Your Interpretation of Scripture is NOT The Inerrant Word of God

[PsychoSarah]

When folks know they are openly fighting against God, who created the universe by speaking it into being, that is bad.

You know most atheists and others outside your faith are not willfully being against a deity they don't even think exists. Are you anti-purple-people-eater? Are you against them, or do you just think they don't exist?

Additionally, skepticism in general not only isn't bad, but is productive.

If we want it, I think we'll get some.

it has been 7 years of wanting for me.

Jesus said whosoever will...come. Whosoever comes to me I will in no wise cast out. There can be no pre destiny that makes that impossible so no worries about the Calvies.

Ah, but what if they are correct? You see, you disagree fundamentally with them. From a Calvinist perspective, could you consider hell moral, given that all who end up there were destined for it, without any probability of salvation?

Not at all. Those particular number are from tribes of Israel, so named exactly. JWs are not Jews so it sure has zilch to do with them. Besides there were multitudes too great to number of saved in the end after the rapture, the 144 thousand were just one tiny group of Jews of that number.

I could misunderstand Jehovah Witness beliefs, true, but the point is that it conflicts with your own beliefs.

They do not get that from the bible so who really cares??

Catholics read the same bible you do, they just divide the books differently.

None of that is actually in the least.
My goodness, you have been misinformed. The bible tells us a lot about the world to come.

As is indicated by all of the 0 bible quotes you have picked out to demonstrate that.

That is ridiculous. Sounds like some demonic misconstrued slander and deception to keep heaven sounding like a terrible place for morons and zombies.

It's an interpretation of the afterlife depicted in the bible you don't like. That doesn't make it a less valid interpretation than your own. Quote a bible passage that contradicts this idea; happiness in a place where sorrow cannot exist is inevitably forced.

Yes we can know a whole lot about it from Jesus and His word. Mansions, river, city of gold, eternal life, love, desires of our heart, flying, appearing and disappearing, walking through walls, mind reading...etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc.

Yeah, imagination is a wonderful thing. but isn't the walking through walls and mind reading supposed miracles he did, not traits of heaven? Also, I personally despise gold, and much prefer silver. Yet, a world without all the colors, even if it just excluded the ones I disliked, would be worse than having all of them. I am also afraid of heights, as most people are to an extent. I have no desire to have the power to fly. I also already have love in my life. Plus, mind reading would be a violation of privacy.

also, desire is itself a sin, thus cannot exist in heaven. and without the capacity to want anything beyond what you have, heaven could literally be exactly the same as hell, sans the capacity to feel suffering, or be the greatest thing imaginable, and your experience of it would be no different. Think on that for a moment, if you cannot feel sadness, anger, or any other negative emotion, there will be no difference between how you experience "good" things and "bad" things.

That is an awful thought. You probably had tons of relatives in the family tree that were believers! Even maybe some that were saved, and you never knew about it.

I'm a 5th generation atheist on my mother's side, and her conversion was recent. My father was adopted into a family that I rarely see, and have practically no emotional attachment to. My family would be almost evenly split apart if the afterlife works as you say, in regards to those I care about. While my situation might be disproportionate to the situation most people have, i highly doubt that there isn't a single person alive or dead that you think is in hell or headed for it, that you wish wasn't.

Interesting thought, that a whole house could get saved because of someone...? Anyhow works do not save or keep anyone saved, that is absolutely certain and 100% undeniable scripture.

It depends on which passages you read, there is a passage that says faith without works is empty, and another that says only through faith are people saved, for no good works can make one good.

Nah...we have seen stars go real bright or disappear, but do not really know what is going on with them or how big they are or how far away and etc. Some signs in the sky could even be for mankind....including stars appearing, darkening or being bright...etc.

Get really bright? I that honestly how you would describe an explosion? Either way, they go out, never to be seen again.

There is science...dealing with actual fact and laws. Then there is so called science, that is a dark religion of unbelief in Jesus and creation, and has no merit or basis or value. Both are together in the education world and minds of most men.

Give one area of science that you qualify as the former, and another that you qualify as the latter that doesn't have to do with physics or evolution.

Nah...you have no idea how big anything in the universe far away is, or what makes anything orbit...etc. The so called planets could be closer to the size of a molecule than to a sun for all we know. (for example, an apartment complex would be closer to the size of a molecule than to our sun)

A single molecule is physically incapable of refracting light to the extent that we would see it in telescopes. If they could, then telescopes would be worthless, as tons of molecules would provide so much background image as to block out anything sizable.

You cannot prove that, this is just how man believes things are. Man cannot even so much as tell us what time IS!! Nor can he tell us what makes time and space mix together or exist the way we know it here...etc.

God certainly hasn't done so in the bible. Your book would only be superior if it actually explained the stuff itself, but beyond origins, it rarely touches on how already existing things actually work. And in every case, observable evidence contradicts it. Science doesn't do proof, you know this, but it is more accurate and more expansive than the bible in explaining the world around us.

You have exactly 0% chance of knowing what the future nature and laws will be like, or those in the far past if they were not the same! Same thing can apply to the far universe I would guess. We see it all here...now...and interpret inside this little fishbowl.

You have a chance so small, it might as well be 0, that your biblical interpretation is valid and fits reality. However, inability to have a 100% certainty in something doesn't make my chance of being right about the consistency of the universe 0%. You sir, are making the extraordinary claim that the physics of the universe aren't uniform either in time or place; that they are consistent is the null hypothesis. Unless you provide actual evidence that disproves the null hypothesis, yours isn't worth considering. YOU AREN'T GOING TO CONVINCE ME THAT ANYTHING YOU SAY ISN'T COMPLETE GARBAGE WITHOUT OBSERVABLE EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT IT! From this point on, baseless claims made by you, without evidence, will be removed when I quote and respond to you.

I can learn more from Scripture than science about the universe. They are nothing but bad religion. Blasphemous drivel. Baseless conjecture.

That describes you. Really, if I were a Christian, I would view the idea that god made the universe so botchy that it needs different physics in different places as an attack on that god's capabilities.

He had Peter walk out on the water too.

Magicians often take volunteers to take part in their act; they can even do it without knowing how the trick works.

The prophesies of Jesus involve both the coming as a Lamb, and also later the coming as a lion, and ruling. His first coming was never meant to cover it all.

and his second coming was supposed to happen before the deaths of his followers... oops.

One could never fit it all, or even most of it. Try being virgin born sometime...

I actually could have a virgin born child myself, thanks to artificial insemination. However, there is no way to verify that Jesus was actually born of a virgin, so i view this point as irrelevant.

The witnesses recorded it all. History was not there to take a pic of the manger.

Only 1 book of the bible, just 1, has a CHANCE of being recorded by a witness. This is the book of Luke.

 

[dad]

You know most atheists and others outside your faith are not willfully being against a deity they don't even think exists. Are you anti-purple-people-eater? Are you against them, or do you just think they don't exist?

Well, I'll have to let them work out God and reality and the meaning of life etc.. the best way they know how. I actually have more of a personality clash with people that claim to be believers, but seem to despise Scripture and creation.

Additionally, skepticism in general not only isn't bad, but is productive.

Many thhings can be productive...in their place. I am skeptical of everything against Scripture

it has been 7 years of wanting for me.

Hold on.

Ah, but what if they are correct? You see, you disagree fundamentally with them. From a Calvinist perspective, could you consider hell moral, given that all who end up there were destined for it, without any probability of salvation?

I do not know about hell. I think the main idea about being separated from God, is that He is so merciful and wonderful, and loving, that it is hell to be away from that.

I could misunderstand Jehovah Witness beliefs, true, but the point is that it conflicts with your own beliefs.

I do not consider them believers, it is my understanding they do not believe Jesus is God. About all that is left after that is some idiotic works trip, being a grinch on birthdays and Christmas, and learning to make a face like a mule.

Catholics read the same bible you do, they just divide the books differently.

Nah..I was brought up one, I had no bible. I think they sort of feel that all we need is a priest to confess stuff to, and disseminate what the bible supposedly says...etc. Oh..and learn to play church.

It's an interpretation of the afterlife depicted in the bible you don't like. That doesn't make it a less valid interpretation than your own. Quote a bible passage that contradicts this idea; happiness in a place where sorrow cannot exist is inevitably forced.

You may think so, I happen to know better.

Yeah, imagination is a wonderful thing. but isn't the walking through walls and mind reading supposed miracles he did, not traits of heaven?

Exactly. We shall be like Him.

Also, I personally despise gold, and much prefer silver. Yet, a world without all the colors, even if it just excluded the ones I disliked, would be worse than having all of them.

? I bet there are more colors there.

I am also afraid of heights, as most people are to an extent. I have no desire to have the power to fly. I also already have love in my life. Plus, mind reading would be a violation of privacy.

Well, maybe we can guard thoughts when we like to an extent there..? But maybe we also would have nothing to hide then! As for heights or other fears...there is no fear there...fear has torment. Since He gives us the desire of our heart of hearts there, maybe if we just prefer some things, we can do them as long as we like. If we prefer not to fly, heck, why not simply teleport when we go somewhere, or walk, or take a flying saucer etc?

also, desire is itself a sin, thus cannot exist in heaven.

False. Desire is not sin. If our heart is right, as it will be then, desires are fine.

and without the capacity to want anything beyond what you have, heaven could literally be exactly the same as hell, sans the capacity to feel suffering, or be the greatest thing imaginable, and your experience of it would be no different. Think on that for a moment, if you cannot feel sadness, anger, or any other negative emotion, there will be no difference between how you experience "good" things and "bad" things.

We will have PLENTY of capacity!!

I'm a 5th generation atheist on my mother's side, and her conversion was recent. My father was adopted into a family that I rarely see, and have practically no emotional attachment to. My family would be almost evenly split apart if the afterlife works as you say, in regards to those I care about. While my situation might be disproportionate to the situation most people have, i highly doubt that there isn't a single person alive or dead that you think is in hell or headed for it, that you wish wasn't.

?? I actually wish all men would be saved. The reason I don't freak out about hell is because I have come to know God a little bit, and I trust in His wonderfulness and mercy for folks. I know some things sound bad in the bible, but I have no doubt that the infinite love and mercy of God is greater than all I fear now.

It depends on which passages you read, there is a passage that says faith without works is empty, and another that says only through faith are people saved, for no good works can make one good.

I do not care how empty so called faith is....we can fill it up in heaven later if need be! Even if the works of some be burned down to ashes and nothingness, yet will they be saved if are saved (even though they go through a bit of hell)

Get really bright? I that honestly how you would describe an explosion? Either way, they go out, never to be seen again.

Hey an atomic reaction gets real bright. Look at Hiroshima. That does not mean that the bomb was bigger than our sun.

Give one area of science that you qualify as the former, and another that you qualify as the latter that doesn't have to do with physics or evolution.

I think sciences that deal in physics, and present state laws are genuine. They may be dangerous and used for evil, but they are dealing with what we actually have. The stuff that looks at dates and bones and nincompoop scenarios about what the universe or life was like in the beginning...are bogus.

A single molecule is physically incapable of refracting light to the extent that we would see it in telescopes. If they could, then telescopes would be worthless, as tons of molecules would provide so much background image as to block out anything sizable.

Maybe so. However a space station reflects light. We can even see it go by sometimes. From earth, that looks like a star. That is closer to the size of a molecule than it is to the size of the sun! Since we do NOT know the distance or size of lights in the universe, (outside our system) we can't assume that stars are sun sized.

God certainly hasn't done so in the bible. Your book would only be superior if it actually explained the stuff itself, but beyond origins, it rarely touches on how already existing things actually work. And in every case, observable evidence contradicts it.

I have seen no evidence do that yet. I see people misunderstanding evidence and bible!

Science doesn't do proof, you know this, but it is more accurate and more expansive than the bible in explaining the world around us.

It may be more mouthy about life in the fishbowl, but manscience is dead to the secrets of life and the universe and future and past.

You have a chance so small, it might as well be 0, that your biblical interpretation is valid and fits reality.

There is a way to test that.
We can see if my ideas fit the bible. We can also check if they oppose what is known by manscience. There is no doubt at all that it is impossible for one jot or tittle to fail in Scripture and prophesy. There is no possibility that creation was not real and done the way Scripture records it. There is no chance the future is like science says either.

However, inability to have a 100% certainty in something doesn't make my chance of being right about the consistency of the universe 0%. You sir, are making the extraordinary claim that the physics of the universe aren't uniform either in time or place; that they are consistent is the null hypothesis.

That dull hypothesis is so small minded and puny, that it would be foolish to follow it to the conclusion that God is wrong and never created the universe. The fact of the matter is that one cannot sail off into la la land and dreamsville simply because they decide to religiously follow some notion that the universe must be all the same because we know nothing else!



Unless you provide actual evidence that disproves the null hypothesis, yours isn't worth considering. YOU AREN'T GOING TO CONVINCE ME THAT ANYTHING YOU SAY ISN'T COMPLETE GARBAGE WITHOUT OBSERVABLE EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT IT! From this point on, baseless claims made by you, without evidence, will be removed when I quote and respond to you.

That describes you. Really, if I were a Christian, I would view the idea that god made the universe so botchy that it needs different physics in different places as an attack on that god's capabilities.

I think of it more like maybe God set the stars in heaven for our benefit and for reasons that have to do with you, and me. Whether they help set time and timespace for us here near earth...and/or they have other reasons for us...the idea is that this earth is all important in the universe. One should not look out at the stars and assume we are just some little blue speck in a meaningless universe. Science is totally out to lunch.

Magicians often take volunteers to take part in their act; they can even do it without knowing how the trick works.
and his second coming was supposed to happen before the deaths of his followers... oops.

Looking at the fishermen in the boat, and the stormy seas, one could hardly claim it was some circus act. Jesus walked up to the boat in the middle of the lake. Peter was called out to walk on the water too. He did. Some trick.

I actually could have a virgin born child myself, thanks to artificial insemination.

No. That would be from a man. Different insertion method.

However, there is no way to verify that Jesus was actually born of a virgin, so i view this point as irrelevant.

That is what people recorded and died for. There is no reason to doubt.

Only 1 book of the bible, just 1, has a CHANCE of being recorded by a witness. This is the book of Luke.

Since that book records Jesus saying that all the Scripture including Daniel, Moses and the prophets and Psalms are bang on...that'll do er.

 

[SkyWriting]

Let us assume for the sake of argument, that the Bible is correct, when it claims its authors were inspired by God.

Every word in The Bible was written by fallible human men. Not God.

Whoops. I guess you weren't reading:

15From infancy you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.

16All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness,

17so that the man of God may be complete, fully equipped for every good work.

The "secret" is to use the context to understand one sentence. Actually you didn't even get to the end of the sentence...."and is useful for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness,"

 

[PsychoSarah]

Well, I'll have to let them work out God and reality and the meaning of life etc.. the best way they know how. I actually have more of a personality clash with people that claim to be believers, but seem to despise Scripture and creation.

You can't blame people for not viewing some of the choices god has made in the bible as... perfect. A lot of people view the afterlife as morally lacking, as murderers can be in heaven, while generally neutral or even decent people end up in hell, all on the basis of belief alone. If I were a believer in the same deity as you, I wouldn't view it as a good being at all. I would view it as a selfish, conceited, and childish being incapable of simple forgiveness for mistakes it already knew was going to happen, without getting something in return for it. This is because I judge god on its actions, not its claimed attributes. Anyone can claim to be good, but only those with actual good intentions will consistently demonstrate behavior that follows that claim. I view myself as more neutral than anything else; I help people when I have something to gain readily, help when I have nothing to lose partially, depending on my mood, and am loathe to help others when doing so causes myself a sort of loss or disadvantage. Yet, some people have stated that I am far more patient or friendly than I know myself to be, while others view me as an antagonizing, annoying, and angry person, which I have moments of but am not the majority of the time.

However, opinion of god is irrelevant; belief is what matters. The funniest thing about people saying atheists hate god, and just want to sin, is that if it were true, atheists would just be theists that lie, and all would go to heaven XD XD XD

Many things can be productive...in their place. I am skeptical of everything against Scripture

I am sure even you have questioned some of the content in the bible. Jesus gets mad at a fig tree for not having fruit, when it wasn't even the season for it. He is the OG table flipper.

I do not know about hell. I think the main idea about being separated from God, is that He is so merciful and wonderful, and loving, that it is hell to be away from that.

Name something god has actually done that was merciful, wonderful, and loving, that didn't require that people do something for it. True generosity is in the face of nothing to gain. True kindness asks not for recognition. Mercy is withholding harm from enemies, not allies. I cannot think of a single kindness done by the Christian god that didn't require some form of suffering on the part of an individual, group, or nation. An no, even if you count the Jesus sacrifice as god only hurting himself, that is still atrociously violent and not an act of kindness. Since when is hurting yourself for the sake of someone that "loves" you a kindness for them when they have to watch it?

If god were loving, the being would not demand anyone suffer for the sake of mere belief, or that everyone suffer for the crimes committed by a few. Heck, many of those that love are willing to forgive any atrocity without hesitation, even when that flies in the face of justice.

If god were merciful, nonbelievers wouldn't have a worse afterlife than believers do. hell is not the product of a merciful god.

If god were wonderful, then why does its creation suck so much, that it couldn't follow one simple rule?

I do not consider them believers, it is my understanding they do not believe Jesus is God. About all that is left after that is some idiotic works trip, being a grinch on birthdays and Christmas, and learning to make a face like a mule.

Wat, and yes, the h is dropped to give more of an impression of -_- .

Nah..I was brought up one, I had no bible. I think they sort of feel that all we need is a priest to confess stuff to, and disseminate what the bible supposedly says...etc. Oh..and learn to play church.

Being told what to think by others, with no room for questioning the answers, is indoctrination.

You may think so, I happen to know better.

Then present the biblical evidence, or forever hold your writing hands, because according to you, anything not in the bible cannot be demonstrated to be any more than conjecture. If the bible doesn't say it, you cannot defend it.

Exactly. We shall be like Him.

I know for a fact that people do not become godlike in the Christian afterlife, unless you are a Mormon. Also, that is a fate I wouldn't wish upon my worst enemy. Nothing is more empty than a life in which all is already known, and anything can be done without challenge.

? I bet there are more colors there.

Does the bible say that there are more? Because if not, you can't defend it. I am playing by your rules here; if the bible doesn't say it, it is a baseless guess. You aren't allowed to add anything to it; that is sacrilegious.

Well, maybe we can guard thoughts when we like to an extent there..? But maybe we also would have nothing to hide then! As for heights or other fears...there is no fear there...fear has torment. Since He gives us the desire of our heart of hearts there, maybe if we just prefer some things, we can do them as long as we like. If we prefer not to fly, heck, why not simply teleport when we go somewhere, or walk, or take a flying saucer etc?

Conjecture, if the bible doesn't say it, you don't get to claim it. If you don't have a biblical answer, say you don't know. That's the only biblically valid response you can have to those situations, and yet you have already proven my point in the fact that biblical heaven is vague by not only having to add your own material, but by never quoting the bible itself.

False. Desire is not sin. If our heart is right, as it will be then, desires are fine.

Coveting is a sin, Greed is a sin, Envy is a sin, and Lust is a sin. What kind of desire doesn't fall into one of those categories, without lacking personal gain?

We will have PLENTY of capacity!!

Quote the part of the bible that says as much.

?? I actually wish all men would be saved. The reason I don't freak out about hell is because I have come to know God a little bit, and I trust in His wonderfulness and mercy for folks. I know some things sound bad in the bible, but I have no doubt that the infinite love and mercy of God is greater than all I fear now.

Then why do you think it would be ok for someone such as myself to burn forever on the basis of belief? What merciful thing has god done in the bible to make you think it will have any mercy for nonbelievers? Jesus sacrifice on the cross? Ha, it just shows that this god cannot forgive without someone directly paying in blood for it. Merciful people need no blood sacrifice.
I do not care how empty so called faith is....we can fill it up in heaven later if need be! Even if the works of some be burned down to ashes and nothingness, yet will they be saved if are saved (even though they go through a bit of hell)[/QUOTE]
In heaven, faith dies. To have faith, there needs to be room for doubt. After seeing god in person, there is no room for doubt, you have actual evidence by that point.

Also, you just fully admitted to disagreeing with god's holy plan, because you know already that some people must be in hell if your beliefs are correct, and you don't want them there.

Hey an atomic reaction gets real bright. Look at Hiroshima. That does not mean that the bomb was bigger than our sun.

The bomb wasn't brighter than the sun either, it was just closer.

I think sciences that deal in physics, and present state laws are genuine. They may be dangerous and used for evil, but they are dealing with what we actually have. The stuff that looks at dates and bones and nincompoop scenarios about what the universe or life was like in the beginning...are bogus.

But you would never think so if you gave the bible itself any skepticism.

Maybe so. However a space station reflects light. We can even see it go by sometimes. From earth, that looks like a star.

I have never seen a star move that quickly, and if stars were that close, we would be able to tell, we have been to space.

That is closer to the size of a molecule than it is to the size of the sun!

it was also a lot closer to Earth than the sun is. but did you read my link on how we tell how far away objects are?

Since we do NOT know the distance or size of lights in the universe, (outside our system) we can't assume that stars are sun sized.

Not all stars are the same as our sun, which is a roughly average sized star. But again, here come the maths: if stars were as small as you suggest, they would have to be proportionally closer to Earth in order for us to see their light. We would have been able to bring back stars from space if they were the size and distance you would have them be.

I have seen no evidence do that yet. I see people misunderstanding evidence and bible!

Maybe you are the one misunderstanding it, and they are the ones that are correct. Whoever "they" refers to.

It may be more mouthy about life in the fishbowl, but manscience is dead to the secrets of life and the universe and future and past.

And according to you, we won't learn anything about that until after we die. Which is bogus.

There is a way to test that.
We can see if my ideas fit the bible. We can also check if they oppose what is known by manscience. There is no doubt at all that it is impossible for one jot or tittle to fail in Scripture and prophesy. There is no possibility that creation was not real and done the way Scripture records it. There is no chance the future is like science says either.

Not only is this incorrect, but the opposite of what is true: the bible contradicts ITSELF, making it literally impossible for it all to be literally true.

That dull hypothesis is so small minded and puny, that it would be foolish to follow it to the conclusion that God is wrong and never created the universe.

I assume the authors of the bible are wrong, not the deity they are written about. Frankly, I don't think their language even had the vocabulary to portray the universe as it actually is.

The fact of the matter is that one cannot sail off into la la land and dreamsville simply because they decide to religiously follow some notion that the universe must be all the same because we know nothing else!

I never said it is all the same, as a matter of fact, time is known not to be consistent. Black holes make tons of stuff go wonky. I am just saying that your perception of how wonky it is has no basis in observation. You are just making pointless claims that only a fool would accept, under the circumstances.

I think of it more like maybe God set the stars in heaven for our benefit and for reasons that have to do with you, and me. Whether they help set time and timespace for us here near earth...and/or they have other reasons for us...the idea is that this earth is all important in the universe. One should not look out at the stars and assume we are just some little blue speck in a meaningless universe. Science is totally out to lunch.

Baseless claim, evidence required to generate response.

Looking at the fishermen in the boat, and the stormy seas, one could hardly claim it was some circus act. Jesus walked up to the boat in the middle of the lake. Peter was called out to walk on the water too. He did. Some trick.

Exaggeration is not only a thing, but something people are prone to. Also, lies are a thing as well. I know it makes you hurt internally, but the fact of the matter is, even if Jesus performed actual miracles, the recordings of them would not match the actual events perfectly.

No. That would be from a man. Different insertion method.

What if the doctor performing the procedure was a woman? Now what? In any case, I wouldn't have a broken hymen, I wouldn't have sex. I would still be a virgin, whether you like that prospect or not.

That is what people recorded and died for. There is no reason to doubt.

Then I should be a member of every religion, by that logic. Actually, given that Norse gods make permanent sacrifices for humanity, and do not punish on the basis of beliefs, I should actually support them. Go forth, bravely delaying the end of the world, even though you know in the end you will eventually fail! That is some admirable perseverance, wouldn't you say?

Since that book records Jesus saying that all the Scripture including Daniel, Moses and the prophets and Psalms are bang on...that'll do er.

Any book can claim all that it says is true, so can I. It's called LYING.

 

[dad]

You can't blame people for not viewing some of the choices god has made in the bible as... perfect.

They project their imperfections onto Him.

A lot of people view the afterlife as morally lacking, as murderers can be in heaven,

Nope, former murderers.

while generally neutral or even decent people end up in hell, all on the basis of belief alone.

It is only belief ( in Jesus) that saves us from hell. That is the only way.

If I were a believer in the same deity as you, I wouldn't view it as a good being at all. I would view it as a selfish, conceited, and childish being incapable of simple forgiveness for mistakes it already knew was going to happen, without getting something in return for it.

How God appears to man tells us how the man is, not how God is.

However, opinion of god is irrelevant; belief is what matters. The funniest thing about people saying atheists hate god, and just want to sin, is that if it were true, atheists would just be theists that lie, and all would go to heaven XD XD XD

Not really, there are multitudes of gods. It takes more that admitting they are real to avail ourselves of the gift Christ died to give us.

I am sure even you have questioned some of the content in the bible. Jesus gets mad at a fig tree for not having fruit, when it wasn't even the season for it. He is the OG table flipper.

Israel is symbolized by a fig tree. They killed their Messiah, and were dried up and God chose a new tree.

Name something god has actually done that was merciful, wonderful, and loving, that didn't require that people do something for it.

He came from the highest heaven to live as a man and make a way for anyone who asks to have eternal life by dying for us a painful death...and living a selfless life here.

If god were loving, the being would not demand anyone suffer for the sake of mere belief, or that everyone suffer for the crimes committed by a few. Heck, many of those that love are willing to forgive any atrocity without hesitation, even when that flies in the face of justice.

I do not need to suffer for the sins or atrocities of the world actually. He plead with us to accept salvation, so we do not have to suffer.

If god were merciful, nonbelievers wouldn't have a worse afterlife than believers do.

That is absurd. If I toss 2 lifelines to drowning men, and only one accepts it, it is not anyone else's fault that the other drowned.

If god were wonderful, then why does its creation suck so much, that it couldn't follow one simple rule?

Maybe we learn stuff.


Wat, and yes, the h is dropped to give more of an impression of -_- .

Then present the biblical evidence, or forever hold your writing hands, because according to you, anything not in the bible cannot be demonstrated to be any more than conjecture. If the bible doesn't say it, you cannot defend it.

It seems shallow to call for evidences while rejecting them. For example, the prophesies regarding Israel going into captivity for a certain number of years in a certain land, and then returning to their land. One would need to deny history.

I know for a fact that people do not become godlike in the Christian afterlife, unless you are a Mormon.

Yes we are more like Him then. Mormon smormon.

Also, that is a fate I wouldn't wish upon my worst enemy. Nothing is more empty than a life in which all is already known, and anything can be done without challenge.

Hey how would you know what challenges will exist? I suspect that righting all wrongs ever done may be somewhat of a challenge for example.

Does the bible say that there are more? Because if not, you can't defend it. I am playing by your rules here; if the bible doesn't say it, it is a baseless guess. You aren't allowed to add anything to it; that is sacrilegious.

It says that there are pleasures forever. Many folks find colors to be a pleasure....

Psalm 16:11 Thou wilt shew me the path of life: in thy presence is fulness of joy; at thy right hand there are pleasures for evermore.

Conjecture, if the bible doesn't say it, you don't get to claim it. If you don't have a biblical answer, say you don't know. That's the only biblically valid response you can have to those situations, and yet you have already proven my point in the fact that biblical heaven is vague by not only having to add your own material, but by never quoting the bible itself.

Ah, the bible does say it.

1Jo 4:18 -There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

Ps 37:4 -Delight thyself also in the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart.

There are many instances of Jeus knowing what people were really thinking..example..

Mt 9:4 - And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, Wherefore think ye evil in your hearts?

Now as for flying, Elijah caught a flying saucer, or flaming chariot! Jesus rose (flew) up to the sky!!

Bing and a bam and a boom..


post too long...shortened.....