Written in stone

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

Dr Bruce Atkinson said:
What I think may not be important, but following the New Testament scriptures, here is what the early Church thought and put into "concrete" in 325 AD at the Council of Nicea-- hence, the Nicene Creed (which is accepted by almost all Christian denominations and churches with only a few minor variations-- and those differences are not about the Trinitarian nature of God):.

We believe in one God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the Virgin Mary, and was made man, and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate. He suffered and was buried, and the third day he rose again according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of the Father. And he shall come again with glory to judge both the quick and the dead, whose kingdom shall have no end.
And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father [and the Son,] who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, who spoke by the prophets. And we believe one holy [universal] and apostolic Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.

One God, in three Persons. It is a mystery and a true paradox. Do not expect to fully understand it; simply accept it.

Although our less than three pounds of brain cannot fully conceive it, it is provable in the scriptures-- as many have shown here.

"For My thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways My ways,'' declares the Lord. "As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways and My thoughts than your thoughts. As the rain and the snow come down from heaven, and do not return to it without watering the earth and making it bud and flourish,so that it yields seed for the sower and bread to the eater, so shall My word be that goes forth from My mouth; it will not return to Me empty, but will accomplish what I desire, and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.”
(Isaiah 55:8-11, NIV)

The only thing written in stone is the 10 commandments.

here is what the early Church thought and put into "concrete" in 325 AD at the Council of Nicea-One God, in three Persons. It is a mystery and a true paradox. Do not expect to fully understand it; simply accept it.-

What do the 10 commandments say about God?

I am the Lord thy God! Thou shalt have no other Gods but me!
Thou shalt not take the Name of the Lord thy God in vain!

“Jesus said to him, ‘“You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.” This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like it: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.’” (Matthew 22:37-40)

Does it sound like any of these are talking about 3 persons or just one God?

We know that Paul was talking about all persons here ... “Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. For the commandments, ‘You shall not commit adultery,’ ‘You shall not murder,’ ‘You shall not steal,’ ‘You shall not bear false witness,’ ‘You shall not covet,’ and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.” (Romans 13:8-10)

But WHO did Paul think met him on the road to Damascus? Do you think he met the one true God or does he teach he met one person of the three that are God? If he does I have never seen it.

My personal belief (not being associated with any denominational dogma) is that God is triune in nature. We are also triune beings in the image of God. The relationship of the 3 aspects of mankind and God can be traced thru-out the bible.
(Matthew 22:37-40)

Thoughts ...

One Of The Elect · Oct 9, 2017

~Cassia~ said:
The only thing written in stone is the 10 commandments.
What do the 10 commandments say about God?

I am the Lord thy God! Thou shalt have no other Gods but me!
Thou shalt not take the Name of the Lord thy God in vain!

“Jesus said to him, ‘“You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.” This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like it: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.’” (Matthew 22:37-40)

Does it sound like any of these are talking about 3 persons or just one God?

We know that Paul was talking about all persons here ... “Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. For the commandments, ‘You shall not commit adultery,’ ‘You shall not murder,’ ‘You shall not steal,’ ‘You shall not bear false witness,’ ‘You shall not covet,’ and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.” (Romans 13:8-10)

But WHO did Paul think met him on the road to Damascus? Do you think he met the one true God or does he teach he met one person of the three that are God? If he does I have never seen it.

My personal belief (not being associated with any denominational dogma) is that God is triune in nature. We are also triune beings in the image of God. The relationship of the 3 aspects of mankind and God can be traced thru-out the bible.
(Matthew 22:37-40)

Thoughts ...

The Holy Trinity is the Father , the Son and the Holy Spirit , you can not have one without the other. They are the perfect heart , soul and mind, that our heart , soul and mind is designed after. They teach love to our hearts with Christ, the Holy Spirit dwells in our souls through love and our minds become filled with the knowledge of God.

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

One Of The Elect said:
The Holy Trinity is the Father , the Son and the Holy Spirit , you can not have one without the other. They are the perfect heart , soul and mind, that our heart , soul and mind is designed after. They teach love to our hearts with Christ, the Holy Spirit dwells in our souls through love and our minds become filled with the knowledge of God.

Trinity as in triune I agree. There are too many scriptures that talk about the almighty, the spirit of Christ etc to have written in stone that which is debatable about the oneness of God. It is after all HIS NAME we are debating and passing judgement on.

One Of The Elect · Oct 9, 2017

~Cassia~ said:
Trinity as in triune I agree. There are too many scriptures that talk about the almighty, the spirit of Christ etc to have written in stone that which is debatable about the oneness of God. It is after all HIS NAME we are debating and passing judgement on.

I am not debating or judging- God is One. And is why you can not have one without the other. And is why we are told to baptize in the name of Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. I am simply saying The Triune God is the perfect ,heart, soul and mind.

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

One Of The Elect said:
I am not debating or judging- God is One. And is why you can not have one without the other. And is why we are told to baptize in the name of Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. I am simply saying The Triune God is the perfect ,heart, soul and mind.

I agree to being baptized fully aware of all aspects of God but..

~Cassia~ said:
....WHO did Paul think met him on the road to Damascus? Do you think he met the one true God or does he teach he met one person of the three that are God? ...

One Of The Elect · Oct 9, 2017

~Cassia~ said:
I agree to being baptized fully aware of all aspects of God but..

He who sees the Son , sees the Father and you can not have the Father without the Son. Who did He see?
No one has seen the Father except the Son. If you see God you are going to see the Son. The Son is the manifestation of God the Father.John1:18" No one has ever seen God; the only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has made Him known." John 6:46 Not that any one has seen the Father except Him who is from God has seen the Father.

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

One Of The Elect said:
He who sees the Son , sees the Father and you can not have the Father without the Son. Who did He see?
No one has seen the Father except the Son. If you see God you are going to see the Son. The Son is the manifestation of God the Father.John1:18" No one has ever seen God; the only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has made Him known." John 6:46 Not that any one has seen the Father except Him who is from God has seen the Father.

Because the Father is Spirit we who worship Him must do so in spirit. So in that sense the Father relates to the human spirit of mankind, which is the place from which we can commune with the Holy Spirit, from where our conscience is located and from where we intuitively hear His instruction. In fact that is where everything about God is located when we're reborn. The Spirit brings to mind the things of Christ, that which Jesus experienced during His life in the flesh and that which He thought that has been recorded for us. In that God experienced and is not ignorant of, what we experience also in the flesh, while guiding the mind and soul to relate to the world as Jesus exemplified.

Tigger45 · Oct 9, 2017

Acts 9:20 this is where Saul/Paul finally puts it all together realizing who Jesus truly was. Jews 'which Paul was highly educated in Jewish law' knew that anyone claiming to be the messiah was committing blasphemy and his followers were worthy of death if not true. But it was true being verified by his encounter with the Son of God/God incarnate on the road to Damascus. Now Jesus has a dual nature that of God and man. His God nature makes Him one in God with the Father and the Holy Spirit but His 'person hood' is that of Jesus.

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

Tigger45 said:
Acts 9:20 this is where Saul/Paul finally puts it all together realizing who Jesus truly was. Jews 'which Paul was highly educated in Jewish law' knew that anyone claiming to be the messiah was committing blasphemy and his followers were worthy of death if not true. But it was true being verified by his encounter with the Son of God/God incarnate on the road to Damascus. Now Jesus has a dual nature that of God and man. His God nature makes Him one in God with the Father and the Holy Spirit but His 'person hood' is that of Jesus.

Hi Tig, that leads into the question ... what is the 'personhood' of the Holy Spirit and the Father?

Tigger45 · Oct 9, 2017

~Cassia~ said:
Hi Tig, that leads into the question ... what is the 'personhood' of the Holy Spirit and the Father?

Exactly that, the Father and the Holy Spirit. Primarily known through scripture by the rolls they play in creation and the redemption of that creation. Their roles often are seen over lapping and intertwining which can blur lines of distinction as persons but a natural effect of a triune God who is one in purpose and essence.

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

Tigger45 said:
Exactly that, the Father and the Holy Spirit. Primarily known through scripture by the rolls they play in creation and the redemption of that creation. Their rolls often are seen over lapping and intertwining which can blur lines of distinction as persons but a natural effect of a triune God who is one in purpose and essence.

Yes, well that is where everyone does agree but in silliness insist that to use the term roles is anti-Nicene. What it is not is anti-Christain.

Tigger45 · Oct 9, 2017

~Cassia~ said:
Yes, well that is where everyone does agree but in silliness insist that to use the term roles is anti-Nicene. What it is not is anti-Christain.

Well I am no scholar by any means proven by my poor spelling skills but you would need to show me where and how the term 'roles' is an improper dis-scripture for that analogy.

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

Tigger45 said:
Well I am no scholar by any means proven by my poor spelling skills but you would need to show me where and how the term 'roles' is an improper dis-scripture for that analogy.

The terms roles just like trinity is not found in scripture to divide the offices of the One True God. Nor is the term persons of God. That is what Dr Bruce Atkinson says is cemented that we just have to believe on faith. However that involves problems of inclusion or exclusion of people claiming to follow Jesus based on word definitions of how they view God as being One.

Tigger45 · Oct 9, 2017

~Cassia~ said:
The terms roles just like trinity is not found in scripture to divide the offices of the One True God. Nor is the term persons of God. That is what Dr Bruce Atkinson says is cemented that we just have to believe on faith. However that involves problems of inclusion or exclusion of people claiming to follow Jesus based on word definitions of how they view God as being One.

Well then Dr Bruce Atkinson is silly because I'll guarantee you that if we got a script of any number of his sermons on any biblical topic, there would be many terms not directly outlined in scripture that he has used explaining and teaching congregations gathered before him.

The test would be is it an accurate dis-scription of the roll oops role of a particular person of the God head. For instance Jesus hung on a cross as one of His roles in the redemption of mankind.

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

Perhaps we should hear from @Dr Bruce Atkinson on this. It was his post that got me thinking about the Nicene Code being a stone feature of CF. When you think about it the Nicene Code was written before Islam began. They go by the wording of the Nicene Code to say that Christians worship 3 Gods. And tbh I can see why they say that because lots of christians do believe there are 3 gods instead of the multifaceted God we have to deal with.

Ephesians 3:8-12
This grace was given to me—the least of all the saints—to proclaim to the Gentiles the incalculable riches of the Messiah, 9 and to shed light for all about the administration of the mystery hidden for ages in God who created all things. 10 This is so God’s multi-faceted wisdom may now be made known through the church to the rulers and authorities in the heavens. 11 This is according to His eternal purpose accomplished in the Messiah, Jesus our Lord. 12 In Him we have boldness and confident access through faith in Him

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

~Cassia~ said:
. However that involves problems of inclusion or exclusion of people claiming to follow Jesus based on word definitions of how they view God as being One.

Or is there more to it than that? What are your thoughts?

Citizen of the Kingdom · Oct 9, 2017

Edited to remove 5th amendment content ... Just saying that three in One is the common denominator

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