Yeah, okay... guilty

yedida · Dec 15, 2012

I'm in a dry desert myself. Been there for a long time now.It began before but came to a head in July of '11. The only thing that keeps me from dying of thirst is the forum fellowship.It's gotten a bit better since then, but I'm wondering if I'll ever get back where I was. It makes me want to cry sometimes. It's rough, I feel for you.

ChavaK · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
So it's another Shabbat. I know it's the most significant day of the week for MJs. It's also Chanukkah, a significant holiday for Jews and most MJs. But I dont feel excited about either one anymore to be honest. And it makes me feel guilty. That's alls I have to say for now.

I don't think you should feel guilty. Many people go through difficult times with their faith. It will all work out in the end. If you have no interest in Channukah or shabbat, perhaps it is time to take a step back and take a
break for a bit, and then reassess things.

May I ask how long you have been involved in the Messianic faith?

ChavaK · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
Thanks Jehoiakim and Visionary, I know I need fellowship, I must need it really badly. But everytime DH and I try joining in on a church or a small group or even an MJ synagogue, we're disappointed. Maybe it's us, maybe we're the problem.

It's not you. Many people have difficulty finding the right "fit".
I know I could visit dozens Reform or Conservative congregations and
I would be disappointed in them all. Perhaps you can make a list of what
you would like to see in a church/small group, and then prioritize them..
decide which things you must absolutely have, and which things you can
compromise on. Or maybe by attending a church for a month or two, you
can find a group of people you click with and be able to socialize/study with outside of the church setting.

ContraMundum · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
So it's another Shabbat. I know it's the most significant day of the week for MJs. It's also Chanukkah, a significant holiday for Jews and most MJs. But I dont feel excited about either one anymore to be honest. And it makes me feel guilty. That's alls I have to say for now.

I haven't felt excited about Shabbos for ages. When I was a kid, sure, but only a little because I got to see my friends.

Channukah, I like, but I don't get that excited about it. I like Christmas too, but again....nothing to rave about.

I just don't get excited about religious ritual and ceremonial stuff all that much. I don't feel guilty about it at all. I'd rather do things that make a difference.

ContraMundum · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
I dont wanna debate, see I cant even talk to MJs before they all get into a huff about something. :-/

I know, I know. Religious people mean well but can be a little obsessive about their beliefs at times- which feels toxic when you're in a flat spot.

Here's my take on this- I think the best way out of religious doldrums is keeping busy with the things that one is called to do. When you read that old Sermon on the Mount, you get a real clear picture of what the life of a person following this Yeshua guy is supposed to look like, and the emphasis shifts from from ceremonies and legal requirements to mitzvahs that focus on the heart of the Torah- God and neighbour.

So, when my enthusiasm is waning (as it is right now- overworked etc) I visit someone who is sick, or cook for someone, help a neighbour or whatever else I can find that is actually useful for this planet. Or- I just take a break from that all and watch some comedy for half an hour or play some music, call a friend, watch some sport or whatever. You gotta balance life with both living and service. Sometimes when religion is the centre of your world you forget to live a little.

Just remember- this too will pass.

ContraMundum · Dec 16, 2012

WOFFED said:
Going through a similar drought. I realize how eminent is Daniel's 70th week (7 years), the fiscal cliff, America's moral decay and the not too bright future for my children and grandchildren.

Serious advice- turn off the tv. You'll feel better about the world in a week, and you'll be surprised how much predicted disaster just doesn't happen.

Part of the problem is that Americans have been living in a kind of fool's paradise: Plastic money, Watching too much TV and Not focusing our heart, mind, soul(eyes) and strength on Y'shua like we know all so well is the answer to our heartfelt cry

There ya go. That's the answer. That box will build you a nasty world view and fog the beauty of day to day living with friends, family and neighbour.

Avodat · Dec 16, 2012

ContraMundum said:
I haven't felt excited about Shabbos for ages. When I was a kid, sure, but only a little because I got to see my friends.

Channukah, I like, but I don't get that excited about it. I like Christmas too, but again....nothing to rave about.

I just don't get excited about religious ritual and ceremonial stuff all that much. I don't feel guilty about it at all. I'd rather do things that make a difference.

I agree. I've just been speaking about these things, today. Chanukah, Shabbos, Christmas are only celebrations or religious ritual. None of these things will make people believers in G_d - there are many pagans in the world who mark these events in their lives, many do so more religiously than us! It doesn't make them into Jews, Christians or MJ's or even better Jews, Christians or MJ's; it leaves them as just as they areagans! We do not gain salvation by these things, as such.

But this is not a new problem. G_d told his people he had not told them to follow the feasts and offer sacrifices - but, of course, he did, as we all know. Was G_d telling lies? No. He was making the point that their hearts were really not in line with what their other senses were doing; it was mere lip-service that they were offering. Unless these feasts have compelling reasons in our life to observe them because of who G_d is, what G_d does and how G_d relates to us and we to him, then don't waste your time. He says he will not even listen to our prayers!

If we feel we are dry, 'doing' feasts will not help us, as the OP says. We need to go back and focus on the One who set the feasts and who calls us to show our love for him by being obedient to him - not by being obedient to our own need to be 'religious' on occasions.

visionary · Dec 16, 2012

We all have offer a wide range of advice, but the bottom line is re-establishing your relationship with HIm, and He will guide you to that which will satisfy your soul.

JRSut1000 · Dec 16, 2012

I've been MJ for about 4 years now.

I know that Shabbat and the feasts arent everything, but I guess I feel I should have more enthusiasm about it.

It may help to note that my new little baby is a month old and I'm experiencing a lot of stress around that, seems like he's going through some colic and after having gone through colic for about 5 months with my first, this is quite stressful having to deal with lots of crying again as well as a whining 2 year old. Dont get me wrong, I totally love both my kids but my life feels useless as I'm only able to do the bare minimum in life - eat sleep feed baby. Things like eating with both hands or even taking a quick shower are sheer luxury and I really have time for nothing else. I havent done laundry in days.

jehoiakim · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
I've been MJ for about 4 years now.

I know that Shabbat and the feasts arent everything, but I guess I feel I should have more enthusiasm about it.

It may help to note that my new little baby is a month old and I'm experiencing a lot of stress around that, seems like he's going through some colic and after having gone through colic for about 5 months with my first, this is quite stressful having to deal with lots of crying again as well as a whining 2 year old. Dont get me wrong, I totally love both my kids but my life feels useless as I'm only able to do the bare minimum in life - eat sleep feed baby. Things like eating with both hands or even taking a quick shower are sheer luxury and I really have time for nothing else. I havent done laundry in days.

that would wear out anyone, hang in there sister it will not last forever.

visionary · Dec 16, 2012

I had a girlfriend who had six children and a at home employment. She was tearing her hair out from multidirectional stretching of her mind, body and strength too. Shear exhaustion was taking over. She prayed one day for the Lord to organize her day for her, and the next day her life came at her one at a time, rather than in batches, which put her stress level way down, and she felt more in control of her life, and happier with her accomplishments to get things done without interruptions. Just a thought, maybe the Lord can help you too.

Avodat · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
I've been MJ for about 4 years now.

I know that Shabbat and the feasts arent everything, but I guess I feel I should have more enthusiasm about it.

It may help to note that my new little baby is a month old and I'm experiencing a lot of stress around that, seems like he's going through some colic and after having gone through colic for about 5 months with my first, this is quite stressful having to deal with lots of crying again as well as a whining 2 year old. Dont get me wrong, I totally love both my kids but my life feels useless as I'm only able to do the bare minimum in life - eat sleep feed baby. Things like eating with both hands or even taking a quick shower are sheer luxury and I really have time for nothing else. I havent done laundry in days.

Thanks - that changes things considerably! Concentrate on you, your child and your family. If G_d is not big enough to handle the times we need to step back and sort out these matters then he is not the loving G_d I thought he was. Take time out - he knows, cares and understands these needs we have. Do not concern yourself with what other people may say - G_d will not cease to love you all - he will bless you all the more, as your needs come before him in prayer. He is not just there for the good times

ChavaK · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
I've been MJ for about 4 years now.

Reason I asked is that in my experience converts to Judaism (or BT's) often hit the wall either at 5 years or at 10 years. They get burned out.
But they get over it.

It may help to note that my new little baby is a month old and I'm experiencing a lot of stress around that

No doubt that is contributing to the issue. Can you take a day off? Treat yourself to a day at the spa, have a facial, get your nails done, soak in
a hot tub or sauna, etc? A day to pamper yourself and relax may help a lot.

WOFFED · Dec 16, 2012

jehoiakim said:
maybe you guys need to think about where you can establish yourselves around a messianic community you want to be with. If I felt I needed a stronger connection to other Messianics I would start looking around Hudson WI, or western MN to be a part of Beth Immanuel because I think they are really really solid. I know your husband is being deployed soon so I assume you have to be near a military base? How much longer is he in the military for? Is it a life long thing or a get out and go through college thing? Where are you guys at? I'd be happy to look through my connections and see if I can help you find a place to plug into, even when it looks sparse sometimes you just need to know where to look.

OK, assume you both are aware of Seed of Abraham in Minnetonka, where I occasionally attend. Park Assembly in St. Louis Park is another small congregation offering good fellowship.

Would also recommend that she consider occasionally attending the beautiful new Beth El Synagogue in St. Louis Park. Sabes Jewish Community Center offers special events that surrounding community is more than welcome to attend. You both may have taken in some of the special healing and prophetic conferences at Redeeming Love Church with speakers like Randy Clark, Heidi Baker and Bill Johnson (just to mention a few). It's not like this area is limited when it comes to faithful fellowship that's available in this area. So, it's undertandable why some of us (including me) are feeling somewhat quilty.

jehoiakim · Dec 16, 2012

Woffed...

sorry I am not aware of any of those congregations as I am not from the Midwest. I was just saying if I were that frustrated I would consider up and moving to a place where I knew there was a solid congregation. I also have no idea where JRSut1000 is either

JRSut1000 · Dec 16, 2012

Im not in that area either. I'm live in the Southeast. Like I said, we only know of 1 messianic congregation within driving distance and I wasnt too fond of it for the reasons I already mentioned it. I honestly prefer speakers like Bill Johnson (though I do listen to some messianic people on Youtube and learn a lot that way) and find him so refreshing because it seems more real to me than just theology.

No. cant take a day out alone yet, bubs is only 1 month old and is EBF (dont have enough pumped yet to give someone a bottle to give him). The only place I've ever gone so far is the store (with the baby and my husband/toddler) and 1 restaurant (also with baby in tow) which is truly a huge vacation to me since he does best when he's out and about. But no matter what, he's always with me at this stage of the game.

LittleLambofJesus · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
So it's another Shabbat. I know it's the most significant day of the week for MJs. It's also Chanukkah, a significant holiday for Jews and most MJs. But I dont feel excited about either one anymore to be honest. And it makes me feel guilty. That's alls I have to say for now.

JRSut1000 said:
Guess I was hoping for some wisdom from my brethren here. I feel so much disconnect from everything and everybody right now when it comes to spirituality.

I like the way Paul's bro, James, put it

James 3:
13 Who [is] wise and intelligent among you? let him shew out of the good behaviour his works in meekness of wisdom,
14 and if bitter zeal ye have, and rivalry in your heart, glory not, nor lie against the truth;
15 this wisdom is not descending from above, but earthly, physical, demon-like,
16 for where zeal and rivalry [are], there is insurrection and every evil matter;
17 and the wisdom from above, first, indeed, is pure, then peaceable, gentle, easily entreated, full of kindness and good fruits, uncontentious, and unhypocritical: --
18 and the fruit of the righteousness in peace is sown to those making peace.

yedida · Dec 16, 2012

JRSut1000 said:
Im not in that area either. I'm live in the Southeast. Like I said, we only know of 1 messianic congregation within driving distance and I wasnt too fond of it for the reasons I already mentioned it. I honestly prefer speakers like Bill Johnson (though I do listen to some messianic people on Youtube and learn a lot that way) and find him so refreshing because it seems more real to me than just theology.

No. cant take a day out alone yet, bubs is only 1 month old and is EBF (dont have enough pumped yet to give someone a bottle to give him). The only place I've ever gone so far is the store (with the baby and my husband/toddler) and 1 restaurant (also with baby in tow) which is truly a huge vacation to me since he does best when he's out and about. But no matter what, he's always with me at this stage of the game.

As far as being tired goes, I don't know how viable this is, but it worked for me (I was a stay-at-home mom too, only for me it was more forced than planned - no car.)
One of the things that helped me (and I only had one baby) was a swap-off. Someone hauled their kid(s) into my apartment for a few hours every other week, leaving me the freedom to just do whatever (or nothing, like sleeping) while I was right there if needed (sometimes it was a younger person, 12, 13 years old) and the next week I'd take my child into their apartment and return the favor (or if it was a youngster, I'd walk with her/him to the mall or do something their parents refused or wasn't able to do (sometimes for the youngster it was just a matter of choosing a time my baby's father was playing with her to just give 2-3 hours of undivided attention to this kid).
Even just 3-4 hours turned out to be so helpful! It seemed that whatever was needed (on both sides) somethow got addressed and everyone benefitted. You might look into this and see if it could be helpful in your situation.

Temptinfates · Dec 16, 2012

Well,
I do get excited about the sabbath. No matter how I feel, I can always know or remember.
There was slavery in Egypt for 400 years. No day of rest..just work. Adonai sent Moshe to bring Israel out. He established that we/they would have a day set aside to rest and to worship him. That is good stuff!
We all have down days sometimes. Sometimes I have been alone and it was a great time just to read, think, and pray about things. Some of these times have been the better growing periods I have had. Sometimes, we have to encourage ourself. Sometimes others can help. I remember That my G-d Adonai gave rest when there was no rest. May he do the same for you.
Temptinfates

visionary · Dec 17, 2012

Yeah, the idea of rest sounds so good...Shabbat, what a welcomed time!!!! It takes a whole day of rest to recover from the whole week... lol

I am southeast... maybe a little too far.. cause I don't know where you are in relationship to me. ... pm me and we can see if I may be able to help.

Yeah, okay... guilty

Ruth Messianic, joining Israel, Na'aseh v'nishma!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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