Why Two Opposites In This Forum?

[JimfromOhio]

How about we do an audit of the non-wof forum and find how many threads do just this. They bring up some WoF issue or person they do not like, and proceed to just go on and on. No other purpose is served by the thread. It exists solely to bash WoFers. Very often the thread is totally untrue. If any WoFer dares to post anything as innocent as "excuse me.... that is not entirely correct" all hell breaks loose and you would think somebody had stole the baby's lolly.

And we ALSO do an audit for the WOF forum and find how many threads do just this. They bring up some Non-WoF issue or person they do not like, and proceed to just go on and on. No other purpose is served by the thread. It exists solely to bash Non-WoFers. Very often the thread is totally untrue.

There are two sides of the same story.

 

[lismore]

How about we do an audit of the non-wof forum and find how many threads do just this.

Good luck with that. There were two threads on that forum that just up and disappeared I was half way through typing a post on one when it went away.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

IT does not even bother me that people are anti WoF. That is to be expected and I can easily handle that, as most WoFers can. What does bother me is that they both need and have created an anti-wof for the sole purpose of venting their opposition where nobody is allowed to respond.

Actually that sounds similar to the rules of the recovery forums .

not sure the original intended purpose tho .

 

[lismore]

Yes.
I'm not sure why you think it's paranoid to read another forum. I read lots of forums here, not because I'm paranoid, but because it helps me to see who people are and what they believe. I've read many interesting things in the non-WoF forum, but I've read quite a bit of hostility as well.

But the difference is that forum is specifically and officially 'Non WOF'.

As Michael Collum said, what's the point in a WOFer going to the 'Non WOF' forum? It's like a vegetarian ordering steak.

Yes. But it might just be the biggest understatement of all time to classify many of the things said in the non-WoF forum as mere "disagreement".


FTR, I'm not worried about what people say about me. I could care less what people say in the non-WoF forum, but it's clear that it bothers some people here.

But I would have to say that it's silly to suggest that if people continue to say hostile things and the people they are saying those things about just shut up about it, peace will come.

Not likely.

IMO all the aggro is like pouring gasoline on a fire. It will get worse. But if you leave the fire alone, it will burn itself out.

As Jimfromohio has said, it goes two ways. Both sides need to chill and relax. We have our own separate sub-forums. Let's use them.

 

[probinson]

But the difference is that forum is specifically and officially 'Non WOF'.

As Michael Collum said, what's the point in a WOFer going to the 'Non WOF' forum? It's like a vegetarian ordering steak.

The point is, I believe that every person in the body of Christ is valuable, even people I disagree with.

I've read some things in the non-WoF forum, from people I strongly disagree with doctrinally, that have impacted my life. If I shut myself off to only those people who (mostly) agree with me doctrinally, then I risk missing something that God has for me from those people.

IMO all the aggro is like pouring gasoline on a fire. It will get worse. But if you leave the fire alone, it will burn itself out.

As Jimfromohio has said, it goes two ways. Both sides need to chill and relax. We have our own separate sub-forums. Let's use them.

But use them for what? If we're going to use them for like-minded fellowship, then bally-hoo for us. But if we're going to use them to tear the other side down, the fire isn't going to "burn itself out". It's only going to intensify.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Good luck with that. There were two threads on that forum that just up and disappeared I was half way through typing a post on one when it went away.

Pttttt.....
why am I not surprized...
So I guess it is coverup time.

 

[JimfromOhio]

I've read some things in the non-WoF forum, from people I strongly disagree with doctrinally, that have impacted my life. If I shut myself off to only those people who (mostly) agree with me doctrinally, then I risk missing something that God has for me from those people.

But use them for what? If we're going to use them for like-minded fellowship, then bally-hoo for us. But if we're going to use them to tear the other side down, the fire isn't going to "burn itself out". It's only going to intensify.

I believe many of us feels this way.

 

[JimfromOhio]

Pttttt.....
why am I not surprized...
So I guess it is coverup time.

This is an example of an attitude

 

[SavedByGrace3]

This forum was thriving on the weekends. We had as many as 40 and 50 people on the forum at one time.
You can trace the demise of this forum back to when the "non" forum was created. I said then that this forum would not prosper and grow as long as we allowed such a thing to exist. And I am not just talking about non-wof. It could be any forum that excludes one specific group, and then uses that forum as a platform to attack that group. It is unfair, it is frounded on by the world. It should not be found in a Christian forum. We will be blessed and thrive until it is either gone or renamed to something other than "non."
If you recall the leadership once said that they would rename it. But with the ownership change that fell to the wayside and nothing came of it.

 

[JimfromOhio]

This forum was thriving on the weekends. We had as many as 40 and 50 people on the forum at one time.
You can trace the demise of this forum back to when the "non" forum was created. I said then that this forum would not prosper and grow as long as we allowed such a thing to exist. And I am not just talking about non-wof. It could be any forum that excludes one specific group, and then uses that forum as a platform to attack that group. It is unfair, it is frounded on by the world. It should not be found in a Christian forum. We will be blessed and thrive until it is either gone or renamed to something other than "non."
If you recall the leadership once said that they would rename it. But with the ownership change that fell to the wayside and nothing came of it.

Life is full of unfair situations.

 

[Yitzchak]

I am a little curious about the label Word of faith. To me that sounds like a good things but some people say it like a cuss word. I understand thta it is the label that stuck , but aren't we all word of fiath if we are Christians ? What is the other alternative ? unbelief and non word?
I think what people seem to be against is not the word of faith. I don't think I am word of faith in the sense of being a part of that movement. But I can find good in every denomination.

 

[TasManOfGod]

This forum was thriving on the weekends. We had as many as 40 and 50 people on the forum at one time.
You can trace the demise of this forum back to when the "non" forum was created. I said then that this forum would not prosper and grow as long as we allowed such a thing to exist. And I am not just talking about non-wof. It could be any forum that excludes one specific group, and then uses that forum as a platform to attack that group. It is unfair, it is frounded on by the world. It should not be found in a Christian forum. We will be blessed and thrive until it is either gone or renamed to something other than "non."
If you recall the leadership once said that they would rename it. But with the ownership change that fell to the wayside and nothing came of it.

Exactly

 

[nephilimiyr]

Yah know this is not just about the WOF forum or the non-WOF forum, it's also about the general SF/C forum as well.

Yesterday I started a thread, wanting a peaceful discussion on what we charismatics can do or say to help non-charismatics understand that most of us charismatics don't think we're better than them. I even stated in the thread I specifically wanted to zero in on that one aspect of division in the Church and if anyone was going to use the thread as a means to have an anti-charismatic free for all I would request to have the thread closed. Well the thread didn't last even half a day because you guessed it, someone used the thread for an anti-charismatic free for all.

First he twisted all that I had said around, accused me of having a chip on my shoulder, among other things, and then went on a rant about how bad and mean most charismatics are. Totally disrespecting my desire and request to not have the topic turn into an anti-charismatic free for all. Aparently satisfying his desire to go into an anti-charismatic diatribe trumped my desire for a peaceful yet meaningful discussion.

 

[Yitzchak]

So what exactly is the distinction ? I kind of get it. but not completely. The non wof's believe in the gift of healing and also seem to believe in having prosperity. I doubt any have taken a vow of poverty and live a monastic type lifestyle. The non wof churches I have attended even have millionraies in them who drive expensive cars and have luxery.
So clearly the non wof are not against healing and wealth . Do I have that right?
I guess I don't understand the offense. I always hope that God will heal me and my loved one everytime we are sick. We hope to prosper in everything we do. We work hard trying to get ahead. So if someone says they have more faith than me and can pray successfully for healing or wealth, my response is good for them. I'm not so sure of myself that I think I know the will of God always.
So where is this incredible offense issue ?

 

[Yitzchak]

In other words aren't we all on the same side ? Isn't the enemy the devil ?

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Life is full of unfair situations.

Since these things occurred I attempted approach others and make peace. On my last stint as a mod I made a public effort to pull things together and get rid of the bitteness and resentment that is burning at the heart of this forum. My attempts were rebuffed and even ridiculed.

I am not sure what else can be done.
I desire peace and a resolution to this seemingly endless fight. I would even be willing to shut down the WoF forum... a forum I helped to start during my first stint as a mod.

Unless someone has a question -That is all I have to say...

 

[Simon Peter]

The problem is the non-WoF forum is hardly ever used for like-minded "fellowship". It is most often used to vent and gripe about WoF beliefs and believers.

This is just not true. Less of the hyperbole Pete. And most of those times WoF beliefs were complained about, the thread was agravated and incited by WoF posts on the non-WoF forum!

And besides, part of the reason for a non-WoF forum, is so non-WoF would have a 'private place' where they could discuss and complain about beliefs they don't agree with; without being hassled. Just like Democrats complain about Republicans and their platform at their own convention, and visa-versa.

It seems like some want to be the only party in town... somehow reminds me of 'the night of the long knives'....(1934, look it up).

I was the forum manager on staff at the time the non-WoF forum was created and was actually quite integral to the creation of it. The intent was for people who did not hold WoF beliefs to have a place to discuss those things freely, just as WoF believers have a place to do so. Like-minded fellowship was always intended to be the purpose. I still support that idea. But that is not how the non-WoF forum has operated. It is very anti-WoF in nature.

And that is the problem.

This is a dangerous mis-characterization of non-WoF believers and their forum. And I resent it...

If you or anyone else see "anti-WoF" "racist" "hate speech" then report the offender and they will be dealt with according to existing CF rules.



I was also instrumental in the creation of the non-WoF forum.

The purpose was to extend the same sub-forum/forum rights to non-WoF believers as the Pentecostal and WoF already enjoyed.

Why should non-WoF Charismatics be discriminated against?






Peace,
Simon

 

[Simon Peter]

IT does not even bother me that people are anti WoF. That is to be expected and I can easily handle that, as most WoFers can. What does bother me is that they both need and have created an anti-wof for the sole purpose of venting their opposition where nobody is allowed to respond.

As an example... would we allow an "non-black" forum for only white supremacists where they could push their racist propaganda without opposition? Now I am in no way comparing non-wof people to this hate group. But I am saying no such forum would be allowed.Yet here we have a non-wof forum using very similar logic and (like it or not, admit it or not) they DO behave very much in this manner! How would you feel if they had a forum with your particular group preceded by the word "non?"

In the world we have "non" type organizations that exclude one specific group. Some are racists, some are political. But in the world they are recognized for what they are. They are called hate groups and supremacist organizations. In the world, the constitution protects these groups so they can march in funny suits and spout their hate speech. But we are not the world. So, as some have pointed out, you have the freedom of gathering and freedom of speech to do these things... but is it Godly. Are you satisfied that the world allows you to do it? Does God?

How about we do an audit of the non-wof forum and find how many threads do just this. They bring up some WoF issue or person they do not like, and proceed to just go on and on. No other purpose is served by the thread. It exists solely to bash WoFers. Very often the thread is totally untrue. If any WoFer dares to post anything as innocent as "excuse me.... that is not entirely correct" all hell breaks loose and you would think somebody had stole the baby's lolly.

My biggest beef is that CF provides and supports this injustice. My second biggest concern is that no-body over there seems to think there is anything wrong with what they are doing!

This is one of the worst posts I've ever read at CF. I don't even know where to begin.

You cannot be serious?



.

 

[FreeinChrist]

I would like to take a look at Charismatic - Non-Word of Faith. I don't think Pentecostals should be part of this Charismatic section. Looking from "movement" perspectives, we have to remember, in this world, movement doctrines make movement believers. From my perspective, we Charismatics are spirit-filled but not in the same definition as Pentecostal/WOF's perspective.

Pentecostals have the Pentecostal/Assembly of God forum.

 

[FreeinChrist]

Sadly however in the past few days there have been a lot of reports, attacks and thread deletions instigated by WOF members on the Charismatic Non Wof forum. Two threads have gone. There seems to be a lot of insecurity and paranoia coming from the WOF camp, even though WOF brothers and sisters have their own forum in which to share their distinct views.

This paranoia I believe is from a minority of WOF members, but I hope the Lord relieves their hearts from fear and paranoia soon. It certainly isnt doing the WOF cause any favours, seeing the propents of the teachings so insecure and neurotic.

There was a specific request to refrain from flaming. Please heed that.

Your complaint that members who are Wof are attacking the nonWoF forum is not true, nor are they responsible for any thread being removed. Posts get reported and it is the mod staff who decide if the post and or the thread needs to be removed or not - not a WoF member.