• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Why was the Priesthood Changed?

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You are distorting one law. It is for specific things such as to eat the passover. You must become circumcised. There is one law circumcision.
Ex. 12:47 All the congregation of Israel shall keep it.
48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the LORD, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.
49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

In other words you must live like a Jew. Your males all have to become Jews, (your household) and are obligated to "whole law". As if you were born a Jew.

John 4: 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.

Rom. 11: 16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches. 17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, (Gentile) wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

Rom. 2: 28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

This is why Paul told the Body of Christ to "continue" in the Law and Prophets for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Of course he did, as Jesus instructed him, "for salvation is of the Jews."

This is why both Jesus, and the Disciples sent new gentile converts to hear Moses instead of the mainstream preachers of their time who were teaching for doctrines, the commandments of men, and not God.
 
Upvote 0

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
7,760
2,450
✟255,156.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
We were born into a land in which "many" religious sects and franchises exist along with their religious traditions and varying beliefs, which change according to their adopted philosopher. This is just undeniable fact. In Paul's time, Gamaliel was one very popular religious philosopher of this world. Today, we are born into the influence of the Council of Nicaea, Constantine and the RCC, along with Calvin, Wesley, White, Miller, Russell, etc., etc. We have all been influenced by their manmade religious high days, their judgments, their theories, doctrines and religious traditions etc., just as the Israelites were influenced by the religions of the land God placed them in, and the Jews were influenced by the religions of the world Gold placed them in by the Pharisees and Sadducees, etc.

In Paul's time, they were tasked with studying to discern the difference between Jewish myths and commandments of men, from what the Holy Scriptures actually teach. It is the same today, given that God has delivered into the hands of men, His Oracles. So we don't need to pick through the smorgasbord of self-proclaimed ministers of righteousness to tell us what the Bible says, we can see for ourselves.



That is why we need to study so we can determine what Law is being talked about. Not for the purpose of self-justification, as is most often the case, but as Paul said, for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:


It's more important to understand scriptures, than each other, in my view. I like to ask questions about the Scriptures, for the purpose of understanding them. But what seems to happen, is a person is set in his religious traditions or philosophies, and sometimes they know the answer to questions, but to answer honestly would bring question to their own religion. So they deflect or try to find a way to continue without answering the questions. This happened with Jesus and the mainstream preachers of His Time. They were more interested in preserving their own religious beliefs that they were taught since their youth, than turning to God and "Seeking His Kingdom, and HIS Righteousness" as Jesus instructed.

There was a Law added 430 years after God said Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws. It was a carnal commandment. Abraham was justified apart from it. It had to do with justification after transgressions. And it was only to be in place "Til the SEED should come".

This is why I asked you when the Law concerning men bringing sacrifices and killing them in front of a Levite Priest for forgiveness of sin, was added. Before the golden calf, or after.
I asked you concerning Genesis and the covenants there. It is TORAH, as much as is Moses additional TORAH. Since you find it unimportant, my view, and associate my view with councils and not the covenants of TORAH. There is really no point in going further. I don't know what else to say.
 
Upvote 0

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Noah was not given to obey Moses law.

Moses didn't create even one law. God created His Laws and gave them to Noah and Abraham and to Moses. He had them first written down for our admonition in Moses time. But they were God's Laws, and we find Noah knew of them. Perhaps when Noah was walking with God, God spoke to him and showed him the Way that he should go. Surely God spoke more Words to Noah than are recorded.

Abraham, was not given to obey Moses law. It was not one law.

It wasn't "Moses Law", it was God's Law. This is just truth according to the Bible. You have been convinced by someone that God gave Abraham a different definition of Sin, and "instruction in righteousness" than HE gave to Abraham's Children. This is a man-made doctrine that cannot be supported by Scriptures. It was created to justify varying degrees of lawlessness promoted by this worlds religions.

Gen. 26: 3 Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee, and will bless thee; for unto thee, and unto thy seed, I will give all these countries, and I will perform the oath which I sware unto Abraham thy father; 4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; 5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

His children lost sight of His Laws in Egypt, and had become slaves to sin. God delivered them and gave them His Laws, just as HE did their fathers, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. But Israel didn't do the "works" of Abraham, instead they "Transgressed" and God "added" a Law to provide for forgiveness "til the Seed should come".

Noah built an ark, Abe didn't nor anyone else. Abe prepared to sacrifice His son. Not one law for obedience in the sense you are talking about.

According to the Bible, God tests all of His People. Since everyone is different, God's Tests are also different. What does that have to do with judging some of God's Laws and Judgments as unworthy of a man's honor or respect?

But, there is one law for all of them, the law of faith was one law for them Yes?

What is the Law of faith? Is it not "And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments."?

A man believes in this God, AKA "Faith", or they believe in another.

Duet. 32: 17 They sacrificed unto devils, not to God; to gods whom they knew not, to new gods that came newly up, whom your fathers feared not.

18 Of the Rock that begat thee thou art unmindful, and hast forgotten God that formed thee.

19 And when the LORD saw it, he abhorred them, because of the provoking of his sons, and of his daughters.

20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith.

Shall we follow Israel's example, or Caleb and Joshua and Zacharias's example, who walked even as Jesus walked?
 
Upvote 0

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
7,760
2,450
✟255,156.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
No they did not send them to synagogue to learn Moses. They had already been teaching Noachide among the nations from ancient times. Noachide, was Righteousness unto the nations concerning "their portion" in the world to come. Children of covenant. Judaism, was about having a share in the nation of Israel, in this world, and this life. Gentiles, had to become circumcised and have tribal identity to inherit the land. That is not what the Gospel of Jesus Christ is about. The next world, the next life, in the resurrection. Rabbinic Judaism confesses they have no jurisdiction concerning the afterlife. Noachide, simply acknowledged a share in it by covenant.
 
Upvote 0

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I asked you concerning Genesis and the covenants there. It is TORAH, as much as is Moses additional TORAH. Since you find it unimportant, my view, and associate my view with councils and not the covenants of TORAH. There is really no point in going further. I don't know what else to say.

Since you refuse to answer my questions, or even engage in my actual posts, I agree. What further benefit is there to continue.

This thread is about the Priesthood changing. You keep moving the bar and changing the subject.
 
Upvote 0

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
7,760
2,450
✟255,156.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Since you refuse to answer my questions, or even engage in my actual posts, I agree. What further benefit is there to continue.

This thread is about the Priesthood changing. You keep moving the bar and changing the subject.
Yes, Genesis is also about priesthood. Melchizedek is found there. Now Torah out side of Moses is moving the bar? But I do agree there is no further benefit.
 
Upvote 0

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
No they did not send them to synagogue to learn Moses.

Matt. 23: 1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: 3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4 For they (Pharisees, not God) bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

So you preach Jesus didn't do this, but even a child can see that HE did.

Acts 15: 19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: (This would be the God of the Bible, Yes?)

20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, (God's Law given to Moses) and from fornication, (God's Law given to Moses) and from things strangled, (God's Law given to Moses) and from blood. (God's Law given to Moses)

21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

So the Disciples followed the exact same instruction for the gentile converts as Jesus instructed them. You preach they didn't. But the Scriptures clearly say they did. So who am I to believe here? You, or the Holy Scriptures? I'm sticking with the Scriptures here over this world's popular religious philosophies, no offence. It's just that since Jesus warned me of this very thing, I should take my instructions from His Inspired Word, not have to choose between hundreds of self-proclaimed "ministers of righteousness" to tell me what God says.

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

They had already been teaching Noachide among the nations from ancient times. Noachide, was Righteousness unto the nations concerning "their portion" in the world to come.

Where is your source for this religious philosophy?


Children of covenant. Judaism, was about having a share in the nation of Israel, in this world, and this life. Gentiles, had to become circumcised and have tribal identity to inherit the land.

This again, is your religious philosophy. But when i actually read the Bible, here is what Paul says.

1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; 2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat; 4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness. 6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come. 12 Wherefore (Because of this truth) let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

So you are implying that the Law and Prophets were not written for us, but for the Nation of Israel in this world.

But Paul tells me these Scriptures were specifically written for the Body of Christ in God's New Priesthood as this was over 14 years since Jesus ascended.

Again, like those in Paul's Time, we are placed in the circumstance of choosing between seductive, popular religious philosophies of this world, and what the scriptures actually say.

Peter, by the spirit of Christ, tells me what to do in these cases.

Acts 5: 29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.

That is not what the Gospel of Jesus Christ is about. The next world, the next life, in the resurrection. Rabbinic Judaism confesses they have no jurisdiction concerning the afterlife. Noachide, simply acknowledged a share in it by covenant.

And Mormons preach another gospel, and Calvinists yet another, and then there are the JW, and the RCC and Orthodox Jews and "many" more religions which exist in the world God placed us in, just as there were religions in the Lands God sent Israel into, and in the world God sent Jesus into.

So I don't know which one of these many religious philosophers you have adopted that has taught you these doctrines. All I know is that they are not from scriptures, and I have no reason or desire to ignore the warnings about listening to "other voices" even as Eve did. Shall I not also point these things out to the brethren?


Col. 2: 8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

According to these same Scriptures, God also gave Israel the Gospel of Christ, that Paul says IS the Law and Prophets.

Rom. 1: 16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein (Within the Gospel of Christ) is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. (Hab. 2:4, OT scriptures). 18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; 19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

And again;

Heb. 4: 1 Let us (Body of Christ) therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. (Except Caleb, Joshua, Daniel, Zacharias, Simeon, Anna and all the example of Faith given us in scriptures, they mixed faith with the hearing.)

So again, you are promoting a religious philosophy which implies the Gospel of Christ wasn't given to Israel. But when I read the Scriptures, it says the opposite.

These kinds of discussions can be great for discerning and identifying false doctrines and philosophies we are vexed be every day and have adopted, so we can drop them and "Do truth".

Sadly, most men it seems are only interested in justifying their own religion, in spite of Scriptures, as did the Pharisees. Nevertheless, it is good to have these discussions, as the Word of God doesn't return void.
 
Upvote 0

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
7,760
2,450
✟255,156.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Matt. 23: 1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 2 Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: 3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4 For they (Pharisees, not God) bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

So you preach Jesus didn't do this, but even a child can see that HE did.

Acts 15: 19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: (This would be the God of the Bible, Yes?)

20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, (God's Law given to Moses) and from fornication, (God's Law given to Moses) and from things strangled, (God's Law given to Moses) and from blood. (God's Law given to Moses)

21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

So the Disciples followed the exact same instruction for the gentile converts as Jesus instructed them. You preach they didn't. But the Scriptures clearly say they did. So who am I to believe here? You, or the Holy Scriptures? I'm sticking with the Scriptures here over this world's popular religious philosophies, no offence. It's just that since Jesus warned me of this very thing, I should take my instructions from His Inspired Word, not have to choose between hundreds of self-proclaimed "ministers of righteousness" to tell me what God says.

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.



Where is your source for this religious philosophy?




This again, is your religious philosophy. But when i actually read the Bible, here is what Paul says.

1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; 2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat; 4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness. 6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come. 12 Wherefore (Because of this truth) let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

So you are implying that the Law and Prophets were not written for us, but for the Nation of Israel in this world.

But Paul tells me these Scriptures were specifically written for the Body of Christ in God's New Priesthood as this was over 14 years since Jesus ascended.

Again, like those in Paul's Time, we are placed in the circumstance of choosing between seductive, popular religious philosophies of this world, and what the scriptures actually say.

Peter, by the spirit of Christ, tells me what to do in these cases.

Acts 5: 29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.



And Mormons preach another gospel, and Calvinists yet another, and then there are the JW, and the RCC and Orthodox Jews and "many" more religions which exist in the world God placed us in, just as there were religions in the Lands God sent Israel into, and in the world God sent Jesus into.

So I don't know which one of these many religious philosophers you have adopted that has taught you these doctrines. All I know is that they are not from scriptures, and I have no reason or desire to ignore the warnings about listening to "other voices" even as Eve did. Shall I not also point these things out to the brethren?


Col. 2: 8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

According to these same Scriptures, God also gave Israel the Gospel of Christ, that Paul says IS the Law and Prophets.

Rom. 1: 16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein (Within the Gospel of Christ) is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. (Hab. 2:4, OT scriptures). 18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; 19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

And again;

Heb. 4: 1 Let us (Body of Christ) therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. (Except Caleb, Joshua, Daniel, Zacharias, Simeon, Anna and all the example of Faith given us in scriptures, they mixed faith with the hearing.)

So again, you are promoting a religious philosophy which implies the Gospel of Christ wasn't given to Israel. But when I read the Scriptures, it says the opposite.

These kinds of discussions can be great for discerning and identifying false doctrines and philosophies we are vexed be every day and have adopted, so we can drop them and "Do truth".

Sadly, most men it seems are only interested in justifying their own religion, in spite of Scriptures, as did the Pharisees. Nevertheless, it is good to have these discussions, as the Word of God doesn't return void.
Why are you bringing up the Pharisees? These were teachings from old times before the sect of the Pharisees. Cyrus and his decree, to teach all in his realm, as for Jew's the return was totally voluntary. Not all returned to build (ten tribes), we know many tribes chose not to return, and remained in Babylon. The Law as Ezra in the wisdom God gave him. All in his realm, those that did not know the law. Hence synagogues in every city to do so were established I would think, as teaching of law in accordance to the decree.

I am sorry you go on and on preaching at me. Even now I thought perhaps the verse from the scripture of Ezra, would be distorted, as they taught one law Mosaic law for Israel, for both. But reading it in its entirety makes it clear that is not the context. The kings decree to his own (Gentile) subjects concerned what his obligation in God's law was. To supply what was needed by expense etc. But I fear it will become just more fodder for accusations and lecture. I accept you consider my understanding of Scripture as rubbish. So let us just agree to disagree.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

LW97Nils

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2023
401
84
27
Germany's sin city - Munich
✟32,282.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
As I have said before, I know what you and I have been taught, but we should heed the instruction of the Jesus of the Bible and take heed of religious men of this world, who come in Christ's name.

For instance in this doctrine you have been convinced of, it simply isn't true if a person believes the Jesus of the Bible.

32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery..

So you see, Jesus did allow divorce, just as Moses allowed divorce. And for the same reason.
No, not for the same reason. Read Deuteronomy 24 again. The first two verses state:

When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house. And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man’s wife.

Moses explained that this women, who was GUILTY of uncleanness, was permitted to remarry. Yes, she was guilty, not her husband.

Your mistake is thinking everything from the Mosaic Law was universal. Not correct.

When the Lord thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; and when the Lord thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son. Deuteronomy 7:1-3

Indeed, Gentiles were able to join the Nation of Israel, but as a whole, it was an ethnostate.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

LW97Nils

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2023
401
84
27
Germany's sin city - Munich
✟32,282.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Why are you bringing up the Pharisees? These were teachings from old times before the sect of the Pharisees. Cyrus and his decree, to teach all in his realm, as for Jew's the return was totally voluntary. Not all returned to build (ten tribes), we know many tribes chose not to return, and remained in Babylon. The Law as Ezra in the wisdom God gave him. All in his realm, those that did not know the law. Hence synagogues in every city to do so were established I would think, as teaching of law in accordance to the decree.

I am sorry you go on and on preaching at me. Even now I thought perhaps the verse from the scripture of Ezra, would be distorted, as they taught one law Mosaic law for Israel, for both. But reading it in its entirety makes it clear that is not the context. The kings decree to his own (Gentile) subjects concerned what his obligation in God's law was. To supply what was needed by expense etc. But I fear it will become just more fodder for accusations and lecture. I accept you consider my understanding of Scripture as rubbish. So let us just agree to disagree.
Well, brother, he is reading lot of things into the scriptures that are not there. See my comment on Deuteronomy 24. The problem is that they deny that not all laws are universal.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: ralliann
Upvote 0

LW97Nils

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2023
401
84
27
Germany's sin city - Munich
✟32,282.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
This is why both Jesus, and the Disciples sent new gentile converts to hear Moses instead of the mainstream preachers of their time who were teaching for doctrines, the commandments of men, and not God.
This it not the meaning of 2 Timothy 3:16. For if it was so, then this would be directed towards us also (just stating one example):

Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. Numbers 31:17
 
Upvote 0

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
This it not the meaning of 2 Timothy 3:16. For if it was so, then this would be directed towards us also (just stating one example):

Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. Numbers 31:17

This is a perfect representation of what I'm talking about regarding the religions of this world and those who promote them, as well as why Jesus warned about them.

I could play the same game many play and search the scriptures to find a sentence from the Bible to justify rejecting it. And I could certainly find it by God or His Son's own Words. Here is one example below.

John 6:53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

So you see, if I use your judgment of God and His Word, I would know the New testament is written for someone else. Because there is no way for you to even find the flesh and blood of Jesus, let alone eat it or drink it.

If I used your Judgment of God and His Words, and applied them to the Words of Jesus, I could justify rejecting HIM altogether based on these Words alone.

But I know you don't apply the same Judgment to Jesus Words as you do to God's Words. Why is that?

Is it not because you have been taught to honor Jesus, but not His Father? So you would look into Jesus Words, and study to understand why HE said those words regarding eating His Flesh. You know they have meaning, you also know it is impossible to actually literally "Eat" His Flesh. But you don't discard His every Word, just because you may not understand what He is saying here.

But you do discard God's Word, and Paul's promoting it. I'm not trying to pick on you here, actually just the opposite, I say these things because I Love the brethren and I know the power of religious tradition. Paul also said;

1 Cor. 9: 9 For it is written in the law of Moses, Thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn.

So using your judgment, I would say this scripture has nothing to do with me, I don't even own an Ox. These Words were written for someone else, not for me, contradicting what Paul said in 2 Tim. 3 and 1 Cor. 10.

But what does Paul say. Doth God take care for oxen? 10 Or saith he it altogether for our sakes? For our sakes, no doubt, this is written: that he that ploweth should plow in hope; and that he that thresheth in hope should be partaker of his hope.

So who should I listen to here? You or Paul?

So let's say that because of popular religious philosophies we were born into, we have been trained to discard God's Word like Eve did, and live by the religious philosophies of one or more of the "many" religious voices of the land God placed us in. Like the Jews did. (Not Caleb, Joshua or Faithful Jews)

But then God calls men out of this world's religions, like HE did Abraham and the Israelites, and those God sent the Prophets to, and sent Jesus to.

Would those who humbled themselves to God, not strive to understand God's Word, instead of judging it as beneath us or unworthy of our honor and respect, as is the tradition of man?

When a man does this, in my experience, he finds a world of God's wisdom, profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Numbers 31: 15 And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?

16 Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD. 17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

What if these scriptures were written for our sakes no doubt, as the entire Bible teaches? Do we not fight against something? Not Flesh and Blood, but thoughts, powers of the air. What if these represent thoughts in our mind taken from the influence of the Lands God placed us in? What if "woman" represents religions, religious traditions and high days, or churches of this world God placed us in? (Come out of "HER", )

Prov. 7:10 And, behold, there met him a woman with the attire of an harlot, and subtil of heart. 11 (She is loud and stubborn; her feet abide not in her house: 12 Now is she without, now in the streets, and lieth in wait at every corner.)

Are we not to fight against evil thought in our mind, and utterly destroy them? Not preserve some of the evil thoughts, but to wipe them out completely.

What if the Bible and the God who Inspired it is truth, and your human mind has been deceived? Surely we should consider the possibility.
 
Upvote 0

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
No, not for the same reason. Read Deuteronomy 24 again. The first two verses state:

When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house. And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man’s wife.

Moses explained that this women, who was GUILTY of uncleanness, was permitted to remarry. Yes, she was guilty, not her husband.

Matt. 5:31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: 32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, "causeth her" to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

A woman that dishonors her husband by cheating with other men, can be put away, and given a writing of divorcement. This woman is free from the Law of her husband, to be joined to another.

But a women who is not guilty of fornication, and is discarded by her husband for no reason, causes her to commit adultery. The husband is then guilty, and the man who takes her is Guilty, but the Woman is not.

God/Jesus followed their own Law.

Jer. 3: 8 And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also. 9 And it came to pass through the lightness of her whoredom, that she defiled the land, and committed adultery with stones and with stocks.

In men's zeal to promote this world's religious philosophy of pitting Jesus against His Own Father, who are ONE, they are unable to see what is actually written. Paul explains the reason for this in Romans 1.

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Your mistake is thinking everything from the Mosaic Law was universal. Not correct.

Again, it is God's Law, not Moses'. God sent Moses to give men His Law, and God sent His Son to bring men Grace and Truth. AS it is written, "For the law was given by Moses, grace and truth came by Jesus Christ."

Jesus said you probably cannot be persuaded though.

Luke 16: 31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

But it is my hope that you might reconsider.

2 Cor. 3: 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. 16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

When the Lord thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; and when the Lord thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son. Deuteronomy 7:1-3

Indeed, Gentiles were able to join the Nation of Israel, but as a whole, it was an ethnostate.

To you and this world's religions, God may be respecter of persons, and a bigot or racist. Giving Mercy only to those who were born with a certain DNA. And as popular as this religious philosophy is among the religions of this world God placed me in, I know better. And you are not a participant in the first religion to treat God in this manner.

Ez. 20: 10 Wherefore I caused them to go forth out of the land of Egypt, and brought them into the wilderness. 11 And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them.

12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.

13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

Paul taught the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile in God's New Covenant, "And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. 5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness. 6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come. 12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

So I believe these Words from Paul and understand them to be Truth. Just as both Paul and I understand and believe Duet 7: 1-3. Jesus said men shall "Live By" these Words of God, not reject them, or judge them as unworthy of our honor and respect.

We will probably never agree on these things, nevertheless, these discussions are still good to have among men.
 
Upvote 0

LW97Nils

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2023
401
84
27
Germany's sin city - Munich
✟32,282.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
To you and this world's religions, God may be respecter of persons, and a bigot or racist. Giving Mercy only to those who were born with a certain DNA. And as popular as this religious philosophy is among the religions of this world God placed me in, I know better. And you are not a participant in the first religion to treat God in this manner.

Ez. 20: 10 Wherefore I caused them to go forth out of the land of Egypt, and brought them into the wilderness. 11 And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them.

12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.

13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

Paul taught the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile in God's New Covenant, "And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. 5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness. 6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come. 12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
Your problem is that you seem to believe all laws were universal. No, God is not a racist :) But he did want the OT Israelites to be seperate :) Your belief is a "religious philosophy also" - it's Messianic Judaism. Who today is keeping the feasts?

Seems you have no real arguments.
Again, it is God's Law, not Moses'. God sent Moses to give men His Law, and God sent His Son to bring men Grace and Truth. AS it is written, "For the law was given by Moses, grace and truth came by Jesus Christ."

Jesus said you probably cannot be persuaded though.

Luke 16: 31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

But it is my hope that you might reconsider.

2 Cor. 3: 15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. 16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
Indeed, the Law Moses taught, was God's. But it were both universal (and eternal) commandments such as the 10 commandments, but also those that were temporary.

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. Galatians 3:24-25

Has your faith not come yet?
When a man does this, in my experience, he finds a world of God's wisdom, profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Numbers 31: 15 And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?

16 Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD. 17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

What if these scriptures were written for our sakes no doubt, as the entire Bible teaches? Do we not fight against something? Not Flesh and Blood, but thoughts, powers of the air. What if these represent thoughts in our mind taken from the influence of the Lands God placed us in? What if "woman" represents religions, religious traditions and high days, or churches of this world God placed us in? (Come out of "HER", )
You have confirmed my point :) It aligns with what Barnabas (Acts 11:26) teaches:
"Now, wherefore did Moses say, “You shall not eat the swine, nor the eagle, nor the hawk, nor the raven, nor any fish which is not possessed of scales?” Is there then not a command of God they should not eat [these things]? There is, but Moses spoke with a spiritual reference. For this reason he named the swine, as much as to say, “You shall not join yourself to men who resemble swine.” For when they live in pleasure, they forget their Lord; but when they come to want, they acknowledge the Lord. And [in like manner] the swine, when it has eaten, does not recognize its master; but when hungry it cries out, and on receiving food is quiet again. “Neither shall you eat,” says he “the eagle, nor the hawk, nor the kite, nor the raven.” “You shall not join yourself,” he means, “to such men as know not how to procure food for themselves by labor and sweat, but seize on that of others in their iniquity, and although wearing an aspect of simplicity, are on the watch to plunder others.” So these birds, while they sit idle, inquire how they may devour the flesh of others, proving themselves pests [to all] by their wickedness. “And you shall not eat,” he says, “the lamprey, or the polypus, or the cuttlefish.” He means, “You shall not join yourself or be like to such men as are ungodly to the end, and are condemned to death.” In like manner as those fishes, above accursed, float in the deep, not swimming [on the surface] like the rest, but make their abode in the mud which lies at the bottom."

The law is now spiritual, no longer carnal.
 
Upvote 0

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Your problem is that you seem to believe all laws were universal. No, God is not a racist :) But he did want the OT Israelites to be seperate :) Your belief is a "religious philosophy also" - it's Messianic Judaism. Who today is keeping the feasts?

Seems you have no real arguments.

The Scriptures have never been accepted by most of this world's religious men as profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Most simply don't believe in it, instead they cherry pick verses that can be used to justify whatever religious philosophy they have adopted. When many Scriptures are presented to them for examination and discussion, they simply ignore them, and work to discredit whoever the poor slob is that opened their own Bible and showed them something. They called Jesus a devil for doing the same thing.

As a result, men do not want to actually discuss what Scriptures say. Like Eve, they are convinced by this world's religious voices that they are "eternally secure" regardless of what God or the Scriptures HE Inspired says.

I'm not MJ, but I understand your need and lust to place me in some religious box because that is the religious tradition of this world. I would much rather actually have a discussion regarding the Scriptures, as they pertain to this Thread.

As far as your judgment of God, Yes, HE wants HIS People, Jew or Gentile, to be "Separate" from those who don't "glorify Him as God". As Paul himself teaches.

2 Cor. 6: 14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? 16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, 18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

And the Same God inspired this as well.

Is. 56: 6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; 7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.

It isn't my argument that you are working to discredit. It's the Holy Scriptures themselves. Sadly, you will still judge God as a purveyor of an "ethnostate", not because the Bible teaches this, but because the religions of this world teach this.

Indeed, the Law Moses taught, was God's. But it were both universal (and eternal) commandments such as the 10 commandments, but also those that were temporary.

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. Galatians 3:24-25

Has your faith not come yet?

Yes, that is my point. There was God's Eternal Laws that Paul promoted and walked in, and there was a temporary carnal Law, "ADDED" to God's Eternal Law, put in place until the SEED should come. I asked you when this LAW was ADDED, before the golden calf, or after? But it seems my questions are unworthy of your consideration. That's OK, Jesus said it would be this way.

The Bible teaches us about this temporary "added" Law.

Heb. 10: 1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year. 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: 12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

The "ADDED" Law, "because of Transgressions, Til the Seed should come", was not God's Sabbath, nor Passover and the Feasts of the Lord, nor was it God's Judgments and definition of sin. The deceiver wants men to discard these "Instruction in righteousness", as it convinced EVE to do.

It was the Priesthood that changed, that is, the manner in which God's Law is received, and the manner in which Forgiveness of sin was accomplished. You can read this for yourself in Jer. 31. The problem lies in "Belief".

You have confirmed my point :) It aligns with what Barnabas (Acts 11:26) teaches:
"Now, wherefore did Moses say, “You shall not eat the swine, nor the eagle, nor the hawk, nor the raven, nor any fish which is not possessed of scales?” Is there then not a command of God they should not eat [these things]? There is, but Moses spoke with a spiritual reference. For this reason he named the swine, as much as to say, “You shall not join yourself to men who resemble swine.”

Yes, Jesus said to "Take Heed" of the "many" who come in His Name to deceive. It is doubtful the Same Barnabas in Acts was the same author who wrote this sermon you dug up to justify rejecting God's Judgments. Given the average lifespan of man was 30 to 40 years, and the Jews were still killing the true Church of God. Even If Barnabus was only 20 in Acts, and he was most surely older than that, then he would have been at the very least 90 when he wrote this, given it is said to be written between AD 70 and 130.

And God didn't believe it worthy of becoming part of the Holy Scriptures we know. But even at that, his sermon begs some simple questions.

Who established a difference between "Maggots and Swine" and a "Goat or sheep"? Why is there even a distinction made? Because God established some things as food, and some things for other purposes. Is it so strange that a Father would instruct his children what is food and what is not?

Of course, a man lusts after what his heart lusts after. For me, since I am a purchased possession, I defer to my Master, my Father. But there are those who don't trust Him to direct them.

For when they live in pleasure, they forget their Lord; but when they come to want, they acknowledge the Lord. And [in like manner] the swine, when it has eaten, does not recognize its master; but when hungry it cries out, and on receiving food is quiet again.

A goat, a deer, a camel, a pig, in fact this could be said about every animal that exists. Why is a maggot, or tape worm or swine different than a sheep or Goat or locust? For one reason, God deemed all animals good, but some were not for food. Just like many women are good, but not all women were created for you to sleep with.

I'm OK with that. So was Paul and Zacharias and every example of faith in the Bible. Yes, there are men, who call Jesus Lord, Lord, that lust after other women, and there are those who lust after things that God has deemed unclean. Shouldn't a man rule over these lusts as Paul teaches? "Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted."

In this world, man can find a reason to disobey God, discredit His Words, justify their own religion, this has been going on since Eve said "And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat,"

Jesus tries to tell men that this disobedience, lust, disrespect and dishonor all come from within, and defile a man.

I'm OK with that.

“Neither shall you eat,” says he “the eagle, nor the hawk, nor the kite, nor the raven.” “You shall not join yourself,” he means, “to such men as know not how to procure food for themselves by labor and sweat, but seize on that of others in their iniquity, and although wearing an aspect of simplicity, are on the watch to plunder others.” So these birds, while they sit idle, inquire how they may devour the flesh of others, proving themselves pests [to all] by their wickedness.

LOL, so the swan and the sparrow and hummingbird all sit idle, inquiring how they might devour the flesh of others? It's no wonder God didn't Inspire this sermon to be included in the witness of the Jesus of the Bible.

“And you shall not eat,” he says, “the lamprey, or the polypus, or the cuttlefish.” He means, “You shall not join yourself or be like to such men as are ungodly to the end, and are condemned to death.” In like manner as those fishes, above accursed, float in the deep, not swimming [on the surface] like the rest, but make their abode in the mud which lies at the bottom."

Halibut, Cod, Flounder all never make it to the surface. Instead, they lie in wait on the bottom, sometimes covered in mud, and "while they sit idle, inquire how they may devour the flesh of others, proving themselves pests". And yet, God deemed them as created for food.

The religious philosopher you have adopted makes no sense. Their argument is simply a religious theory of man who doesn't believe Paul when he says the Holy Scriptures, actually the Law and Prophets because that is where to Gospel of Christ that was given to Israel is found, should be used "for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."

And for what? So man can eat what God has deemed unclean? Why would a servant of God even want to do such a thing?
The law is now spiritual, no longer carnal.

God's Law was always spiritual.

Duet. 6: 4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. 6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart: 7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.

Duet. 10: 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the LORD your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward: 18 He doth execute the judgment of the fatherless and widow, and loveth the stranger, in giving him food and raiment. 19 Love ye therefore the stranger: for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt.

No don't get me wrong. You are free to SEEK out and listen to anyone you want. And this world is literally full of religious voices who can justify just about every desire and lust of a man's heart.

But it seems to me, we should follow God's instruction as Jesus teaches. After all. HE is a Great and all-knowing God, Yes? And we should honor HIM, even if others around us, who call Him Lord, Lord, do not. Isn't this why Caleb and Joshua were allowed into the Promised Land?
 
Upvote 0

Valletta

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2020
11,516
5,398
Minnesota
✟302,725.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Matt. 5:31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: 32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, "causeth her" to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

A woman that dishonors her husband by cheating with other men, can be put away, and given a writing of divorcement. This woman is free from the Law of her husband, to be joined to another.

But a women who is not guilty of fornication, and is discarded by her husband for no reason, causes her to commit adultery. The husband is then guilty, and the man who takes her is Guilty, but the Woman is not.
The Koine Greek word used most often refers to incest or nonsacramental unions. "Moicheia" is the Koine Greek word for adultery and that word is not found in the passage.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LW97Nils
Upvote 0

Studyman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 18, 2020
2,410
675
66
Michigan
✟457,316.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
The Koine Greek word used most often refers to incest or nonsacramental unions. "Moicheia" is the Koine Greek word for adultery and that word is not found in the passage.

What's your point and how does it apply to the point of my post, which is, according to the Christ of the Bible and His Father, a woman joined to a husband, or a man joined to his God, has obligations toward each other. And the party that rejects or refuses these obligations toward each other can be "put away" and given a writ of divorcement.

Jer. 3: 8 (Brenton) And I saw that (for all the sins of which she was convicted, wherein the house of Israel committed adultery, and I put her away, and gave into her hands a bill of divorcement,) yet faithless Juda feared not, but went and herself also committed fornication. 9 And her fornication was nothing accounted of; and she committed adultery with wood and stone. 10 And for all these things faithless Juda turned not to me with all her heart, but falsely.

Jer. 3: 8 (CLV) And I see when (for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery) I have sent her away, and I give the bill of her divorce unto her, that treacherous Judah her sister has not feared, and goes and commits fornication--she also." 9 And it has come to pass, from the vileness of her fornication, that the land is defiled, and she commits fornication with stone and with wood."

The argument being made was that the Christ of the Bible, and His Father disagreed with each other in this matter, and the Christ was correcting His Father in Matt. 5. I find this popular doctrine promoted by "many" who come in His Name, to be false, if a man considers what the Holy scriptures actually teach.

I'm not sure how your post addresses this issue.
 
Upvote 0

LW97Nils

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2023
401
84
27
Germany's sin city - Munich
✟32,282.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
God's Law was always spiritual.
I agree. And circumcision of the flesh was never about salvation of the soul. Doesn't mean it had never been commanded.
This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised. And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you. And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant. And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant. Genesis 17:10-14
And for what? So man can eat what God has deemed unclean? Why would a servant of God even want to do such a thing?
Has he called it unclean for me? No. I have eaten pork and I am perfectly healthy. It was never about health, but about seperation. It makes no sense that Paul preached to gentiles had been raised without the law, but never rebuked them about pork consumption (Paul was a Jew).
Who established a difference between "Maggots and Swine" and a "Goat or sheep"? Why is there even a distinction made? Because God established some things as food, and some things for other purposes.
So you keep on insisting that God did not mean what He said in Genesis 9:3, but made a mistake? Fine. By the way, in Matthew 25:31-46, is Christ preaching to literal animals? Don't think so.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: ralliann
Upvote 0

LW97Nils

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2023
401
84
27
Germany's sin city - Munich
✟32,282.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Upvote 0

LW97Nils

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2023
401
84
27
Germany's sin city - Munich
✟32,282.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Paul said circumcision was beneficial for those who were lawful. But useless for those who were not.

So then, a loyal servant who humbles himself under the mighty hand of God as the NT instructs, who opts for circumcision, is not being carnal is he? But faithful, Yes?
I quoted Genesis 17:10-14 twice. May you take your time to read it?
 
Upvote 0