wise men

[simplyg123]

The Three Wisemen?


My Church did a study recently on the "3 wisemen". I soon learned something that was amazing.

Mat 2:1¶Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
Mat 2:2Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him
"I believe King Herod was also called that"

Mat 2:3When Herod the king had heard [these things], he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.

Now why would this be, why is all of jerusalem and A mighty King Herod troubled by 3 wise men??



well our study exposed the truth, the truth is their werent 3 wisemen, there were anywhere from 70 - 200, not to mention they traveled with over 1000 Guards, and they did not ride on camels, But the mighty steeds.

this would explain why Herod was so troubled along with the wholde city.


Our research showed us these wisemen were the Magi, which were thought to be arround since abraham. you can also read of them in Daniel

 

[eoe]

My Church did a study recently on the "3 wisemen". I soon learned something that was amazing.

Mat 2:1¶Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
Mat 2:2Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him
"I believe King Herod was also called that"

Yes. Herod was king at the time.

[URL="http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/popup.pl?book=Mat&chapter=2&verse=3&version=kjv#3"]Mat 2:3

When Herod the king had heard [these things], he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.

Now why would this be, why is all of jerusalem and A mighty King Herod troubled by 3 wise men??

[/URL]

If you were a king and you hard that a new king had been born you would not be bothered? Can there be 2 kings? Would it not mean that your kingship was likely to end?

well our study exposed the truth, the truth is their werent 3 wisemen, there were anywhere from 70 - 200, not to mention they traveled with over 1000 Guards, and they did not ride on camels, But the mighty steeds.

this would explain why Herod was so troubled along with the wholde city.

Huh?
Herod knew of the prophecy. He thought the new king would come and overthrow him. This is what he was attempting to stop by killing all the children.
This is not a big brain stretcher. No need for lots of people.
If Your wife came in and told you that she had found a new husband would you be upset or would it need to be 70+ people to tell you that to get you disturbed?

I gotta say I would LOVE to see where this info comes from....

 

[icxn]

He was troubled because of Christ being proclaimed a King of the Jews. Otherwise he would have slaughtered the Magi not all those poor infants.

 

[simplyg123]

imnot really sure, hisorical research , not really biblical, however i found an intersting article on th magi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi#The_Bethlehem_prophecy

i will find out the resources though

 

[simplyg123]

perhaps but the whole town of jerusalem? afraid of a king that might take over Herod, i would think they should be greatful

 

[eoe]

perhaps but the whole town of jerusalem? afraid of a king that might take over Herod, i would think they should be greatful

Why do you suppose that they would be grateful? The overthrow of a government is a fun thing?
At any rate - by "troubled" it could simply mean that they were stirred up and talking about it, not that they really were in fear.

 

[AllForJesus]

He was troubled because of Christ being proclaimed a King of the Jews. Otherwise he would have slaughtered the Magi not all those poor infants.

that's it!!


and they were only 3 because the bible says that!

 

[rollo]

show me where the bible says three not that i think there were 70 or whatever just saying it doesn't infact say 3 nor were they there the night Jesus was born. I would insert a rant about how messed up a lot of people's theologies are because they believe tv representations but yeah.

 

[icxn]

perhaps but the whole town of jerusalem? afraid of a king that might take over Herod, i would think they should be greatful

They weren't troubled with Christ becoming King. They were troubled because Herod being troubled meant troubles for them as the historic events proved.

 

[simplyg123]

Why do you suppose that they would be grateful? The overthrow of a government is a fun thing?
At any rate - by "troubled" it could simply mean that they were stirred up and talking about it, not that they really were in fear.

yes it Could, The fact is these wisemen were the Magi, and they did not travel in threes, but in armies, they brought great riches to bethlehem, did they carry all this Gold on a couple camels. i doubt it. These Magi were king makers, and very very important people

 

[izarya]

I consider myself a Mage (Magi is the plural form of the word)...that's what it says on my business cards anyway.

 

[Macrina]

We don't know how many magi there were, except that the plural form of the word indicates more than one. Three is the traditional number, from the number of gifts mentioned in the Bible. It might have been 2, or 3, or more for all we know.

Herod was disturbed because of the news of a new king, one great enough to bring visitors from afar. Without any further evidence, I have no reason to believe that the magi were so numerous as to frighten him.

 

[christianmomof3]

and they were only 3 because the bible says that!

Um no, the Bible does not say how many magi there were.

Matthew 2:1 Now after Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, magi from the east arrived in Jerusalem,

That is the point of this thread. We do not know how many there were because the Bible does not tell us any number. All we know is that there were 3 gifts given, but one person could have given two and another one could have given one. Or, two could have given one and another two shared another etc...
I do not think that there were 70 - that is a rather large number and I do think that might have been mentioned. But, we really don't know how many there were.

I would also like to see any evidence for the number 70 to 200 because that sounds unlikely to me.

I agree that Herod was disturbed because of the news that the King of the Jews had been born.

And, the magi did not arrive immediately after Jesus was born - but sometime within the first two years after He was born which is why in Matt. 2:16, Herod had all boys in Bethlehem and its borders from two years and under killed.

I think that is why we should all read the Bible for ourselves to find out what it really says rather than just go by what we have heard.

 

[simplyg123]

why is it so unlikely that god would have an army welcome his son into the world, Do some research on the Magi, they were very imprtant people and did not travel in small groups

 

[Macrina]

why is it so unlikely that god would have an army welcome his son into the world, Do some research on the Magi, they were very imprtant people and did not travel in small groups

Could you point me towards a book or article that is an example of this research?

 

[simplyg123]

Could you point me towards a book or article that is an example of this research?

in the works now, im having someone gather some of the resources now. I belive their are some articles of the magi on the internet, but be careful, i wouldnt want you to pull up something thats not legit

 

[ParsonJefferson]

that's it!!


and they were only 3 because the bible says that!

Well... actually the Bible does not say there were 3. I think we assume that because there were 3 specific types of gifts brought.

However, I don't think the number of Magi/Wisemen is significant.

 

[Macrina]

Well... actually the Bible does not say there were 3. I think we assume that because there were 3 specific types of gifts brought.

However, I don't think the number of Magi/Wisemen is significant.

Yes, it's the three gifts that gave rise to that tradition. I am not aware of any evidence of precisely how many there were.

Like you, I don't think it really matters how many. I'm open to hearing about this research that others have conducted (and no, I don't tend to trust the internet in many things), but at this point I see no reason why the number would be significant. I believe the indications in scripture show that Herod was threatened over the idea of a new king, and that would be the same whether there were two magi or two hundred.

 

[ParsonJefferson]

Yes, it's the three gifts that gave rise to that tradition. I am not aware of any evidence of precisely how many there were.

Like you, I don't think it really matters how many. I'm open to hearing about this research that others have conducted (and no, I don't tend to trust the internet in many things), but at this point I see no reason why the number would be significant. I believe the indications in scripture show that Herod was threatened over the idea of a new king, and that would be the same whether there were two magi or two hundred.

Absolutely!

Herod was an evil man - jealous, insecure and all those other things that come from having no relationship with God! 2 Magi or 200 wouldl have sent that suspicious man into a lather.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Whether three or seventy the Magi, and their treasures, would have been well guarded. Also, their whole entourage would have been impressive to say the least.

The killing of the children by Herod is also very interesting. This event is prophesied as "Rachael weeping for her children." As Leah was the mother of Judah (jews), it is likely that most of those children were Benjamites (as was Paul, and probably Peter, James, and other disciples) as their ancestral mother was Rachael. Of course Herod considered them all to be Jews, and that they were, religiously speaking.