Will Creation Science Ever Be Accepted By Mainstream Scientists?

[trutheverlasting]

Hi everybody, I'm new here

I'm a new Christian and a few months ago, I watched a long series of seminars by Dr. Kent Hovind on creation. After being indoctrinated with the tales of evolution for so long, his seminars really helped me strengthen my faith. I had doubts for so long, then after watching his arguments for creation, it really opened my eyes.

Wanting to share this new found knowledge, I tried sharing the video series with friends and family, but because most people aren't willing to watch hours and hours of video, everyone I shared it with seemed to ignore it. So I decided to launch a website that discusses all of the creationist arguments in all areas of science and does it in a non-aggressive, easy to understand kind of way, full of articles that people can quickly skim through or watch a quick video on.

I know there are several websites out there about creation, but this one is going to be new and different, and will cover metaphysics, parapsychology, and things of that sort as well.

In any case, it's a massive undertaking so if there is any creationists here who have some science background or even an interest in science, and have some time to write articles, let me know as I could definitely use your help and insight!

I really think there is a lot of evidence to support creation, it's just a matter of putting it all together, backing it up with proper research, and presenting it professionally... then maybe, just maybe, it might be taken seriously by mainstream scientists!

Do you Agree? Disagree? What do you think?

 

[The Cadet]

Hi everybody, I'm new here

I'm a new Christian and a few months ago, I watched a long series of seminars by Dr. Kent Hovind on creation. After being indoctrinated with the tales of evolution for so long, his seminars really helped me strengthen my faith. I had doubts for so long, then after watching his arguments for creation, it really opened my eyes

Not sure if serious...

Kent Hovind is nuts. Like, seriously, out of all the "mainstream" creationists, Kent Hovind is probably the one with the most insane stupid ideas, and given the competition, that's saying something. Please don't take this as a knock against you, but nothing he says is true. Not even his credentials; the man has a "PhD" from an unaccredited diploma mill and none of the high schools he taught at required any credentials whatsoever on account of being private schools run out of churches.

Perhaps a good place to start with regards to his ideas is here:

They're laughable.

Wanting to share this new found knowledge, I tried sharing the video series with friends and family, but because most people aren't willing to watch hours and hours of video, everyone I shared it with seemed to ignore it. So I decided to launch a website that discusses all of the creationist arguments in all areas of science and does it in a non-aggressive, easy to understand kind of way, full of articles that people can quickly skim through or watch a quick video on.

Do you have any credentials in any of the fields you're trying to reject? Do you actually have any education in the fields of geology, evolutionary development, molecular biology, chemistry, information technology, virology, paleontology, cosmology, astrophysics, or anything of the sort? If not, I'm not sure I see the point. You can't educate people on things you don't know, and if most of your knowledge comes from "Dr." Kent Hovind (calling him "Dr." is a slap in the face to anyone who actually had to work to get their PhD), then you know less than nothing, because Hovind lies non-stop.

In any case, it's a massive undertaking so if there is any creationists here who have some science background or even an interest in science, and have some time to write articles, let me know as I could definitely use your help and insight!

You don't need help from creationists. You need help from people who actually know something about the subject. And creationists typically don't fit the bill. Most of what young earth creationists believe is not just demonstrably wrong, but actually falls under the header of "PRATT" - points refuted a thousand times. Hovind's claims about carbon dating, for example.

I really think there is a lot of evidence to support creation, it's just a matter of putting it all together, backing it up with proper research, and presenting it professionally... then maybe, just maybe, it might be taken seriously by mainstream scientists!

Then don't make a website. You want your ideas taken seriously by mainstream science? Here's where you present it:

https://cts.sciencemag.org/scc/login.html

Or here:

http://www.nature.com/authors/submit_manuscript.html

Or here:

http://www.pnas.org/site/misc/onlinesubmission.shtml

Publish in peer-review. That is where every idea in science is tested. Not some random web page.

Of course, there is nothing in peer-review from creationism. Do you know why? It's because young earth creationism is wrong. And we've known it's wrong since the 1700s. Nothing published in support of it can stand up to any scrutiny.

I strongly recommend that instead of listening to insane crackpots like Hovind, you actually spend some time learning a thing or two about geology, cosmology, biology, or any of the other fields whose conclusions you seem to be disputing. The actual evidence for the mainstream non-creation view is very compelling. There's a reason Catholics take Genesis 1 as allegory. As RickG's signature says:

"It is not my reason, but my conscience which revolts here... I cannot... believe that God has written on the rocks one enormous and superfluous lie for all mankind." --Charles Kingsley

Either way, welcome to Christianforums.

 

[Gene2memE]

Creation science isn’t actual science. It’s apologetics wearing a stolen lab coat (instead of vestments).

It will never be accepted by mainstream scientists (barring say, reversion to a theocracy), as it starts with the answer already written down and then attempts to bends the evidence out of shape, or ignore it completely, to make fits with the creation pre-supposition.

Science is a process of inquiry. It begins with the evidence and follows that evidence to its logical conclusions, even if they don’t always like the answers. It’s not always correct, or even nice, but its attempting to get to a better explanation of the evidence.

When looked at a certain way, creation science BECAME science. Lots of naturalists, biologists, geologist and other ‘-ists’ set out to discover investigate natural world they though was made by a creator. What they found though were answers that were not supported by the pre-supposed answers of the church and the creation story. This – and a few other factors besides – helped to kick off the start of the Enlightenment.

 

[lesliedellow]

There is not a chance that so called "creation science" will ever be accepted as real science.

Is that because scientists are biased? Well, that conceivably might be the case for atheist scientists, but it definitely is not the case with mainstream Christian scientists. The reason the latter find "creation science" to be a bad joke is that all the evidence is piled against it, and too many people would have to be too wrong about too many things for there to be one chance in a trillion of "creation science" being anything other than what you flush down your loo.

 

[Armoured]

"Will Creation Science Ever Be Accepted By Mainstream Scientists?"

Yep. Just as soon as there's any scientific evidence for it.

 

[DogmaHunter]

"Will Creation Science Ever Be Accepted By Mainstream Scientists?"

Yep. Just as soon as there's any scientific evidence for it.

This.

 

[Ryukil]

"Will Creation Science Ever Be Accepted By Mainstream Scientists?"

Yep. Just as soon as there's any scientific evidence for it.

That's about the size of it.

Just realized OP is Seventh-Day Adventist, which requires belief in a literal 7 day creation. That's why Ben Carson is a YEC.

 

[lesliedellow]

I really think there is a lot of evidence to support creation

Well the universe is here, so, unless it has always been here, which few scientists believe nowadays, there was definitely a creation, but what there wasn't is a literal six day creation.

 

[Martinius]

Hovind is a man who flaunted the law for 28 years (his claim) because everything he owned and received belonged to God, then tried to use the bankruptcy law to protect his material wealth (or maybe he was trying to protect God's possesions). Didn't work as smart people saw thru his lies and and devious tactics. He is not a scientist, and has no real academic credentials whatsoever. I would caution the OP and anyone else from following someone who is basically a conspiracist and leader of a wacko cult.

 

[Ryukil]

Makes me wonder if Kent Hovind is just a con-man who doesn't believe what he says.

I've also seen people on Facebook saying that he was arrested BECAUSE he was a creationist and that the tax evasion stuff is bogus. Of course Poe's Law applies here, but if that's the case why isn't Ken Ham or Kent Hovind's son or any other creationist in jail? lol.

 

[Martinius]

Makes me wonder if Kent Hovind is just a con-man who doesn't believe what he says.

I've also seen people on Facebook saying that he was arrested BECAUSE he was a creationist and that the tax evasion stuff is bogus. Of course Poe's Law applies here, but if that's the case why isn't Ken Ham or Kent Hovind's son or any other creationist in jail? lol.

Exactly. Hovind reportedly admitted to his followers that he had not filed a tax return in 28 years, and advised them to do the same. The IRS cannot ignore such blatant violation of the law, irrespective of his beliefs.

 

[essentialsaltes]

I really think there is a lot of evidence to support creation, it's just a matter of putting it all together, backing it up with proper research, and presenting it professionally... then maybe, just maybe, it might be taken seriously by mainstream scientists!

That is absolutely the correct way to go about it.

Unfortunately for creationism, there really isn't much evidence to support it, and so no one is actually trying to follow that route in a scientific fashion. Instead, well... creationists make YouTube videos.

 

[Michael]

I really think there is a lot of evidence to support creation, it's just a matter of putting it all together, backing it up with proper research, and presenting it professionally... then maybe, just maybe, it might be taken seriously by mainstream scientists!

Do you Agree? Disagree? What do you think?

As others have already pointed out, even most Christians reject the concept simply because an overwhelming amount of evidence from the study of nature suggests that the Earth is very ancient, billions of years old according to science. Almost all arguments for YEC come from a literal interpretation of one specific religious book, namely the *Bible*, not from a "scientific source", or from standard observations of nature. That should be your first clue that the "evidence" to support the idea isn't actually "scientific' evidence, it's more of a "religious conviction of the heart', not physics.

It's still possible that the universe was 'created' by God of course, but if so, the event took place a very long time ago.

 

[Chicken Little]

Hi everybody, I'm new here

I'm a new Christian and a few months ago, I watched a long series of seminars by Dr. Kent Hovind on creation. After being indoctrinated with the tales of evolution for so long, his seminars really helped me strengthen my faith. I had doubts for so long, then after watching his arguments for creation, it really opened my eyes.

Wanting to share this new found knowledge, I tried sharing the video series with friends and family, but because most people aren't willing to watch hours and hours of video, everyone I shared it with seemed to ignore it. So I decided to launch a website that discusses all of the creationist arguments in all areas of science and does it in a non-aggressive, easy to understand kind of way, full of articles that people can quickly skim through or watch a quick video on.

I know there are several websites out there about creation, but this one is going to be new and different, and will cover metaphysics, parapsychology, and things of that sort as well.

In any case, it's a massive undertaking so if there is any creationists here who have some science background or even an interest in science, and have some time to write articles, let me know as I could definitely use your help and insight!

I really think there is a lot of evidence to support creation, it's just a matter of putting it all together, backing it up with proper research, and presenting it professionally... then maybe, just maybe, it might be taken seriously by mainstream scientists!

Do you Agree? Disagree? What do you think?

the problem comes in when they
scientism have their own belief system and their careers and their peers careers are based on them propping up their beliefs and their time lines. SO their is nothing PURE about science or their kind of science . it has the pack of wolves in control as everything else in this life does now.
I spent 10 years proving them wrong and they have finally started to admit they were wrong and they rewarded that by creating newer and more twisted lies.
because really truth is only as true as the last crooked mind it passed through.
and truth is never safe from liars, twisters and perverters .
because nothing else but that can happen once a truth touches the crooked .

so you want the truth? it is up to us to ask God for a pure heart that sees Him and his finger prints in his creation.
and then watch him reveal himself to us in his creation.. creation is awesome because He is awesome !
They will never see creation or be part of it because they refuse to see Him. and He is the key to it.

 

[marvmax]

Exactly. Hovind reportedly admitted to his followers that he had not filed a tax return in 28 years, and advised them to do the same. The IRS cannot ignore such blatant violation of the law, irrespective of his beliefs.

Unless you're a big time democrat then you can get away with anything.

 

[marvmax]

Go ahead and start your web site there's nothing wrong with it, but like you said it's a big undertaking and there might already be web sites that could use volunteers.

Out of all the Creationist Theories I find YEC the most problematic. However, when Heavenly Father holds the grand symposium on the other side I expect everyone will be surprised, even more surprising than YECers were right which would surprise me.

 

[Loudmouth]

I really think there is a lot of evidence to support creation, it's just a matter of putting it all together, backing it up with proper research, and presenting it professionally... then maybe, just maybe, it might be taken seriously by mainstream scientists!

Do you Agree? Disagree? What do you think?

The problem is that professional creationists like Kent Hovind lie about the evidence. They purposefully misrepresent it knowing that the bulk of their audience will never double check what they say.

If you want, perhaps you could give us a specific example of the evidence that Hovind has presented, and we can show you how he is wrong.

Long story short, creation science is not accepted by scientists because its wrong.

 

[Loudmouth]

the problem comes in when they
scientism have their own belief system and their careers and their peers careers are based on them propping up their beliefs and their time lines. SO their is nothing PURE about science or their kind of science . it has the pack of wolves in control as everything else in this life does now.

That doesn't make any sense. When scientists date a geologic formation using radiometric dating, they describe the specific rocks that they dated. What is stopping creationist scientists from going to those same rocks and checking the dates for themselves?

The fact of the matter is that the creationist scientists know that the data reported by scientists is correct. Like you, all they can do is invent a conspiracy theory from whole cloth and hope that their naïve audiences will swallow it.

 

[lesliedellow]

I spent 10 years proving them wrong and they have finally started to admit they were wrong and they rewarded that by creating newer and more twisted lies.

Really? Why hasn't anybody heard of you then? You ought to be world famous. I mean proving that physicists, geologists, biologists, astronomers, paleontologists ....... have all got it completely wrong. I mean that really IS something, isn't it?

 

[trutheverlasting]

Thanks everyone for sharing your opinion. In all honesty, I wasn't expecting so many negative responses on a Christian forum! I mean WOW... it truly shows the days we are in, doesn't it. Well, all is good, I will proceed with my plans, it just gives me a good idea of what to expect from most people.

While I expect atheists to attack creation, I wasn't expecting Christians to as well...

Now, I say this with the most respect and the best of intentions, so please do not take offense to anything I am about to say...

If you are a Christian, you should believe that God is all powerful and perfect. That He created the world, can raise the dead, control the weather, rain down manna, split the Red Sea, flood the earth in 40 days, utterly annihilate Sodom and Gomorrah in an instant, send down fire from heaven to consume a sacrifice within seconds,... do I really need to go on?

If you accept all of that, is it so hard for you to accept that God could create the world in 6 days? If you believe in God, then you should acknowledge his power, knowledge, and mercy.

If you're a Christian and believe in evolution, you need to take some time to consider what you are willing to believe and accept, and what it really means.

In order to believe in evolution, then you must believe that there was DEATH before sin, which is impossible as there was no such thing until after Adam and Eve betrayed God. Evolution makes God into a cruel master, something for which he is most certainly not. Everything in the Bible that God did, He did quickly, not over millions of years.

Please also understand that if you reject even one part of the Bible, you bring into question EVERYTHING in the Bible and it becomes whatever you want to believe instead of being the Word of God. It is God's book, not man's. We have no right to change it and if we truly believe in God and everything He is, we should accept and respect that. Furthermore, Jesus said that we must build our houses upon a rock - the Word of God is that rock, for it is truth - and if you change the Bible or refuse to believe in what it says, then you are building upon the sand and when the storm (criticism of your beliefs) hits your faith will fall apart and wash away. While many believe that the Bible contradicts itself, it really doesn't if you take the time to study and try to understand it.

Most scientists are atheists and so their research is based around keeping God out of science and avoiding anything that might prove that He exists. Do you truly question God's power so much that you would believe some "well educated" atheists over the true Word of God?

We live in a world that is currently under the power of Satan, the ultimate deceiver. Would it not make sense that he would deceive the world with science? Is that so far-fetched of an idea? If I was in Satan's position I would corrupt the church, deceive the people with lies and "scientific" explanations that most people won't or don't want to bother to actually research themselves, and I'd distract them with shiny cars, idols, big houses, physical pleasures, lots of money, and perversion. I would quickly silence anyone who brings attention to the truth. Any other plan would be illogical and not accomplish Satan's goals.

All people are easily corrupted by greed, lust, and power. We all know there are corrupt politicians, lawyers, doctors, police, surgeons, car salesmen, etc. so is it so hard to believe that maybe some scientists are corrupt too? When some corrupt scientist publishes his research, it is then used and studied by honest researchers, for which their work is based on, and the web of lies continues.

And yes, I am a Seventh Day Adventist. Since I converted less than 6 months ago, my life has truly been changed and transformed for the better. I have come to truly believe that God is all powerful, intelligent, and merciful. He has the power to create the world in 6 literal days and did, and I honor that every Sabbath, not because as an Adventist I'm required to, it's because I know it is true. I am not some mindless fool, I am well educated, base my conclusions on logic, and I know what I am talking about.

Everyone has their own perspectives and beliefs, and the whole evolution vs. creation debate will never end because of it. We all believe what we want to believe, regardless of whether it's true or not. Atheists will always reject creation and God, and many Christians will always start to doubt their beliefs because the atheists claim creation and God are illogical. And so it is for this reason my project is of great importance. Even if I can't convince the mainstream scientists that creation is logical and scientific, I can at least shake things up a bit and give Christians the support they need to strengthen their faith, which is really its purpose anyway.