Why worship Mary?

[W2L]

I was speaking more about the honoring part.

I dont honor her as my mother because shes not. I also dont honor her as queen, thats just weird. I dont honor anyone in that way, i treat everyone the same way.

 

[amariselle]

Yes- I went on and pointed out what was going on and what wasn't going on.

The question was in regard to Mary being called the “Queen of Heaven.”

Considering the fact that no one is gathering wood, starting fires, kneading dough and baking cakes for Mary, I'm inclined to disagree.

That wasn’t what I wrote in my post.

You're really stretching the definition of sacrifice. Acts of voluntary self-giving are in a vastly different realm than presenting grain offerings to a pagan goddess, which is what the verse from Jeremiah is actually talking about.

Really? So offering oneself “body and soul”, along with every earthly possession to “Mary”, isn’t within the proper definition of “sacrifice.”? I disagree.

And just how is offering one’s soul to “Mary” a proper thing to do? How is that not worship?

 

[W2L]

The question was in regard to Mary being called the “Queen of Heaven.”



That wasn’t what I wrote in my post.



Really? So offering onself “body and soul”, along with every earthly possession to “Mary”, isn’t within the proper definition of “sacrifice.”? I disagree.

And just how is offering one’s soul to “Mary” a proper thing to do? How is that not worship?

Catholics will never change.

 

[amariselle]

Nobody worships Mary

Actually, many do. They just refuse to call it what it is.

 

[AvilaSurfer]

Actually, many do. They just refuse to call it what it is.

No.....they don't.

 

[W2L]

The true queen is the Church. If there is any.

 

[ripple the car]

To love Jesus is to love His Mother. How do we and how can we love her? To understand this, it is helpful to look beyond as well as within Scripture and learn how the earliest Christians related to her, and why. There are hymns, liturgies, prayers, Scriptural commentaries, and artwork to indicate that the earliest followers of Christ did not see her as if she were just anyone.

 

[ripple the car]

Catholics will never change.

That is a huge blessing!

 

[amariselle]

I began in this thread in an attempt to answer a question and hopefully prevent antagonism between members. That doesn't appear to be working so I will probably step out.

You began this thread?.....

Also, I apologize if I sounded “antagonistic”, that was not my intent.

My point seems to be missed.

Forgive me if you took anything personally. My concerns were with citing supposed connections to Nimrod and such when I mentioned Hislop - it seems you were drawn into that (and that was indeed my fault for quoting your post when I commented that an unrelated mention in to OT need not be connected). So I take responsibility for the miscommunication.

No worries, I’m not upset.

To be fair - you quoted "hateful" and "bashing" - words I did not use.

Nor did I say you personally used those words, I was speaking generally regarding common objections made against anyone who disagrees with Catholicism. My apologies if that was unclear.

I was talking about Hislop having an axe to grind - not you.

Alright. Understood.

And I do still maintain that if one is going to object, one should ask first what someone believes and go from there. It was a general comment which I stand by, not directed at you personally. Again, I don't blame you for thinking so since I quoted you.

I agree with you on the matter of asking questions.

If it helps to explain, we have quite a storm going on, our fence just blew down, power keeps going out. You couldn't know that, but I admit I'm not paying attention as closely as I should have. My intent was not to attack you, and I do see some posts later that you did bring up specific objections. Those could well be discussed. I won't comment since we don't share any of those beliefs or practices.

Fair enough. I understand.

I usually avoid saying "you" in such cases. It would have better shown my intent - which was "this is what we all should do" - not an accusation about you. Again, I can't blame you for taking it that way and I apologize.

Again, I understand better now. Thank you for the apology. Please accept mine if I came across harshly or accusatory in any way. Perhaps I could have been clearer on some points myself.

This was in response to my saying that (again I was speaking of Hislop and brief misunderstood and misapplied quotes in Scripture) - I was saying that to argue from such a basis is unedifying. And I would still say so. I'm not sure why you took that as an accusation. But if you took my entire post as being against you personally I can understand.

No, not your entire post, just a few points that were unclear.

My apologies for the misunderstandings.

I do thank you for taking the time to respectfully clear that up.

God bless you.

 

[TuxAme]

Did God enter in marriage with Mary? No. THis is why catholicism seems strange to me.

Where did that come from?

 

[~Anastasia~]

Thank you I think we understand each other better.

Only just ... I began IN this thread ...

No I did not begin the thread. I wouldn't have.

God bless you also.

You began this thread?.....

Also, I apologize if you think if I sounded “antagonistic”, that was not my intent.



No worries, I’m not upset.



Nor did I say you personally used those words, I was speaking generally regarding common objections made against anyone who disagrees with Catholicism. My apologies if that was unclear.



Alright. Understood.



I agree with you on the matter of asking questions.



Fair enough. I understand.



Again, I understand better now. Thank you for the apology. Please accept mine if I came across harshly or accusatory in any way. Perhaps I could have been clearer on some points myself.



No, not your entire post, just a few points that were unclear.



I do thank you for taking the time to respectfully clear that up.

God bless you.

 

[amariselle]

No.....they don't.

Consecrating oneself body and soul to “Mary”, entrusting one’s temporal and eternal destiny to “Mary”, and praying to her regarding all the “graces” necessary for salvation, is worship.

 

[AvilaSurfer]

Consecrating oneself body and soul to “Mary”, entrusting one’s temporal and eternal destiny to “Mary”, and praying to her regarding all the “graces” necessary for salvation, is worship.

Nobody does that.

 

[amariselle]

Nobody does that.

There are those who most definitely do.

I encourage you to do your research. Look up Marian prayers/consecration.

 

[amariselle]

Nobody does that.

I shared parts of such prayers earlier in the thread, with a link. Here is is again:

Marian Prayers

 

[Tree of Life]

As Anastasia mentioned, the Tradition of Mary being Queen of Heaven has its origins in the Jewish custom of the queen of Israel being the king's mother. This practice was adopted because Jewish kings practiced polygamy, and it eliminated the need for a king to select one queen out of his many wives. It's more complex than what can be written in a single paragraph, but one basis for this is that Jesus wasn't an earthly king, but we know Him to be sitting on the throne of David now. Likewise, Mary didn't have an earthly queenship, because her Son wasn't an earthly king. But now that He is on that throne, and she is with Him, she practices a heavenly queenship alongside her Son, as it is now appropriate for her to do.

You'd think that the New Testament would mention such an important idea if it were true.

 

[Stormy]

I am a depressed lapsed Catholic that forgets to go to Church.
But I can tell you with all certainty that only God and his Son are worshiped.
So move along....

 

[W2L]

That is a huge blessing!

Catholicism must think its perfect then. This too will never change.

 

[W2L]

Where did that come from?

You know.

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

To love Jesus is to love His Mother.

To love Jesus is to love Jesus. To love Jesus is to love the Father, because the Father and the Son are one. No such connection was ever made between Jesus and Mary. Love God with all your heart, but love Mary, and your neighbor, and the body of Christ as yourself.

...learn how the earliest Christians related to her, and why.

The earliest Christians are the Christians in the Bible. They actually knew her, and they made no mention of her in the usual Roman Catholic way (not even close).