Would you shoot a home invader?

[Rick Otto]

No Christian in the NT killed anyone. You have proof otherwise? How is killing someone being merciful???

The Holy Spirit snuffed an elderly couple, but that's beside the point. No christian in the NT is faced with a home invader. Paul described a believer who couldn't stop sinning and God took him early, sparing him worse judgement, and sparing the reputation of His church especialy that man's local congregation.

Killing the home invader may be more merciful to yourself, wife & children, than being "trusting in God".
"Trust in God & tie up your camels." is an old Semite saying that puts that in perspective.

 

[Duckybill]

The Holy Spirit snuffed an elderly couple, but that's beside the point. No christian in the NT is faced with a home invader. Paul described a believer who couldn't stop sinning and God took him early, sparing him worse judgement, and sparing the reputation of His church especialy that man's local congregation.

Killing the home invader may be more merciful to yourself, wife & children, than being "trusting in God".
"Trust in God & tie up your camels." is an old Semite saying that puts that in perspective.

God doesn't go by the rules He gave us. Christians in the NT were murdered, but none killed anyone. Killing someone is playing God and Judge. We are to show mercy to our enemies. Killing them is not mercy to them. Nor is it doing good to them.

"Love your enemies. Do good to those who hate you."

 

[Rick Otto]

I would be good & merciful to him & others to end the invader's criminal career. I would be playing the good Provider & Protector to my family & the good Home Defender to his playing the bad Home Invader & quite possibly his playing God & Judge with me & my family.
Like I said, I don't play God, I let God be God, & I don't invade homes.

Might be fair of you to warn your family that you intend not to physicaly defend them from home invaders. You know,.. "just when ya think ya know a guy..."

 

[Duckybill]

I would be good & merciful to him & others to end the invader's criminal career.

How is sending someone to Hell being merciful to him?

I would be playing the good Provider & Protector to my family & the good Home Defender to his playing the bad Home Invader & quite possibly his playing God & Judge with me & my family.

Who gave us the right to play God and Judge?

Like I said, I don't play God, I let God be God, & I don't invade homes.

Don't you believe in obeying Jesus?
"Do not resist an evil person"

Might be fair of you to warn your family that you intend not to physicaly defend them from home invaders. You know,.. "just when ya think ya know a guy..."

Many die 'defending' themselves, but we who trust in God's Word will be safe.

Proverbs 29:25 (NKJV)
25 The fear of man brings a snare, But whoever trusts in the Lord shall be safe.

 

[Dionysiou]

How is sending someone to Hell being merciful to him?

Who gave us the right to play God and Judge?

Don't you believe in obeying Jesus?
"Do not resist an evil person"

Many die 'defending' themselves, but we who trust in God's Word will be safe.

Proverbs 29:25 (NKJV)
25 The fear of man brings a snare, But whoever trusts in the Lord shall be safe.

i think ive mentioned this before to you or someone, but christians have died or been persecuted while waiting for God to miraculously deliver them. Aside from that, its not one persons life we are dealing with here, if you have a family, you have a God given RESPONSIBILITY to look after them and protect them. God appoints the man as the head of the home, you should act accordingly.

 

[Duckybill]

i think ive mentioned this before to you or someone, but christians have died or been persecuted while waiting for God to miraculously deliver them.

Interesting, but does that prove anything? There were 'special' people in the Bible who died trusting God, but they are exceptions. God would not allow them to share any of His glory. I.E. the writers of the Bible, His Apostles.

Aside from that, its not one persons life we are dealing with here, if you have a family, you have a God given RESPONSIBILITY to look after them and protect them. God appoints the man as the head of the home, you should act accordingly.

There are no excuses for killing anyone. That is saying 'GOD IS NOT FAITHFUL TO DO WHAT HE PROMISED!' I.E. "The Lord is my helper"! Does He or doesn't He help His own?

Acts 16:31 Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved, YOU AND YOUR HOUSEHOLD!

Is it true or is it a big myth?

 

[Inviolable]

Would you shoot a home invader?

Why or why not?

I have never had anyone break into my home and I hope I never do.

But I do know an elderly woman who owns rental properties.
A few of those properties are in, not so friendly places.
One of her tenants was renting a house that kept getting broken into.
The back of the house had a big glass window. And the robbers would break the glass and walk threw the window.
They would then hold the renter up at gun point and steal everything out of his house. It happened 5 times! Finally the landlady had unbreakable glass installed. The robbers simply broke threw the front door after that.
Because they knew the house was easy pickings.
Finally, the man who was renting the house got a gun permit and purchased his own gun.
The robbers came back and he shot them dead.

In a situation like that, I think I might shoot a robber.
Any other situation, I really couldn't say.

A thought came to me while reading the rest of the thread.
You know, there are emotional boundaries that can be breached and a persons faith can be lost.
It's up to you and you alone to decide what tools God has given you to deal with the problems that come your way.
Because God won't let anything happen that you can't handle.
Let's just say, in that respect, a robber could take your faith away and God knows this.
So what if, someone could physically take away your faith in God?
And they broke into your home to do so.
Would you shoot them then?

 

[Rick Otto]

quote=Duckybill; There are no excuses for killing anyone.

I gave a reason, not an excuse. There is no excuse for not protecting your family.

That is saying 'GOD IS NOT FAITHFUL TO DO WHAT HE PROMISED!' I.E. "The Lord is my helper"! Does He or doesn't He help His own?

Not in the way you suggest. "That is saying" I DON"T HAVE TO BE RESPONSIBLE GOD WILL FIX EVERYTHING!

Acts 16:31 Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved, YOU AND YOUR HOUSEHOLD!

Is it true or is it a big myth?

Your understanding of it is a big myth. That is saying those who suffered home invasions were unbelievers.
Is it true, or a big misunderstanding?

 

[Bro_Sam]

God doesn't go by the rules He gave us. Christians in the NT were murdered, but none killed anyone.

But, as someone else pointed out, where are we told that anyone mentioned in the New Testament was put into a situation where it was necessary to kill someone?

What about all of the Christians who were not mentioned in the New Testament? Isn't it possible that they may have found it necessary to kill someone?

Killing someone is playing God and Judge. We are to show mercy to our enemies. Killing them is not mercy to them. Nor is it doing good to them.

Where does the Bible say that we're to allow thieves and home invaders to kill us? More importantly, where does the Bible say that we're to stand by and watch while thieves and home invaders kill our wives and our children?

Why are you more concerned with doing good to a violent criminal than to your own family?

"Love your enemies. Do good to those who hate you."

"Sell your cloak and go buy a sword."

 

[Bro_Sam]

How is sending someone to Hell being merciful to him?

You do understand that it's God who sends people to Hell, right?

Don't you believe in obeying Jesus?
"Do not resist an evil person"

You understand that has nothing to do with defending your wife and children, right?

Many die 'defending' themselves, but we who trust in God's Word will be safe.

If that were true, then there would be no martyrs.

Proverbs 29:25 (NKJV)
25 The fear of man brings a snare, But whoever trusts in the Lord shall be safe.

Actually, this verse has nothing to do with physical safety. It's talking about those who follow God's law being exalted, as opposed to those who follow the world and are destroyed.

 

[Duckybill]

I gave a reason, not an excuse. There is no excuse for not protecting your family.

One can also say there is no excuse for Christians not to believe God will keep His many promises to protect His own and families.

Not in the way you suggest. "That is saying" I DON"T HAVE TO BE RESPONSIBLE GOD WILL FIX EVERYTHING!

That is saying I believe God is faithful to do what He said.

Psalm 91:10-11 (NKJV)
10 No evil shall befall you, Nor shall any plague come near your dwelling; 11 For He shall give His angels charge over you, To keep you in all your ways.

Your understanding of it is a big myth. That is saying those who suffered home invasions were unbelievers.
Is it true, or a big misunderstanding?

God's promises are not myth. They are true for we who believe them.

Proverbs 29:25 (NKJV)
25 The fear of man brings a snare, But whoever trusts in the Lord shall be safe.

If we can't believe this, how can we believe John 3:16???

 

[Rick Otto]

quote=Duckybill;One can also say there is no excuse for Christians not to believe God will keep His many promises to protect His own and families.
That is saying I believe God is faithful to do what He said.

One can also say God did do what He said by providing me to protect my family.

Psalm 91:10-11 (NKJV)
10 No evil shall befall you, Nor shall any plague come near your dwelling; 11 For He shall give His angels charge over you, To keep you in all your ways.
God's promises are not myth. They are true for we who believe them.

Except we're considering the believer whose home has been invaded.

Proverbs 29:25 (NKJV)
25 The fear of man brings a snare, But whoever trusts in the Lord shall be safe.

I trust the lord will make my shots count.

 

[Duckybill]

But, as someone else pointed out, where are we told that anyone mentioned in the New Testament was put into a situation where it was necessary to kill someone?

Acts 7:59-60 (NKJV)
59 And they stoned Stephen as he was calling on God and saying, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." 60 Then he knelt down and cried out with a loud voice, "Lord, do not charge them with this sin." And when he had said this, he fell asleep.

Acts 12:1-3 (NKJV)
1 Now about that time Herod the king stretched out his hand to harass some from the church. 2 Then he killed James the brother of John with the sword. 3 And because he saw that it pleased the Jews, he proceeded further to seize Peter also.

What about all of the Christians who were not mentioned in the New Testament? Isn't it possible that they may have found it necessary to kill someone?

It's never "necessary" for a Christian to kill someone.

Matthew 5:39 (NKJV)
39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person.

Where does the Bible say that we're to allow thieves and home invaders to kill us? More importantly, where does the Bible say that we're to stand by and watch while thieves and home invaders kill our wives and our children?

We either believe God's promises or we do not.

Hebrews 13:6 (NKJV)
6 So we may boldly say: "The Lord is my helper; I will not fear. What can man do to me?"

Why are you more concerned with doing good to a violent criminal than to your own family?

False statement.

"Sell your cloak and go buy a sword."

Humans can always find an excuse to kill rather than trust in God.

Matthew 26:52 (NKJV)
52 But Jesus said to him, "Put your sword in its place, for all who take the sword will perish by the sword.

 

[Wirraway]

One can also say God did do what He said by providing me to protect my family.
Except we're considering the believer whose home has been invaded.


I trust the lord will make my shots count.

just use a shotgun, with a duck bill spreader if you must.

 

[Duckybill]

You do understand that it's God who sends people to Hell, right?

I understand that it's our choice to kill or not.

You understand that has nothing to do with defending your wife and children, right?

Are you saying God doesn't care about our families enough to protect them?

If that were true, then there would be no martyrs.

Martyrs? Who would that be?

Actually, this verse has nothing to do with physical safety. It's talking about those who follow God's law being exalted, as opposed to those who follow the world and are destroyed.

Psalm 91:2-7 (NKJV)
2 I will say of the Lord, "He is my refuge and my fortress; My God, in Him I will trust." 3 Surely He shall deliver you from the snare of the fowler And from the perilous pestilence. 4 He shall cover you with His feathers, And under His wings you shall take refuge; His truth shall be your shield and buckler. 5 You shall not be afraid of the terror by night, Nor of the arrow that flies by day, 6 Nor of the pestilence that walks in darkness, Nor of the destruction that lays waste at noonday. 7 A thousand may fall at your side, And ten thousand at your right hand; But it shall not come near you.

Believe it? I do.

 

[addo]

So, should we let pedophiles that invade our homes rape our 7 year old daughter? Should we let criminals and sadists cut your arms and legs instead of just shooting them in the leg? Should we let rapists rape your wives instead of immobilizing them (by shooting them)? Should we let them burn your house with your family in?

 

[Duckybill]

So, should we let pedophiles that invade our homes rape our 7 year old daughter? Should we let criminals and sadists cut your arms and legs instead of just shooting them in the leg? Should we let rapists rape your wives instead of immobilizing them (by shooting them)? Should we let them burn your house with your family in?

Why wouldn't God wouldn't want to protect you and yours?

 

[addo]

Why wouldn't God wouldn't want to protect you and yours?

So should I wait for a lightning to struck to the window and immobilize the attacker (or other similar things)?

This reminds me of the joke where there was a man in the middle of a flood. A boat came by and he neglected going on it saying: "God will save me". It happened so the second and the third time. And then he died. Then he supposedly went to Heaven and asked God: why didn't you save me? He said: well ... it is recorded here that I sent you three boats.

Are you suggesting to do nothing in that situation (that a pedophile wants to rape your daughter or boy and the only way to stop him is to shoot him)?

 

[Wirraway]

trust God to provide that the shotgun is loaded and that you've got the right choke.

 

[onemorequestion]

So, should we let pedophiles that invade our homes rape our 7 year old daughter? Should we let criminals and sadists cut your arms and legs instead of just shooting them in the leg? Should we let rapists rape your wives instead of immobilizing them (by shooting them)? Should we let them burn your house with your family in?

I will glady stand before Jesus with a dead perp on my record, and my living children there as well.

Now, if it is for persecution that I and my family are to be subjected to, I do not think I can kill the persecutors.

But Jesus was clearly OK with the Disciples' being able to defend themslves when out and about in the world.

But obviously theer's a BIG difference between persecution and an assault for secular reasons.

To have the following placed where it is (Luke 22) is astounding:


35Then Jesus asked them, "When I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?"
"Nothing," they answered.
36He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. 37It is written: 'And he was numbered with the transgressors'; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment." 38The disciples said, "See, Lord, here are two swords."
"That is enough," he replied.