You were dead?

[DamianWarS]

The difference between "you" and "we" in what Paul wrote is a single letter "we" is ἡμεῖς and you is ὑμείς. Let's hope that the copyists got it right because it looks like a lot is hanging on that one little letter.

Paul wrote in unical style without puncuation or accents. to our untrained eyes ἡμεῖς/ὑμείς may look extermely close especailly with the single contrasting character of ἡ/ὑ that could be confusing. but the original would be ΥΜΕΙΣ/ΗΜΕΙΣ and the single constrasting character is Υ/Η which seems easier to distinguish. If in fact it was a scribal error there should be some contrasting manuscripts to indicate this. Of course to blame something on a scribal error or some conspiracy when nothing indicates it would also be quite irrsponsible.

 

[GingerBeer]

Paul wrote in unical style without puncuation or accents.

Maybe maybe not. It's a little speculative to say what the original manuscripts were written like since no original has yet been found.

to our untrained eyes ἡμεῖς/ὑμείς may look extermely close especailly with the single contrasting character of ἡ/ὑ that could be confusing. but the original would be ΥΜΕΙΣ/ΗΜΕΙΣ and the single constrasting character is Υ/Η which seems easier to distinguish.

Paul didn't write the letters himself he had a scribe to write for him and the writing would be in some style of script but let's not assume that handwritten scripts are as clear as typed ones.

If in fact it was a scribal error there should be some contrasting manuscripts to indicate this. Of course to blame something on a scribal error or some conspiracy when nothing indicates it would also be quite irrsponsible.

It's a good thing that no one blamed it on scribes isn't it?

 

[DamianWarS]

Maybe maybe not. It's a little speculative to say what the original manuscripts were written like since no original has yet been found.

then you've contracted your own point as it would be a little speculative to say it was not clear enough for a scribe to know the difference between the characters Eta and Upsilon. perhaps the original letter had happy faces over all the "ΗΜΕΙΣ" to avoid scribal error... we don't know do we? but we can't just suggest error solely on the idea that it could happen.

Paul didn't write the letters himself he had a scribe to write for him and the writing would be in some style of script but let's not assume that handwritten scripts are as clear as typed ones.
It's a good thing that no one blamed it on scribes isn't it?

Whatever Paul wrote, or his scribe, it would look a lot closer to the unical style and was definitely not in miniscule (since that didn't come around until the 9/10th century) You brought up the suggestion of a scribal error but misunderstand me if you think I accuse you of defending this, however it still is your suggestion to which I answered. I point out it's flaws to save anyone who may get caught up in an idea that the text is less clear than it really is or refuse to believe the original says "we".

 

[GingerBeer]

refuse to believe the original says "we".

What I said was "copyist" and what is referred to is the single letter difference between "we" and "you" in Greek. There is a lot resting on that single letter for some theologies.

 

[DamianWarS]

What I said was "copyist" and what is referred to is the single letter difference between "we" and "you" in Greek. There is a lot resting on that single letter for some theologies.

why do you continue to passively promote this idea? Do you believe there was a copyist error or do you not? All you're doing is putting ambiguity in the text, start giving some real evidence if you actually think this is actually true.

 

[GingerBeer]

why do you continue to passively promote this idea? Do you believe there was a copyist error or do you not? All you're doing is putting ambiguity in the text, start giving some real evidence if you actually think this is actually true.

There could be copyist error involved, but it isn't too important unless you build a theology on it. I don't but some do. For me "we" and "you" don't change the meaning of the passage. It's not pivotal but others may see it as pivotal. Pivoting on a single letter in Greek.

 

[DamianWarS]

There could be copyist error involved, but it isn't too important unless you build a theology on it. I don't but some do. For me "we" and "you" don't change the meaning of the passage. It's not pivotal but others may see it as pivotal. Pivoting on a single letter in Greek.

But you are injecting suspicion into the text irresponsibly because for those who do base their theology around the changing of a single letter will use this as a case for corruption. Sure this can happen with anything we say but you know your words can be interpreted incorrectly but do nothing to stop it or positively impact the text. I could say maybe a copyist wrote the entire 2 chapter, but why would I say it if I don't believe it or am not willing to responsibly defend it? It's not a responsible way of handling the text or communicating it's meaning to others.