This Is My Fireproof Thread

[hijklmnop]

If I recall right, you quit the book just like I did. You then went on to state that you had "bigger-fish-to-fry" than a marriage to-do list.

Does that to-do list include coming onto a board talking about "Fireproof" to tell other women's husbands what they should have got out of the movie?

No, thanks for the incredibly patronizing and ignorant assumption...it had to do with my h being released from the psych ward and me finding out shortly afterwards of his multiple affairs. Excuse me for not keeping up with the daily exercises.

 

[JaneFW]

Anyways, you seem to be under the impression that men who are sexually tempted/unfaithful are that way because their wives were disobedient. Let me just say, being a freak in the sheets kinda wife does NOT guarantee you that your husband will not still be tempted by the world around him...for sex addicts in particular....it's NEVER enough.

I don't think you are very educated on sex addiction TBH. I think you're making a lot of assumptions based on your personal beliefs. My h didn't engage in his addiction to medicate a power struggle between myself and him. His addiction started in childhood and grew over the years as it was untreated. I do not feel responsible one bit for it, just as it would not be HIS fault if I went out and cheated on him tonight.,.and just as he is not responsible for whatever issues I've struggle with for much of my life. We each have our own free will.

Indeed.

My h's addiction to porn started when he was 15. He had sex for the first time at that age too.

Many men have posted here about porn addictions and others across the internet, and in books and on websites, can testify that porn addiction is not linked to what they are receiving sexually from their wives.

I don't know whether that's true for women addicted to pornography. I haven't done any research.

 

[Mrs. Luther073082]

Luther ... where's Melissa?

I miss her reasoned postings ....

She avoids debate threads when she can.

There is no reason in this thread. Maybe at some point there was, but it is far gone now. This thread is nuts. People are just arguing to argue and people on both sides are sinking lower and lower. The guy below wins the thread, IMO.

Originally Posted by technofox
No offense to you all, but this whole thread is pathetic and deviates far and wide from what the OP was trying to discuss.

I can quickly summarize most of the arguments I have seen here:

1. Its like a Lifetime channel movie where the guy is a jerk and the woman is an innocent fawn that justifies her actions via her emotions that seem rational at the surface. The guy must change and become her servant and all is well.

2. Its about two selfish people who can't communicate and understand each other's needs without Christ coming into their lives and guide them to show each other love via Christ like actions.

3. Its just movie that inspires me to be a better husband/wife.

Ok so with that out of the way, my take is that both individuals were unloving towards one another and need Christ to guide them. For all we know the wife was withholding sex and the husband went to porn. There is no real history as to how they got from being in love enough to get married and what led the both of them to their current problems. Most of the arguments here are based upon pure speculation and assumptions. In a nutshell I can't believe the dissention here.

You know what I have learned about marriage?

You can do everything in that movie and love dare book, but it takes two to make it work. I spent a lot of money, even went into debt to try to save my marriage, because I loved my wife, but her actions expressed no matter how loving I could be to her they were never good enough. She basically used the threat of divorce as a way to get what she wants and eventually she used it try to control me, because she knew that it was something that I did not want. Eventually she tried to financially screw through NY's legal system by lying and manipulating me into thinking we were going to do an amicable divorce; however, it backfired on her big time and I ended up filing first after coming to peace with God over the divorce itself. If you want to know more, then please read all of my threads about my terrible marriage, because there is a lot more to it.

Caleb had gone through a similar problem, until he finally gave all he had to help his wife's mother without any expectation of her coming back to him. Fortunately for him it worked, because something inside her made her feel love towards him again. Basically she made decisions based upon emotions and not rational thought until the end. In the end love won.

In the real world sometimes this does not happen, because no matter how loving one person can be to another, it may not be enough to save a marriage. Is a marriage worth saving?

Yes it is. I walked away knowing that I did try to save my marriage and with God's peace in regards to letting him deal with the divorce it helped a lot. The only thing I would have done different was to not go into debt to save my marriage, because I got stuck paying for it.

I also learned a lot about Christ like relationships. Basically Jesus' mentioning the golden rule and everything else in the Bible about marriage holds true:

Do unto others what you want others to do unto you.
Do not withhold sex, except for an agreed upon time.

Love your wife as Christ love the church and wives submit to your husbands. Basically for us guys follow what the bible says, basically man up and be assertive when you know your wife is wrong about something and you are right (e.g. the bible says something is right and you as the husband are standing up for it). Women ditto.

Only mutual love and respect, and understanding will make a marriage successful. Marriage is a life long commitment of friendship. Its the relationship where two people work towards fulfilling 1 Corinthians 13:4-8, for that passage explains what love truly is in a nutshell.

Ok let the rebuttals begin ;-P

IBTL

That is all, Kthanxbye.

 

[I Art Laughing]

So I don't LOVE my h because I expect him to be faithful to me? That's ridiculous. I love him like crazy, and I hope to high heavens our marriage lasts for the rest of our lives. However, I will not commit to stay "no matter what"...even Jesus doesn't ask that of me (HE's the one who said divorce is allowed in cases of adultery). I don't love him less because I won't stay while he cheats on me relentlessly or abuses me, nor would I expect the same of him were I to do those things.

I've committed to be obedient to Christ. I go where He leads, if He leads me out of an abusive relationship then I will go. I am his servant, I don't get to decide for myself.

I was abused by my father. He beat my mother and I regularly. As far back as I remember he tortured me. He would suffocate me, suspend me from high places, shake me, confine me to very small spaces and grab my ankles and fling me. Whenever he got that "look" in his eyes I would start get an anxiety attack. He got that look in his eyes when he wanted to "teach me" to tie my shoes at age 5. After I had my anxiety attack he became frustrated and started swinging on me and my mother. I ran, he grabbed me by my ankles and spun me until I had blood shooting out of my nose. I still have anxiety attacks (though rare now, thank you Jesus) when I'm in certain situations.

I had a similar experience when I was 17 when he kicked me around our front yard. I forgave him that day. I also realized that day (with the help of Godly counsel) that MY HEART wasn't right and I apologized to my dad. It didn't change him but it changed me, starting that day. Christ moved me out of that situation soon afterwards. If my mother had been obedient I'm sure we would have left much much earlier...but hey, I've forgiven her too.

I don't get to decide who to forgive, or how I'm going to be obedient. I have one option obedience to Christ or rebellion. I have no "rights".

 

[Tannic]

Indeed.

My h's addiction to porn started when he was 15. He had sex for the first time at that age too.

Many men have posted here about porn addictions and others across the internet, and in books and on websites, can testify that porn addiction is not linked to what they are receiving sexually from their wives.

I don't know whether that's true for women addicted to pornography. I haven't done any research.

Have you figure this out or anyone?

 

[technofox]

Well said, Techno. Your entire post was great, but this is an especially great "nutshell" statement. Good to "hear" from you.

Hi mkgal1! Same here. Its been a while, but I am glad to be plugged back in.

To everyone else,

Why are you still arguing?

 

[hijklmnop]

I've committed to be obedient to Christ. I go where He leads, if He leads me out of an abusive relationship then I will go. I am his servant, I don't get to decide for myself.

I was abused by my father. He beat my mother and I regularly. As far back as I remember he tortured me. He would suffocate me, suspend me from high places, shake me, confine me to very small spaces and grab my ankles and fling me. Whenever he got that "look" in his eyes I would start get an anxiety attack. He got that look in his eyes when he wanted to "teach me" to tie my shoes at age 5. After I had my anxiety attack he became frustrated and started swinging on me and my mother. I ran, he grabbed me by my ankles and spun me until I had blood shooting out of my nose. I still have anxiety attacks (though rare now, thank you Jesus) when I'm in certain situations.

I had a similar experience when I was 17 when he kicked me around our front yard. I forgave him that day. I also realized that day (with the help of Godly counsel) that MY HEART wasn't right and I apologized to my dad. It didn't change him but it changed me, starting that day. Christ moved me out of that situation soon afterwards. If my mother had been obedient I'm sure we would have left much much earlier...but hey, I've forgiven her too.

I don't get to decide who to forgive, or how I'm going to be obedient. I have one option obedience to Christ or rebellion. I have no "rights".

Why is your option to leave if that's where you believe God is leading you OK and my having the same option called "disobedience" and "lack of love and commitment" by you? I'm confused by the double standard....?

Also, I never said forgiveness was optional. Just reconciliation.

 

[JaneFW]

So, IAL, if your wife cheated on you with your best friend, I mean literally having sex, and you discovered that she had been online on dating websites, and flirting with men, having sexual conversations with men, setting up to meet them, and using porn, and when you tried to take her to task - to sharpen her - she refused to listen, you would be able to get right past that? You wouldn't think that perhaps a separation at least might be in order until she got herself straight, gave up the other man, and showed you she was willing to be fully reconciled to you? If she did not, if she continued her sinful behavior, you would be content to live with her?

This is hard to answer when you havent been there. It's easy to glibly say that you would follow God, but when you are actually in that moment, knowing that your spouse has betrayed you not once, but regularly, how do you think that moment of betrayal would play out? Tell me exactly how that would look.

 

[JaneFW]

Have you figure this out or anyone?

Eh?

 

[JaneFW]

I've committed to be obedient to Christ. I go where He leads, if He leads me out of an abusive relationship then I will go. I am his servant, I don't get to decide for myself.

I was abused by my father. He beat my mother and I regularly. As far back as I remember he tortured me. He would suffocate me, suspend me from high places, shake me, confine me to very small spaces and grab my ankles and fling me. Whenever he got that "look" in his eyes I would start get an anxiety attack. He got that look in his eyes when he wanted to "teach me" to tie my shoes at age 5. After I had my anxiety attack he became frustrated and started swinging on me and my mother. I ran, he grabbed me by my ankles and spun me until I had blood shooting out of my nose. I still have anxiety attacks (though rare now, thank you Jesus) when I'm in certain situations.

I had a similar experience when I was 17 when he kicked me around our front yard. I forgave him that day. I also realized that day (with the help of Godly counsel) that MY HEART wasn't right and I apologized to my dad. It didn't change him but it changed me, starting that day. Christ moved me out of that situation soon afterwards. If my mother had been obedient I'm sure we would have left much much earlier...but hey, I've forgiven her too.

I don't get to decide who to forgive, or how I'm going to be obedient. I have one option obedience to Christ or rebellion. I have no "rights".

I'm sorry that you were abused. There are several here who I know can identify with the trauma you experienced. I really am truly sorry. That you could forgive your dad is pretty amazing stuff. Good for you.

 

[JaneFW]

Have you figure this out or anyone?

If you mean how it is not linked to the sex life with the wife. No, I haven't figured it out, but Chaz wrote about it a lot when he posted here. You could search for his posts. He was a reformed porn addict and he had all the insights. It's an addiction to a specific form of release I think - maybe - can't remember. He was one of those who consistently argued that the porn use of the husband does not reflect on what the wife is doing for him sexually. There are also reams of it out there on the internet.

 

[I Art Laughing]

No, thanks for the incredibly patronizing and ignorant assumption...it had to do with my h being released from the psych ward and me finding out shortly afterwards of his multiple affairs. Excuse me for not keeping up with the daily exercises.

You're welcome. So why are you here?

 

[Tannic]

If you mean how it is not linked to the sex life with the wife. No, I haven't figured it out, but Chaz wrote about it a lot when he posted here. You could search for his posts. He was a reformed porn addict and he had all the insights. It's an addiction to a specific form of release I think - maybe - can't remember. He was one of those who consistently argued that the porn use of the husband does not reflect on what the wife is doing for him sexually. There are also reams of it out there on the internet.

Wow that's an interesting fact about Chaz and he is correct in a way but it's way more than just release.

 

[I Art Laughing]

Why is your option to leave if that's where you believe God is leading you OK and my having the same option called "disobedience" and "lack of love and commitment" by you? I'm confused by the double standard....?

Also, I never said forgiveness was optional. Just reconciliation.

If God is leading we like to call that obedience. If not it is rebellion, which is as the "sin of witchcraft".

Clear it up any?

 

[I Art Laughing]

So, IAL, if your wife cheated on you with your best friend, I mean literally having sex, and you discovered that she had been online on dating websites, and flirting with men, having sexual conversations with men, setting up to meet them, and using porn, and when you tried to take her to task - to sharpen her - she refused to listen, you would be able to get right past that? You wouldn't think that perhaps a separation at least might be in order until she got herself straight, gave up the other man, and showed you she was willing to be fully reconciled to you? If she did not, if she continued her sinful behavior, you would be content to live with her?

This is hard to answer when you havent been there. It's easy to glibly say that you would follow God, but when you are actually in that moment, knowing that your spouse has betrayed you not once, but regularly, how do you think that moment of betrayal would play out? Tell me exactly how that would look.

One thing I'm not lacking in JaneFW is introspection. I shared a bit of my testimony in a post above, so I have some non-specific insight.

It would be brutal. And I would have a hard time finding peace. I'm sorry if I've come off "glib". If she persisted in separating herself from me through her actions we would end up in divorce.

You painted a trajectory of divorce. What if she is repentant?

Ever read the book of Hosea?

It's not about how hard it is. I've been through hard. It's about being obedient.

 

[JaneFW]

One thing I'm not lacking in JaneFW is introspection. I shared a bit of my testimony in a post above, so I have some non-specific insight.

It would be brutal. And I would have a hard time finding peace. I'm sorry if I've come off "glib". If she persisted in separating herself from me through her actions we would end up in divorce.

You painted a trajectory of divorce. What if she is repentant?

Ever read the book of Hosea?

It's not about how hard it is. I've been through hard. It's about being obedient.

I did mention about reconciliation. I didn't close the door in my post.

I combined RL experiences of two women who post here in my post, but there are others with similar experiences. These women are all still married to those spouses. So you don't need to lecture anyone about "hard". We know there are hardships and we've gotten through them.

 

[I Art Laughing]

I did mention about reconciliation. I didn't close the door in my post.

I combined RL experiences of two women who post here in my post, but there are others with similar experiences. These women are all still married to those spouses. So you don't need to lecture anyone about "hard". We know there are hardships and we've gotten through them.

I was lecturing? I thought I was empathizing.

I'm not for women "sticking it out" or women divorcing (or men for that matter). My mom "stuck it out" and I believe she did it in her own strength (weakness) not out of obedience. Staying married is not necessarily a virtue, commitment and obedience to God are.

You don't get a special halo or bragging rights for putting up with a crappy marriage, doing that doesn't make you "SuperSpouse". You don't suddenly become the adult in the relationship. Again,you are either obedient to Christ or you are not.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
(Eph 2:8-10)

 

[hijklmnop]

You're welcome. So why are you here?

Why are you so incredibly rude and insensitive in your above reply? ^^^ That attitude is exactly the kind of response sharing any sort of vulnerability with this particular audience will get you, apparently.

I'm here (a year and a half after the aforementioned crisis) to help my sisters in Christ (who, like me, know more about all this subject matter than we ever wanted to know) refute the lies, twisted teachings and false assumptions I'm seeing in this thread. I don't believe those things should go unchallenged lest others read it and think it's truth, and stay trapped in the kind of situation I used to be stuck in.

 

[hijklmnop]

If God is leading we like to call that obedience. If not it is rebellion, which is as the "sin of witchcraft".

Clear it up any?

No. You didn't answer the question as to why it's okay for you to have those options but you judged me for having the same (called it lack of commitment and lack of love).

 

[Mrs. Luther073082]

I never saw the movie. Nor have I read the book, so I can not answer your questions. However, I did think about going. And it wasn't to "fix my husband". It was because it was a Christian movie and the church was promoting it.

However, when I read a book or go see a movie, it's not always with my husband in mind. When I watch movies like that (or read books) it's to help me change. To help "me" to see what needs to be taken out of my own eye. It's to help "me" understand him better.

It's not always about a wife being right and a husband being wrong. I'm sure 99.9% of us know that we are not perfect.







Edited to add: I just read your very rude response to me above. Why the heck should any of us answer anything from you men when all you can do is be belligerent and put us down? Why do you think we would want to put ourselves through that? And who gives you the right to order us around to begin with? I am not your wife! (yes, thank God!) and I do not have to answer to a blankety blank such as yourself.

His response was rude (although I noted he at least apologized later in the thread). Two wrongs do not make a right. You have no idea what it is like to be his wife or what he is like IRL because of some post on an internet debate thread. He has never treated me like I need to "answer to him". Have you ever seen me posting complaints about my husband on here or any of the women's forums? No? There's a reason why not - because I am enjoying my marriage. I see other women complaining about always arguing in their marriage, their husbands not wanting sex with them, their husbands using porn, cheating, being verbally and/or physically abusive, lazy and not helping with (insert responsibility here) etc... yeah I don't have any of those issues to deal with. The best I could do right now is to say I find it annoying when he doesn't wipe his crumbs off the counter and I don't get why he likes to argue on the internet. I don't want to come off like I am trying to start an argument or be offensive, because I am not. I enjoy your posts and you seem like a nice person most of the time. I get why you reacted the way you did. The reason I am responding is because only I want to make it known that my husband, in spite of what his internet presence might sometimes suggest, is NOT a "blankety blank".