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Iosias

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What do you make of the following? Especially the parts either like this or this.

Mat 10:1-42 - So long as God gives Him access to the people, He continues His labour of love. Nevertheless, He was conscious of the iniquity that governed the people, although He did not seek His own glory. Having exhorted His disciples to pray that labourers might be sent into the harvest, He begins (chapter 10) to act in accordance with that desire. He calls His twelve disciples, He gives them power to cast out devils and to heal the sick, and He sends them to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. We see, in this mission, how much the ways of God with Israel form the subject of this Gospel. They were to announce to that people, and to them exclusively, the nearness of the kingdom, exercising at the same time the power they had received: a striking testimony to Him who was come, and who could not only work miracles Himself, but confer power on others to do so likewise. He gave them authority over evil spirits for this purpose. It is this which characterises the kingdom — man healed of all sickness and the devil cast out Accordingly, in Hebrews 6, miracles are called "the powers of the world to come." [27]
They were also, with respect to their need, to depend entirely on Him who sent them. Emmanuel was there. If miracles were a proof to the world of their Master's power, the fact that they lacked nothing should be so to their own hearts The ordinance was abrogated during that period of their ministry which followed the departure of Jesus from this world (Luke 22:35-37). That which He here (Matthew 10) commands His disciples appertains to His presence as Messiah, as Jehovah Himself, on the earth. Therefore the reception of His messengers, or their rejection, decided the fate of those to whom they were sent. In rejecting them they rejected the Lord Emmanuel, God with His people. [28] But, in fact, He sent them forth as sheep in the midst of wolves. They would need the wisdom of serpents, and were to exhibit the harmlessness of doves (rare union of virtues, found only in those who, by the Spirit of the Lord, are wise unto that which is good and simple concerning evil).

If they did not beware of men (sad testimony as to these), they would but suffer; but when scourged and brought before councils and governors and kings, all this should become a testimony unto them — a divine means of presenting the gospel of the kingdom to kings and princes, without altering its character or accommodating it to the world, or mixing up the Lord's people with its usages and its false greatness. Moreover circumstances like these made their testimony much more conspicuous than association with the great ones of the earth would have done.

And, to accomplish this, they should receive such power and guidance from the Spirit of their Father as would cause the words they spoke to be not their own words, but His who inspired them. Here, again, their relation with their Father, which so distinctly characterises the sermon on the Mount, is made the basis of their capacity for the service they had to perform. We must remember that this testimony was addressed to Israel only; only that, Israel being under the yoke of the Gentiles since the time of Nebuchadnezzar, the testimony would reach their rulers.

But this testimony would excite an opposition that should break all family ties, and awaken a hatred that would not spare the life of those who had been the most beloved. He who in spite of all this should endure to the end should be saved. Nevertheless the case was urgent. They were not to resist, but if the opposition took the form of persecution, they were to flee and preach the Gospel elsewhere, for before they had gone over the cities of Israel the Son of man should come. [29] They were to proclaim the kingdom. Jehovah, Emmanuel, was there, in the midst of His people, and the heads of the people had called the master of the house Beelzebub. This had not stopped His testimony, but it very strongly characterised the circumstances in which this testimony was to be rendered He sent them forth, warning them of this state of things, to maintain this final testimony among His beloved people as long as possible. This took place at that time, and it is possible, if circumstances permit, to carry it on until the Son of man comes to execute judgment. Then the master of the house will nave risen up to shut the door. The "to-day" of Psalm 95 will be over. Israel in possession of their cities being the object of this testimony, it is necessarily suspended when they are no longer in their land. The testimony to the future kingdom given in Israel by the apostles after the Lord's death, is an accomplishment of this mission, so far as this testimony was rendered in the land of Israel; for the kingdom might be proclaimed as to be established while Emmanuel was on the earth; or this might be by Christ's returning from heaven as announced by Peter in Acts 3. And this might take place if Israel were in the land, even until Christ should return. Thus the testimony may be resumed in Israel, whenever they are again in their land and the requisite spiritual power is sent forth by God.

...

Note #28 There is a division of the Lord's discourse at Mat_10:15. Up to that it is the then present mission. From Mat_10:16, we have more general reflections on their mission, looked at as a whole in the midst of Israel on to the end. Evidently it goes beyond their then present mission and supposes the coming of the Holy Ghost. The mission by which the church is called as such is a distinct thing. This applies only to Israel they were forbidden to go to Gentiles. This necessarily closed with the destruction of Jerusalem and the dispersion of the Jewish nation, but it is to be renewed at the end, till the Son of man be come. There was a testimony to the Gentiles only, as brought before them as judges, as Paul was, and that part of his history even on to Rome in Acts, was amidst Jews. The latter part, from Mat_10:16, has less to do with the gospel of the kingdom.
Note #29 Observe here the expression "Son of man." This is the character in which (according to Daniel 7) the Lord will come, in a power and glory much greater than that of His manifestation as Messiah, the Son of David, and which will be displayed in a much wider sphere. As the Son of man, He is the heir of all that God destines for man (see Heb_2:6-8, and 1Co_15:27). He must, in consequence, seeing what man's condition is, suffer in order to possess this inheritance. He was there as the Messiah, but He must be received in His true character, Emmanuel; and the Jews must thus be tested morally. He will not have the kingdom on carnal principles. Rejected as Messiah, as Emmanuel, He postpones the period of those events which will close the ministry of His disciples with respect to Israel, unto His coming as the Son of man. Meantime God has brought out other things that had been hidden from the foundation of the world, the true glory of Jesus the Son of God, His heavenly glory as man and the church united to Him in heaven. The Judgment of Jerusalem, and the dispersion of the nation, have suspended the ministry which had begun at the moment of which the evangelist here speaks. That which has filled up the interval since then is not the subject here of the Lord's discourse, which refers solely to the ministry that had the Jews for its object. The counsels of God with respect to the church, in connection with the glory of Jesus at the right hand of God, we shall find spoken of elsewhere.
 

heymikey80

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There's Jesus' commands to the disciples, too:

And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."

Paul wasn't there.

It seems to me Jesus was telling the Twelve (and maybe even the 500) there's a whole world to redeem ... with "all that I commanded you."
 
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TheScottsMen

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eph3Nine said:
The message posted is to the Nation Israel...and has nada to do with us today. NEXT!

Just because the OT and gospels deal primarily with the nation of Israel is no excuse to blow off those scriputres. When Paul said to study to show thy self approved, he meant all scripture.

TSM
 
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eph3Nine

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TheScottsMen said:
Just because the OT and gospels deal primarily with the nation of Israel is no excuse to blow off those scriputres. When Paul said to study to show thy self approved, he meant all scripture.

TSM

No one is "blowing them off" but simply making the distinction. Why focus on the instructions given to another audience at another time. We arent IN that program today?

Rightly Dividing means that we understand what program we ARE in. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John dont have any directives for me.
 
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eph3Nine

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billychum said:
Not trying to be a smarty pants but, this is opinion.
Billy <><[/quote

Thats what rightly dividing is all about, billychum. Making sure that we make the divisions that God makes and keep them separate.

Times PAST, But NOW, Ages to Come. ONLY ONE part of that has to do with US, the Body of Christ. Your bible is laid out this way. Not opinion at all, but FACT.:clap:
 
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TheScottsMen

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eph3Nine said:
No one is "blowing them off" but simply making the distinction. Why focus on the instructions given to another audience at another time. We arent IN that program today?

Rightly Dividing means that we understand what program we ARE in. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John dont have any directives for me.

I disagree. Rightly Dividing does not ONLY mean understanding what dispensation we are in or what dispensation someoen else is in, but understanding all scripture and handling it correctly.
 
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eph3Nine

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TheScottsMen said:
I disagree. Rightly Dividing does not ONLY mean understanding what dispensation we are in or what dispensation someoen else is in, but understanding all scripture and handling it correctly.

The term "handling correctly" isnt what right division means. It means to CUT STRAIGHT...to MAKE divisions where God makes them. And yes, it involves all the scripture, but puts emphasis on OUR program and OUR instructions.
 
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JM

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eph3Nine said:
The term "handling correctly" isnt what right division means. It means to CUT STRAIGHT...to MAKE divisions where God makes them. And yes, it involves all the scripture, but puts emphasis on OUR program and OUR instructions.

I thought you guys were in the same Mid Acts camp?
 
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TheScottsMen

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JM said:
I thought you guys were in the same Mid Acts camp?

While we share the same beliefs in that the Church, the Body of Christ started with the Apostle Paul and in his writings alone do we find the mystery regarding Jews and Gentiles, including subsequent mysteries (the rapture, baptism, etc..) we disagree on other topics, such as as that of soteriology.

I don't consider myself in anyones camp; doing so hinders the Word of God for the exact same reason you asked if we were in the same camp; that those who are in the same camp are not suppose to disagree and follow party line; that puts ones camp over the Word of God.



TSM
 
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JM

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TheScottsMen said:
I don't consider myself in anyones camp; doing so hinders the Word of God for the exact same reason you asked if we were in the same camp; that those who are in the same camp are not suppose to disagree and follow party line; that puts ones camp over the Word of God.



TSM

I understand that you don't consider yourself apart of anyones camp, but you are.

Peace,

jm
 
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TheScottsMen

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JM said:
I understand that you don't consider yourself apart of anyones camp, but you are.

Peace,

jm

Why? Because I share some beliefs with a particular group? I share beliefs with those who are reformed and those who are dispensationalist. If you wish to label me in a group, go ahead;)
 
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WAB

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TheScottsMen said:
While we share the same beliefs in that the Church, the Body of Christ started with the Apostle Paul and in his writings alone do we find the mystery regarding Jews and Gentiles, including subsequent mysteries (the rapture, baptism, etc..) we disagree on other topics, such as as that of soteriology.

I don't consider myself in anyones camp; doing so hinders the Word of God for the exact same reason you asked if we were in the same camp; that those who are in the same camp are not suppose to disagree and follow party line; that puts ones camp over the Word of God.



TSM

Unfortunately, it often takes severe persecution for genuine Christians to acknowledge that we are in the same camp.

When such happens, peripheral issues seem to fall by the wayside. And the camp then agrees on the essentials of the Word of God.
 
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JM

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Israel was made up of 12 tribes...one nation, different camps.

When such happens, peripheral issues seem to fall by the wayside. And the camp then agrees on the essentials of the Word of God.

What are the essentials? Should we reduce the faith to the 'essentials' or should we accept the faith in total? Who decides what the essentials are if not the church or the camp you belong to? Can we know the faith in total?

Peace.
 
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