And I believe in such depravity because of this: Romans 8:8 Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God.
Obedience pleases God, and therefore those in the realm of the flesh cannot obey God either.
You are quite correct, while a man is carnally minded he cannot please God. That is simply like saying you cannot please your wife while you stare at a pretty girl in a bikini. That does not mean you cannot look away and please your wife. While a man is carnally minded, he cannot possibly please God.
But men can be spiritually minded.
Mat 26:41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation:
the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.
This was spoken of the disciples before the Holy Spirit was given (Jhn 7:39) and therefore speaks of man's natural spirit. Jesus said his disciples were indeed "willing" to obey him, but their flesh caused them to fall asleep.
But the point is, man is more than flesh, he is also mind and spirit, and in his mind and spirit he CAN be willing to obey and believe God.
Nope...not how the verse reads at all. You do understand the different between past and present tense in context of Romans 6 I assume:
Romans 6:17New International Version (NIV)
17 But thanks be to God that, though you used to be slaves to sin, you have come to obey from your heart the pattern of teaching that has now claimed your allegiance
You've confused WERE with ARE.
Wow, the NIV and other MVs give a Calvinist interpretation. What a shocker.
Agreed. But remember Paul doesn't even take personal responsibility for his own actions, but blames the sin within him.
Yes, Paul said he was "sold under sin" in Romans 7:14. This cannot be a born again Christian. He also said he was brought into captivity to the law of sin in vs. 23. Again, this cannot possibly be a born again Christian, as Paul said the Spirit had made him free from the law of sin and death;
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus
hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
So, Romans 7 cannot possibly be speaking of Paul as a born again believer, but as a Jewish man trying to obey the law. In his mind and spirit he delighted in the law and willed to do it, but by sin he was brought into captivity to the law of death.
This is EXACTLY what I was trying to explain to you. Once you sin you are "sold to sin". You now belong to sin as your master, you are his captive. No matter what you do, you cannot escape. You can do good, but it will not help you, sin only pays one wage, and that is death.
This is exactly what Paul is explaining in Romans 7:14-25.
Very vain and futile effort dont you think? And works never saved anyone. Romans 9.
Of course not, but many men try to save themselves through works.
No, spiritual death. Paul had just told us he was alive without the law once, but when the commandment came, sin revived and he died.
Rom 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived,
and I died.
Paul cannot possibly be saying he physically died here, he MUST be speaking of spiritual death. This is being a captive of sin, this is being "sold under sin".
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual:
but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Here Paul tells us he is carnal, sold under sin, and then he spends the next 10 verses telling us he willed and desired to do good. Again, this completely refutes Total Inability that says man cannot will to please God.
Wow, you think I got something right.
1 John 3 and 5 contradict your stance.
Would you care to elaborate? Anybody can make an unsupported statement like this, show how 1 John 3 and and 5 contradicts my view.
OSAS? Sounds to me that you're looking for a way to prove your assurance of salvation while continuing in sin. How might you and I (Im guilty too!) repent?
How can you spiritually die when your spirit is joined to the Holy Spirit?
1 Cor 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is
one spirit.
Just as when two parents come together they become one flesh (their children), when you trust Jesus your spirit is cleansed from sin and joined to the Holy Spirit. Now we are one spirit and a new creation.
It is very similar to physical birth. You are half your father, and half your mother, but you are not your father or mother, you are a new creation, you are an individual.
It is the same with the spiritual birth, your spirit is joined to the Holy Spirit and becomes one spirit. We are not God, and we are not our old man. We are a new man, a new creation, and we partake of the divine nature.
2 Pet 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises:
that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
This is what you Calvinists do not understand, just as physical birth requires two parents, spiritual birth requires two persons as well, your spirit and the Holy Spirit.
How can you spiritually die when half of you is the Holy Spirit?
