The mistranslation into the English of the act of Faith that saves ...

[Geralt]

Would be easier to understand if 'faith' is understood as a 'reaction' rather than simply an 'act'-ion which the OP presented.

 

[ToBeLoved]

My advice, don't try to be a Greek scholar, trust a Greek scholar that when he teaches, validates whats going on in your relationship with Christ. I had the experience first, accidentally i might add . So i can prove what i'm saying about pisteuo a dozen different ways , buts it's my experience of what happens when one fulfills pisteuo that drives me. The Word of God becomes very personal and alive when God accepts the surrendered life, and seal into us His Spirit. If you don't have a desire to do that, we should probably end our discussion there.

I don't completely trust any man's teaching. I guess I am a Berean at heart. I don't think I know Greek, but I know I will find out. My Pastor has 5 years training in Greek. I can email him if we get off course.

So what do you see in the verse above in Greek, please also use the links above to see for yourself the Concordance and verse uses.

 

[watchman 2]

Would be easier to understand if 'faith' is understood as a 'reaction' rather than simply an 'act'-ion which the OP presented.

 

[EmSw]

Is getting out of bed in the morning an action or a reaction? It's an act of Faith, in fact many of them. Did you check to see if your legs worked before you stood on them? Did you make sure the floor was strong enough to with stand your weight? Did you make sure that the air was sufficient to breath before you took a breath? Did you make sur gravity was still working in your favor to make sure you didn't float to the ceiling when you stood up ? We faithe all day long like this . faithing or pisteuo is an act, based upon a belief , sustained by confidense. The act or faithing that saves is the response of God the Father calling us out , calling us out to make a decision , to surrender our lives in response to what His Son Jesus Christ did for us.

As for the Op , i'm lucky if i can get anyone to honor what a verb is, much less precise definitions. But i can do precise.

I didn't check to make sure gravity was still working. So I guess I didn't 'faithe'.

 

[watchman 2]

I don't completely trust any man's teaching. I guess I am a Berean at heart. I don't think I know Greek, but I know I will find out. My Pastor has 5 years training in Greek. I can email him if we get off course.

 

[watchman 2]

I didn't check to make sure gravity was still working. So I guess I didn't 'faithe'.

LOL , it's because you didn't check that makes it Faith!

 

[EmSw]

LOL , it's because you didn't check that makes it Faith!

Did you check? If not, you don't have 'faithe'.

 

[watchman 2]

Did you check? If not, you don't have 'faithe'.

 

[Geralt]

That is where we differ. I used to believe faith was an automatic response, but no longer when I ponder the question 'did Jesus himself had faith'. And then I knew.

Is getting out of bed in the morning an action or a reaction? It's an act of Faith, in fact many of them. Did you check to see if your legs worked before you stood on them? Did you make sure the floor was strong enough to with stand your weight? Did you make sure that the air was sufficient to breath before you took a breath? Did you make sur gravity was still working in your favor to make sure you didn't float to the ceiling when you stood up ? We faithe all day long like this . faithing or pisteuo is an act, based upon a belief , sustained by confidense. The act or faithing that saves is the response of God the Father calling us out , calling us out to make a decision , to surrender our lives in response to what His Son Jesus Christ did for us.

As for the Op , i'm lucky if i can get anyone to honor what a verb is, much less precise definitions. But i can do precise.

 

[EmSw]

Faith in it's most basic understanding ,"is something hoped for". As soon as whats hoped for becomes fact , it's no longer Faith anymore , but fact.

So you're hoping gravity works? You're hoping there's enough oxygen in the air to live?

I've never hoped for either of these things.

 

[watchman 2]

That is where we differ. I used to believe faith was an automatic response, but no longer when I ponder the question 'did Jesus himself had faith'. And then I knew.

 

[watchman 2]

So you're hoping gravity works? You're hoping there's enough oxygen in the air to live?

I've never hoped for either of these things.

 

[Geralt]

Since you have used the word 'response' it proves you agree that it is reaction rather than simply an action -which I have already cited.

I never said automatic response. I said a response thats decided, chosen, acted upon purposely.

Careful about misreprenting what i've said please.

 

[watchman 2]

Since you have used the word 'response' it proves you agree that it is reaction rather than simply an action -which I have already cited.

 

[watchman 2]

So you're hoping gravity works? You're hoping there's enough oxygen in the air to live?




























+*-

 

[watchman 2]

I agree. That would mean a large number of people I know who believe and trust in Jesus for salvation are probably not saved.

Unfortunately that would be correct.

 

[ToBeLoved]

It's more complicated than that. When one is just starting the relationship , a response is made by a decision or choice. If Gods accepts the surrendered life , then you are drawn into the parable of the sower phase of the Salvation journey. If you one out of the four people that make it through the parable of the sower , then God seals His Spirit in us and the response has become is tempered by the Dunamus power of the Holy Spirit. At that point it's harder to get out of God will than it is to stay in it.

So at the start , a decision made with the will. Since we are surrendering our "life and will" to Him , if he deems our surrender genuine , we begin a path that regenerates a life thats more of Him , and less of us. So the more God takes us over , the more it would become a reaction to the Holy Spirit dwelling in us , and having the mind of Christ.

But back to my greater point. That if the initial surrender doesn't take place , the journey is stuck outside of God and His Word, until the right act of faithing takes place.

You have added more. It is only by faith that we are saved.

Can you give your scripture proof for the other steps?

 

[faroukfarouk]

You have added more. It is only by faith that we are saved.

Can you give your scripture proof for the other steps?

I have long held that by grace, through faith, not of works is an accurate summary of how salvation works.

 

[ToBeLoved]

My advice, don't try to be a Greek scholar, trust a Greek scholar that when he teaches, validates whats going on in your relationship with Christ. I had the experience first, accidentally i might add . So i can prove what i'm saying about pisteuo a dozen different ways , buts it's my experience of what happens when one fulfills pisteuo that drives me. The Word of God becomes very personal and alive when God accepts the surrendered life, and seal into us His Spirit. If you don't have a desire to do that, we should probably end our discussion there.

What makes you think I am not already a believer and have not already been sealed with the Holy Spirit? Your default thought is that I need to desire that, I think I am past that.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I have 30 years of daily study with a Dr from Stanford university. He not only spoke and taught all the ancient languages , but owned himself the largest collection of biblical manuscripts in private hands behind only the Vatican. He used the original ancient texts to teach from.

This isn't new, i and tens of thousands of others who have been taught by Him over the last 60 years know this as well. What i'm presenting to you is what he would teach on the first day ,basic Faith understanding.

Umm. well can you address the Greek I posted from the Interlinear Greek then?