earth to bring forth other creatures: but of man he says, "Let us make..." Man is not made in the likeness of any of the creatures already made, but as near as could be in the image of God.

No it doesn't. It says God formed man from the dust of the Earth. To me, that clearly marks a connection with the Earth (and possibly every other living thing). Since you openly admit that you could be wrong, don't you think this is a fair appraisal?

Man did not become a living being until God breathed into him. The body formed from the dirt was nothing more than molded clay. Man is more than dust because God "breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul." This is what separates man from all other creatures that are found in God's universe.

"...no form of evolutionary theory can account for human speech, it cannot account for human conscience, and it cannot account for human individuality..."(Dr Vernon McGee)

And how does one become certain, beyond a reasonable doubt, that your view is the right one in light of differing opinions within Bible-believing Christians?

Beyond a reasonable doubt.....hmmm. The only way to put evolution into the Bible is to ADD it. There is not a single verse to back evolution, only perceived skips (there aren't any btw, that is man-made also) that evolution can be inserted into. That is why I have no doubt that evolution is fiction.

I changed fonts cause I wanted to make sure that my responses were separated correctly.

 

[TheReasoner]

And there is the final argument....when all else fails, go personal. I have no problem remaining the "ignorant fool", when it come to evolution. Don't mind me, I will be standing over here with Jesus.

God Bless and I hope you have not run out of chances to come to know Jesus Christ. I found out the hard way that you don't get to choose the "when".

But jpcedotal, so they said when Copernicus revealed that the earth was not the center of the universe. They said the same thing when the static nature of the universe was challenged and dynamic existence was revealed.

Jesus has nothing to do with this. You may believe your position is divinely ordained just like the pharisees did, but that doesn't make it so. In fact the bible teaches us to be humble, a quality you do not now reveal. You are not saved because you believe the world was created six thousand years ago. That is not a condition of salvation. It may be if you become a member of some (even more) twisted form of gnosticism considering that a vital truth/password, but as for Christ's blood... It saves us by grace. Not by belief in something that goes against what God's own creation tells us.

You say God spoke the universe into being. So why does even basic studies of it reveal it is older than you say your interpretation demands? People have always been sure their interpretation of the bible is the only one. It is based on this some groups have made predictions considering Jesus' return time and time again. Only He never has come again, has He? Instead of facing up to that fact said group now insists He did come - only remained invisible. Facing up to one's assumptions being wrong is a tough process. Could kill your faith if you aren't humble and seek God first and your own thoughts second. Sorry to say so friend, but you don't really show a lot of humility. You elevate your own position to that of God. You cannot conceive of being wrong. Just like the people who burned witches were sure they were right. Or the ones who insisted the earth was the center of the universe. Such arrogance! Now you're saying everything revolves around humanity. Easily said. But if we really were to think so, why isn't it mirrored in creation?
And before you say "God wants to test our faith", let me add that if you make that claim you're calling God a liar by extension. Is that (lying) even possible for God? Why would He do it? He loves us, so it stands to reason He wouldn't try to deceive us and push us into Satan's snares, doesn't it? So why do you so arrogantly stick by your human interpretation when it can be wrong, just like the people who thought God told them to kill strange women, or people who thought the Bible said the world was the centre of the universe?!Are you so sure you got it right while all the others before you got it all wrong?

 

[jpcedotal]

Jesus who?

Yeah, I understand there are atheists on this thread and I know this argument falls short with that line of thinking, but Jesus Christ is my Savior and I will not deny Him.

 

[Sanguis]

Beyond a reasonable doubt.....hmmm. The only way to put evolution into the Bible is to ADD it. There is not a single verse to back evolution, only perceived skips (there aren't any btw, that is man-made also) that evolution can be inserted into. That is why I have no doubt that evolution is fiction.

But then, evidence > scripture.

 

[TheReasoner]

Beyond a reasonable doubt.....hmmm. The only way to put evolution into the Bible is to ADD it. There is not a single verse to back evolution, only perceived skips (there aren't any btw, that is man-made also) that evolution can be inserted into. That is why I have no doubt that evolution is fiction.

I changed fonts cause I wanted to make sure that my responses were separated correctly.

Okay.... jpc, point one: It is clear through both what happened when Adam and Eve sinned and what happened when Jesus died on the cross that the death spoken of in Genesis and concerning what Jesus defeated was spiritual death, not physical death. Therefore it is a logical extension that the life God breathed into us was our soul, our spiritual life. Our likeness to Him. You don't think we're like Him in that we have two eyes and a nose, do you? It's clearly our ability to reason, our ability to love, to think, to analyze and to create. That is the image of God. We aren't separated from animals by what we eat, by what makes up our bodies or how we reproduce. It's how we think and act that makes the difference. That's where God's touch is visible.

You don't have to add anything or take anything away for evolution to fit into the bible. You just have to stop interpreting a few verses the way you do, look at it more holistically and take God's creation into account. He created everything around us. And it can teach us a lot. It taught us that we were wrong in interpreting the bible in a way that made us believe in a flat earth. It also taught us that interpreting the bible in a way that makes the earth the center of the entire universe is wrong. And it taught us that your interpretation of genesis is wrong. It doesn't make genesis wrong. It doesn't invalidate the bible. It merely means we are human and can make mistakes.
Which is pretty evident even when people get prophesies from God. They are very often diluted or misunderstood by prophet or recipient alike. Even though the message was from God.

 

[TheReasoner]

Yeah, I understand there are atheists on this thread and I know this argument falls short with that line of thinking, but Jesus Christ is my Savior and I will not deny Him.

I think you misunderstood his argument. He was trying to point out that the foundation of Christianity is Jesus, not creationism.

 

[jpcedotal]

Jesus has nothing to do with this. ...In fact the bible teaches us to be humble, a quality you do not now reveal. You are not saved because you believe the world was created six thousand years ago. That is not a condition of salvation. It may be if you become a member of some (even more) twisted form of gnosticism considering that a vital truth/password, but as for Christ's blood... It saves us by grace. Not by belief in something that goes against what God's own creation tells us.

Jesus has everything to do with everything. The Bible is the story of Jesus. Jesus can be found in every book of the Bible.

What is being humble? Not standing up for God and His Word? Just going along with whatever man says to true without question?

I never said anything about salvation, only what the Bible says and doesn't say.

You say God spoke the universe into being. So why does even basic studies of it reveal it is older than you say your interpretation demands? People have always been sure their interpretation of the bible is the only one. It is based on this some groups have made predictions considering Jesus' return time and time again. Only He never has come again, has He? Instead of facing up to that fact said group now insists He did come - only remained invisible. Facing up to one's assumptions being wrong is a tough process. Could kill your faith if you aren't humble and seek God first and your own thoughts second. Sorry to say so friend, but you don't really show a lot of humility. You elevate your own position to that of God. You cannot conceive of being wrong. Just like the people who burned witches were sure they were right. Or the ones who insisted the earth was the center of the universe. Such arrogance! Now you're saying everything revolves around humanity. Easily said. But if we really were to think so, why isn't it mirrored in creation?

Can your God bring into existence a 4 million year old rock in a blink? My God can. Was Adam born or created? If the Universe is infinite then why can't the Earth be in the center? Has there been other life discovered yet besides what is on earth?

And before you say "God wants to test our faith", let me add that if you make that claim you're calling God a liar by extension. Is that (lying) even possible for God? Why would He do it? He loves us, so it stands to reason He wouldn't try to deceive us and push us into Satan's snares, doesn't it? So why do you so arrogantly stick by your human interpretation when it can be wrong, just like the people who thought God told them to kill strange women, or people who thought the Bible said the world was the centre of the universe?!Are you so sure you got it right while all the others before you got it all wrong?

Since I didn't say it, then I guess I ain't a liar...at least where that is concerned. <staff edit>

2Ti 2:23-26
(23) But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels.
(24) The Lord's bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged,
(25) with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,
(26) and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will.

I do agree that this is something I have to work on in my Christian walk.

 

[Tenka]

Is it not so that everything can be evidence for the existence of the Creator?
For there is only one Creator?

Everything being evidence is the same as nothing being evidence.

 

[Cabal]

Jesus has everything to do with everything.

Didn't you just say it was creation a second ago? Make your mind up.

What is being humble? Not standing up for God and His Word? Just going along with whatever man says to true without question?

Mildly ironic that you make the assumption this is what faithguardian is doing and then go on to call him hateful.

I never said anything about salvation, only what the Bible says and doesn't say.

According to your personal interpretation, and besides that's not true, you said you would question a TE's salvation.

Since I didn't say it, then I guess I ain't a liar...at least where that is concerned.

Maybe not there, but you certainly did here:

Can your God bring into existence a 4 million year old rock in a blink? My God can.

__________________________________________

Was Adam born or created?

Birth is a form of creation, in case you hadn't noticed.

If the Universe is infinite then why can't the Earth be in the center?

Because it would be infinite

However, it's not infinite, so I guess we can overlook that little woopsie

Has there been other life discovered yet besides what is on earth?

Not yet.

Maybe, I am not showing much humility, but you sir are spewing hate.

So good of you to testify to the first half of that sentence with the second half.