Your Thoughts on Creation & Evolution

[Aman777]

Unfortunately this is circular logic; you're using your own religious beliefs to justify your own religious beliefs.

Finding the agreement of Scripture with the latest Science and History changes my view from religion (belief) to Fact. Want some examples or would you just hand wave them away, like brain washed Trump followers do?

 

[Aman777]

So does Judaism and Islam and for that matter, even Hinduism. You just have to have the proper interpretation of their religious texts (you can find many of them easily on Youtube if you look). I'm not confused by any of those "False Religions" you talk about by the way - heck, I'm not even fooled by yours either, so I guess I'm doing one better than you?

Temporarily, but in the end, your knee will bow to the Truth, which IS Jesus Christ. Jhn 14:6 Bow now or bow later, but your knee will bow. Rom 14:11

 

[Brightmoon]

Finding the agreement of Scripture with the latest Science and History changes my view from religion (belief) to Fact. Want some examples or would you just hand wave them away, like brain washed Trump followers do?

Hmph ! The only thing I’ve ever agreed with you about are your statements about trump. Your understanding of science and history is severely lacking if you think scripture and history agree or if you think scripture agrees with science facts

 

[PsychoSarah]

i already gave this one for instance:

Tetrapod trackways from the early Middle Devonian period of Poland

I had to do a lot of digging for this one. The identification itself is questionable, because the tracks don't match up particularly well with tetrapod feet morphology.

I mean, that "footprint" looks pretty wonky to me, and well preserved tetrapod tracks are like this:

However, the fossil record for early tetrapods isn't particularly great, so it is entirely plausible that tetrapods came 10 million years earlier and that organisms like Tiktaalik are cousins that retained more ancient traits. Obviously, only the tracks on the left are the "tetrapod" tracks, and the ones on the right are ones from fish like Tiktaalik being compared to it. 10 million years that far back with a fossil record that incomplete is nothing. It's not as if elpistostegids couldn't have kept existing after a branch of them went off to become tetrapods, but alas those fossils are yet to be found.

You did the 100020000300045 to 100020000300054 swap I mentioned before as being possible.

again: not realy a problem:

View attachment 229367

It is, and I explained why in my previous post. You've just elected to ignore it and arbitrarily put housecats WAY closer to humans in the cladogram than can be justified by the genetic evidence. Apparently, you think cladograms aren't produced using genetics at all -_- which is entirely incorrect. In fact, I've only made cladograms by comparing genetic sequences. The genetic information conflicts with your choice, it is invalid. no solution to be found, the minimum number of deletions is still 22, which is more improbable than two organisms randomly developing the same exact gene, in which both situations disprove evolution. I am done with your crusade of trying to say evolution isn't falsifiable just because you don't have evidence sufficient to do it.

 

[pitabread]

Finding the agreement of Scripture with the latest Science and History changes my view from religion (belief) to Fact. Want some examples or would you just hand wave them away, like brain washed Trump followers do?

Like you have already said, it's a matter of interpretation. If you interpret things loosely enough, you can get anything to agree with anything especially when doing so from a post-hoc perspective.

I'm not sure why you find that so compelling...

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Temporarily, but in the end, your knee will bow to the Truth, which IS Jesus Christ. Jhn 14:6 Bow now or bow later, but your knee will bow. Rom 14:11

Promises, promises... Surely if your God exists and cared about me, he'd let me know, right? Would the almighty creator of the universe seriously have problems letting me know in an unequivocal way about his existence if he actually wanted to do so?

 

[xianghua]

I had to do a lot of digging for this one. The identification itself is questionable, because the tracks don't match up particularly well with tetrapod feet morphology.

lets say for the sake of the a rgument that its a real track. now....

You did the 100020000300045 to 100020000300054 swap I mentioned before as being possible.

actually its more like 162345 since its predate about 5 missing links between fish and tetrapod evolution:

(image from wiki)


but as you can see: no one is claiming that evolution is false.

no solution to be found, the minimum number of deletions is still 22, which is more improbable than two organisms randomly developing the same exact gene, in which both situations disprove evolution. I am done with your crusade of trying to say evolution isn't falsifiable just because you don't have evidence sufficient to do it.

first: what is the problem with 22 gene loss actually? we can claim that these species were just dont need this gene anymore so they lost it. no problem.

2) we actually do find similar cases. for instance:

Evolution by gene loss

"To date, the red flour beetle (Tribolium casteneum) has preserved the largest number of patchy orthologues that are also present in humans but that were lost in all other sequenced insects"

see how we can always claim for a gene loss?

 

[Aman777]

Hmph ! The only thing I’ve ever agreed with you about are your statements about trump. Your understanding of science and history is severely lacking if you think scripture and history agree or if you think scripture agrees with science facts

Do you agree that every living creature that moves came from water? Science does
https://www.newscientist.com/.../2098564-universal-ancestor-of-all-life-on-earth-was-...Jul 25, 2016 - and so does Scripture:

Gen 1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly,

God told us more than 3k years before today's Science discovered the Truth. Want more? or can you refute the Facts of Science and Scripture?

 

[Ophiolite]

Hmph ! The only thing I’ve ever agreed with you about are your statements about trump. Your understanding of science and history is severely lacking if you think scripture and history agree or if you think scripture agrees with science facts

As a former Christian I still retain enough of a feeling for the religion that I get offended when charlatans attempt to read into it what is not there. The Bible, in my opinion, is a marvellous work of history, myth, parable, poetry and, especially in the New Testament, moral guidance. What it very clearly is not and was never intended to be is a scientific text. It is ludicrous to suggest that it was and claiming such is the case does a great disservice to the religion. /rant

 

[Aman777]

Like you have already said, it's a matter of interpretation. If you interpret things loosely enough, you can get anything to agree with anything especially when doing so from a post-hoc perspective.

False teaching unless you can get the Bible and Science to agree that all life came from the summit of explosive volcanoes. Go ahead and try and watch how easy it is to refute you. Amen?

 

[Aman777]

Promises, promises... Surely if your God exists and cared about me, he'd let me know, right? Would the almighty creator of the universe seriously have problems letting me know in an unequivocal way about his existence if he actually wanted to do so?

Maybe that's why you are speaking to me? Perhaps you would believe if scientists understood the Bible the way it is actually written, instead of the unsupported, confused views (more than 33,000 denominations) of all those religionists. Amen?

 

[Aman777]

As a former Christian

Sorry, but that's an oxymoron. Christians are those who have been born Spiritually by God the Trinity. Gen 1:26 John 14:16 Rom 8:9 We were born Spiritually, into the 3rd Heaven like you were born physically in the present 2nd Heaven. You cannot change either fact.

 

[pitabread]

False teaching unless you can get the Bible and Science to agree that all life came from the summit of explosive volcanoes. Go ahead and try and watch how easy it is to refute you. Amen?

I have no idea what you are even talking about and quite frankly don't really care.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Maybe that's why you are speaking to me? Perhaps you would believe if scientists understood the Bible the way it is actually written, instead of the unsupported, confused views (more than 33,000 denominations) of all those religionists. Amen?

....yet You, YOU, with one of the most Elaborate and convoluted interpretations of your Bible I've ever come across, have it right and those 33,000 other denominations are all wrong....

Come back when you have a way to determine the "truth" of your claim. Otherwise, the rest of us are getting on with the evidence that demonstrates something else.

 

[GrowingSmaller]

I think we are still in phase one of the debate. Science cam along with evolutionary theory, faiths have responded. There is modernism/liberalism, and creationism/fundamentalism, and traditionalism somewhere in between possibly yawning till the dust settles.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

I think we re still in phase one of the debate. Science cam along with evolutionary theory, faiths have responded. There is modernism/liberalism, and creationism/fundamentalism, and traditionalism somewhere in between possibly yawning till the dust settles.

Nope, it's done and dusted. Evolution is a fact and scientists of all religions and even of no religion at all have come to a consensus that Evolution is a thing.

All of the evidence available is concordant with Evolution and Evolution is contradicted by none of it.

 

[Aman777]

I have no idea what you are even talking about and quite frankly don't really care.

No problem. Go find an eight year old and have him explain it to you.

 

[Aman777]

....yet You, YOU, with one of the most Elaborate and convoluted interpretations of your Bible I've ever come across, have it right and those 33,000 other denominations are all wrong....

Come back when you have a way to determine the "truth" of your claim. Otherwise, the rest of us are getting on with the evidence that demonstrates something else.

Typical remark from someone who cannot refute me (prove me wrong) either Scripturally scientifically or historically. FYI, My view agrees with every other discovered Truth of mankind, as you will soon see. God Bless you

 

[pitabread]

I think we are still in phase one of the debate.

The 'debate' was settled over a hundred years ago. What is happening today isn't debate ; it's denial.

 

[Aman777]

Evolution is a fact and scientists of all religions and even of no religion at all have come to a consensus that Evolution is a thing.

False. The only thing that has changed is its name. Descent with modification within kinds was changed into the godless term "evolution" by godless people who wished to eliminate God from His Own Creation. Be ashamed of lying to children.