Homosexuality

[Floatingaxe]

Sorry, but no; there's no passage of Scripture which uses the phrase "the Word of God" (or "the Word of the Lord") to clearly and unambiguously refer to Scripture.

Similarly, nowhere does Scripture refer to Scripture as inerrant or infallible.

It does describe itself as theopneustos and useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness.

But not as the Word of God.

David.

Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is alive and powerful. It is sharper than the sharpest two-edged sword, cutting between soul and spirit, between joint and marrow. It exposes our innermost thoughts and desires.


This is in reference to the word of God, written and spoken...notice the "it".

 

[David Brider]

Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is alive and powerful. It is sharper than the sharpest two-edged sword, cutting between soul and spirit, between joint and marrow. It exposes our innermost thoughts and desires.


This is in reference to the word of written and spoken...notice the "it".

Where does it say anything about the word being written? Not in that verse, and not in the surrounding verses either.

David.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Where does it say anything about the word being written? Not in that verse, and not in the surrounding verses either.

David.

Sure, where in the word is Jesus called an it? It is the spoken word of God, actually, in reference here. Someone wrote it down for us...good idea, that!

 

[David Brider]

As the Apostles regard Scripture as inerrant and vital, and the word of God, so should we.

Could you give me chapter and verse where the apostles describe Scripture as inerrant, vital, and/or the Word of God? I've not been able to find any.

David.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Could you give me chapter and verse where the apostles describe Scripture as inerrant, vital, and/or the Word of God? I've not been able to find any.

David.

2 Peter 1:16-21
For we were not making up clever stories when we told you about the powerful coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. We saw his majestic splendor with our own eyes when he received honor and glory from God the Father. The voice from the majestic glory of God said to him, “This is my dearly loved Son, who brings me great joy.” We ourselves heard that voice from heaven when we were with him on the holy mountain.
Because of that experience, we have even greater confidence in the message proclaimed by the prophets. You must pay close attention to what they wrote, for their words are like a lamp shining in a dark place—until the Day dawns, and Christ the Morning Star shines in your hearts. Above all, you must realize that no prophecy in Scripture ever came from the prophet’s own understanding, or from human initiative. No, those prophets were moved by the Holy Spirit, and they spoke from God.



There is nothing more vital and inerrant as that! If it was good enough for the Apostles, it is more than enough for me. You must have faith. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.


Romans 10:17
So faith comes by hearing [what is told], and what is heard comes by the preaching [of the message that came from the lips] of Christ (the Messiah Himself).

 

[David Brider]

Do think it may be the word of god as interpretted by man?

Or man's interpretation of god without god's influence?

I'm really interested in your opinion on this

I believe that it's inspired by God, God-breathed (theopneustos) as Paul wrote to Timothy. But when people start saying it's "The Word of God" or "Inerrant" or "Infallible" - none of which are claims that the writers of Scripture ever made about Scripture - I find myself getting a bit uncomfortable, 'cos it seems it's putting Scripture in a position it was never intended to have. Also, there are areas where Scripture appears to contradict itself. To believe that it's this inerrant, infallible, perfect book, one has to just ignore those contradictions, and - I've seen it happen - it gets to be a bit of a "sticking one's fingers in one's ears" thing; "La la la, I can't hear you," sort of a thing. Whereas if one doesn't have that sort of high belief of the Bible, it's just a case of, "oh, apparent contradiction or error, never mind, move on to the next verse."

FWIW, I believe "The Word of God" (or "The Word of the Lord") is God speaking to us directly (cf 1 Samuel 3), and whilst the Bible certainly captures some of that (on many occasions, after all, it records God's speech, and even allowing for lapses of memory on the part of the writers I believe that it's likely that they've recorded the general thrust of the message, if not necessarily the precise words), I think that the Word of God is so much more than a mere book can ever be.

David.

 

[David Brider]

2 Peter 1:16-21
For we were not making up clever stories when we told you about the powerful coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. We saw his majestic splendor with our own eyes when he received honor and glory from God the Father. The voice from the majestic glory of God said to him, “This is my dearly loved Son, who brings me great joy.” We ourselves heard that voice from heaven when we were with him on the holy mountain.
Because of that experience, we have even greater confidence in the message proclaimed by the prophets. You must pay close attention to what they wrote, for their words are like a lamp shining in a dark place—until the Day dawns, and Christ the Morning Star shines in your hearts. Above all, you must realize that no prophecy in Scripture ever came from the prophet’s own understanding, or from human initiative. No, those prophets were moved by the Holy Spirit, and they spoke from God.



There is nothing more vital and inerrant as that! If it was good enough for the Apostles, it is more than enough for me. You must have faith. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.


Romans 10:17
So faith comes by hearing [what is told], and what is heard comes by the preaching [of the message that came from the lips] of Christ (the Messiah Himself).

But nowhere in any of those passages is Scripture ever described as "the Word of God", or as "inerrant" or "infallible". (I've done a check - in the NIV, at least, the words inerrant and infallible don't appear at all.)

David.

 

[Floatingaxe]

But nowhere in any of those passages is Scripture ever described as "the Word of God", or as "inerrant" or "infallible". (I've done a check - in the NIV, at least, the words inerrant and infallible don't appear at all.)

David.

So? It is the word of God, and His word is always infallible. Stop looking at the hole and look at the doughnut. It's not just a mere book--it is God speaking to us.

Stop trying to lead people away from God. Do you know Jesus Christ as your personal Saviour and Lord?

Or is this your pet issue?

 

[Brieuse]

2 Peter 1:16-21
For we were not making up clever stories when we told you about the powerful coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. We saw his majestic splendor with our own eyes when he received honor and glory from God the Father. The voice from the majestic glory of God said to him, “This is my dearly loved Son, who brings me great joy.” We ourselves heard that voice from heaven when we were with him on the holy mountain.
Because of that experience, we have even greater confidence in the message proclaimed by the prophets. You must pay close attention to what they wrote, for their words are like a lamp shining in a dark place—until the Day dawns, and Christ the Morning Star shines in your hearts. Above all, you must realize that no prophecy in Scripture ever came from the prophet’s own understanding, or from human initiative. No, those prophets were moved by the Holy Spirit, and they spoke from God.



There is nothing more vital and inerrant as that! If it was good enough for the Apostles, it is more than enough for me. You must have faith. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.


Romans 10:17
So faith comes by hearing [what is told], and what is heard comes by the preaching [of the message that came from the lips] of Christ (the Messiah Himself).

jirre

2Pe 1:16¶For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

2Pe 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
Prophecy of scripture by prophets of the coming of the Messiah.

Talk about out of context.

 

[Floatingaxe]

jirre

2Pe 1:16¶For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

2Pe 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
Prophecy of scripture by prophets of the coming of the Messiah.

Talk about out of context.

There is nothing out of context.

 

[David Brider]

So? It is the word of God...

If it is, then why doesn't it say so?

Stop trying to lead people away from God.

Why on earth would you think I'm trying to do that?

Do you know Jesus Christ as your personal Saviour and Lord?

Yes.

Or is this your pet issue?

It's one of several issues that concern me.

David.

 

[Floatingaxe]

If it is, then why doesn't it say so?

Do you need spoonfeeding? Yes, it's the word of God, inspired and perfect for our waiting, hungry hearts.

Why on earth would you think I'm trying to do that?

You are devaluing the bible.

Yes.

Well, good!

It's one of several issues that concern me.

We have to be careful about bringing our issues here frequently, as there are people who are on the fence about Christ and need nothing more than a push from someone else's doubt to send them off the fence and into disbelief...and we all know where that leads. We are to be evangelizing, foremost, don't you think?

 

[artybloke]

The library we call the bible is a lot older than 2000 years.

Riiighttttt.... between 3000 & 2000 years old to be accurate.

As the Apostles regard Scripture as inerrant and vital

"Useful" is the word that the non-Pauline author of 2Timothy said. "Vital" is a possible interpretation. But none of the apostles, nor any of the other writers in the New Testament ever call it inerrant. Nor do they treat the Bible as "literal."

 

[Floatingaxe]

Riiighttttt.... between 3000 & 2000 years old to be accurate.



"Useful" is the word that the non-Pauline author of 2Timothy said. "Vital" is a possible interpretation. But none of the apostles, nor any of the other writers in the New Testament ever call it inerrant. Nor do they treat the Bible as "literal."

Their writings are inerrant and we take them literally as the inspired word of God. Nothing less.

 

[artybloke]

Continue worshipping the Bible then. As for me and my house, we will go with the Lord.

 

[Ohioprof]

Do you need spoonfeeding? Yes, it's the word of God, inspired and perfect for our waiting, hungry hearts.




You are devaluing the bible.



Well, good!



We have to be careful about bringing our issues here frequently, as there are people who are on the fence about Christ and need nothing more than a push from someone else's doubt to send them off the fence and into disbelief...and we all know where that leads. We are to be evangelizing, foremost, don't you think?

Yeah, it might lead people actually to think! For themselves! With the brains that God gave them!

 

[Ohioprof]

Continue worshipping the Bible then. As for me and my house, we will go with the Lord.

Good post. Bravo.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Continue worshipping the Bible then. As for me and my house, we will go with the Lord.

Don't be ridiculous! I believe as Christians do, that Jesus Christ is Lord, and the Bible is God's Word. We don't worship any book. We worship God alone and we read His word to us for spiritual food as we ought and for spiritual enlightenment as the Holy Spirit reveals to us.

You really do have a problem. God is not pleased by your tangential issue.

 

[Ohioprof]

Don't be ridiculous! I believe as Christians do, that Jesus Christ is Lord, and the Bible is God's Word. We don't worship any book. We worship God alone and we read His word to us for spiritual food as we ought and for spiritual enlightenment as the Holy Spirit reveals to us.

You really do have a problem. God is not pleased by your tangental issue.

There you go claiming to know the mind of God again.

 

[Floatingaxe]

There you go claiming to know the mind of God again.

Spirit-filled Christians make it a habit to know. He has told us we have the mind of Christ.

If you believed the bible and believed in Jesus Christ and what He tells you, you'd know that, but as you consider your "faith" as some sort of smorgasbord, you miss the gems of real truth that Jesus came to give us...that teach us how to live righteously. What a waste.