Why this hate for Islam?

[Secundulus]

before jesus (pbuh) what was these lands belong to ?

They were Roman.

 

[Disippelen]

before jesus (pbuh) what was these lands belong to ?

Most of the nations I mentioned were part of the Roman Empire. The Christian faith spread AMONG ROMANS inside the Roman Empire, DESPITE the authorities trying to stop Christian faith.

It is the exact opposite of how Islam was spread, since the Caliphate was established through numerous and brutal military conquests.



Christianity spread peacefully among the poor and women, from below, until it eventually encompassed also the rulers of Rome.

Islam, contrastingly spread from above, from a military organization that attacked and enslaved the peaceful peoples in the neighbooring regions.

you didn't get it
muslims didn't steal thier land
what happened is that christians whom revert to islam

I have gotten it, but you don't!

The Islamic state who first enslaved the Arabian Peninsula (620s-630s), went on to unprovoked and deliberately attack the Christian and Zoroastrian world in the 630s and onwards.

The Christians, Jews and Zoroastrians of Egypt, the Levant, Anatolia, Caucasus, Mesopotamia, Persia, Iberia etc. had NEVER done anything evil to Islam... Still, Islam decided to bloodthirstly attack them and enslave their lands.


So, yes, Muslims did indeed steal non-Muslim lands.


I am astonished that an intelligent man as yourself fails to grasp this simple fact....


Disippelen

 

[randomman]

Most of the nations I mentioned were part of the Roman Empire. The Christian faith spread AMONG ROMANS inside the Roman Empire, DESPITE the authorities trying to stop Christian faith.

It is the exact opposite of how Islam was spread, since the Caliphate was established through numerous and brutal military conquests.



Christianity spread peacefully among the poor and women, from below, until it eventually encompassed also the rulers of Rome.

Islam, contrastingly spread from above, from a military organization that attacked and enslaved the peaceful peoples in the neighbooring regions.




I have gotten it, but you don't!

The Islamic state who first enslaved the Arabian Peninsula (620s-630s), went on to unprovoked and deliberately attack the Christian and Zoroastrian world in the 630s and onwards.

The Christians, Jews and Zoroastrians of Egypt, the Levant, Anatolia, Caucasus, Mesopotamia, Persia, Iberia etc. had NEVER done anything evil to Islam... Still, Islam decided to bloodthirstly attack them and enslave their lands.


So, yes, Muslims did indeed steal non-Muslim lands.


I am astonished that an intelligent man as yourself fails to grasp this simple fact....


Disippelen

islam is not a race

 

[Futuwwa]

Well, I wouldn't call a Byzantine invasion of Arabia in support of their Ghassanid vassals "not a provocation", but that's just me

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Disippelen
Most of the nations I mentioned were part of the Roman Empire. The Christian faith spread AMONG ROMANS inside the Roman Empire, DESPITE the authorities trying to stop Christian faith.

Why do some Christians believe the Muslims worship a different GOD than do the Jews and Muslims. They are discussing this on the GT board and there seems to be a lot of division on it, especially between Roman Catholics and some other denominations. Thoughts? Salam

http://christianforums.com/t7176979-how-many-agree-with-this.html

Is the god of Islam and Roman Catholicism one and the same god?

ADDRESS OF POPE JOHN PAUL II
TO THE PARTICIPANTS IN THE COLLOQUIUM
ON «HOLINESS IN CHRISTIANITY AND ISLAM»

Thursday, 9 May 1985

Dear Friends,

It is a special joy for me to be able to welcome you, our guests who follow the faith of Islam, to Rome for the colloquium on "Holiness in Christianity and Islam". My fraternal greetings go as well to those Christians who have been taking part in the colloquium.

As I have often said in other meetings with Muslims, your God and ours is one and the same, and we are brothers and sisters in the faith of Abraham.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

Bushmaster[/B]
Too bad you can't back that up with Scriptures and it is all idle talk. Christians tend to believe a sovereign God who is capable of perfect judgment, and who is merciful and saves by grace, if that is something foreign to your understanding.
Here is a little proverb for you...
Sometimes a way seems right to a man, but the end of it leads to death! - Proverbs 14:12

Let’s see what Bible teachers say about this, John Gill first;
Pro 14:12 - There is a way which seemeth right unto a man,.... As the way of sin and wickedness does, it promising much carnal pleasure and mirth; there is a great deal of company in it, it is a broad road, and is pleasant, and seems right, but it leads to destruction; so the way of the hypocrite and Pharisee that trusts to his own righteousness, and despises others, and even the righteousness of Christ; or however does not submit to it, but tramples upon him, and counts the blood of the covenant an unholy thing, and so is deserving of sorer punishment than the profane sinner; yet on account of his good works, as he calls them, fancies himself to be in a fair way for heaven and happiness; so Popery, through the pomp and grandeur and gaudiness of worship, through the lying miracles of the priests, and the air of devotion that appears in them, seems to be a right way;

but the end thereof are the ways of death; which lead unto eternal death; for that is the wages of sin, let it appear in what shape it will.

And now Matthew Henry;
We have here an account of the way and end of a great many self-deluded souls. 1. Their way is seemingly fair: It seems right to them; they please themselves with a fancy that they are as they should be, that their opinions and practices are good, and such as will bear them out. The way of ignorance and carelessness, the way of worldliness and earthly-mindedness, the way of sensuality and flesh-pleasing, seem right to those that walk in them, much more the way of hypocrisy in religion, external performances, partial reformations, and blind zeal; this they imagine will bring them to heaven; they flatter themselves in their own eyes that all will be well at last. 2. Their end is really fearful, and the more so for their mistake: It is the ways of death, eternal death; their iniquity will certainly be their ruin, and they will perish with a lie in their right hand. Self-deceivers will prove in the end self-destroyers.

Can’t say anymore than that it clearly talks about your sinful homosexual life. Apply it if you liked it so much…

----
The Bible is clear that the only way to get to Heaven is through Christ, and no Faith, no Heaven. This has been a main belief for 2,000 years.

Sure if you are Baptist, that would be the teaching to roll by, early church was more than sola Scriptura and she left the eternal decisions to God, she taught and kept the faith Christ delivered, but didn’t preach hell. Learn the difference.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

As I have often said in other meetings with Muslims, your God and ours is one and the same, and we are brothers and sisters in the faith of Abraham.

Very dangerous speech my brother. Muslim understanding of God has been told unto us by Saint Paul, who said "which is NOT GOD at all"...

They long to worship our God but their way of knowing Him is messed up. There is no separate entities as Christian God and Allah, it is essentially the same, but what they have as a vision of Him is distorted. By Satan.

 

[randomman]

Very dangerous speech my brother. Muslim understanding of God has been told unto us by Saint Paul, who said "which is NOT GOD at all"...

They long to worship our God but their way of knowing Him is messed up. There is no separate entities as Christian God and Allah, it is essentially the same, but what they have as a vision of Him is distorted. By Satan.

and this "satan" has a tail and lives in hell and building an army of muslims to attack God

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

Actually, I don't know where he lives, though through Scripture, I know how he fools naives like you... Next time try to read what I said, unless I report you, you ain't going anywhere and you will suffer our bigotry.

 

[randomman]

Actually, I don't know where he lives, though through Scripture, I know how he fools naives like you... Next time try to read what I said, unless I report you, you ain't going anywhere and you will suffer our bigotry.

says a highschool dropout soldier to a masters student in advanced engineering

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

You have already used that line remember, that shows how much intelligence you pack in that skull you waste for "advanced engineering" ... Though, I can't help but wonder, where do you get the gem of information that I am a high-school dropout? I mean I would love to expose you as someone who uses exaggerated or lurid material in order to gain public attention or a person who spreads malicious gossip and a liar, but did you know that not only I finished a foreign language based best in town HS, I also graduated with distinguished grades as a pilot from tech school and further United States Military technical schools? This is for the public of course, my record is documented in the Unites States,world leader in higher education. Can't care less what you think but where is your masters from? University of Jordan?

 

[TheReasoner]

I think things like the murder of Theo Van Gogh. The threatenings of the Danish cartoonists, the torching of the Danish embassy, 9-11 and the following dancing in the streets, the outcry for a formal apology from the pope about the crusades without a hint of mention of the Ottoman 'crescades' which triggered them.
I think the blowing up of the giant buddhas in Afghanistan, the execution of children in Iran, the bombings in London, the bombings in India, and so much more probably contributes to a strengthened distaste for Islam.

I used to be pretty indifferent about Islam. Until I read the Koran and did some research. After that, when the cartoon incident came and I saw thousands of Muslims all over the world - even here in Oslo - cry out for Danish and Norwegian blood, calling out to kill us all and take our wives and daughters as war booty... Well, I had had enough. I know what Islam did back in the old days. And judging by recent events, the response to the cultural collision between east and west I must admit that I am very cautious about Islam as a religion and an ideology. Violence has followed it from Muhammad himself, and I just don't see how that's about to change. They'll still not just threaten to kill anyone who speaks against Islam. They'll actually kill them fairly often.

 

[Futuwwa]

Huh? The Ottoman state was founded in 1299. The Ninth Crusade ended in 1272.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

says a highschool dropout soldier to a masters student in advanced engineering

I barely made it thru highschool myself but I believe that has little bearing on the Bible itself, wouldn't you agree?

http://www.scripture4all.org/

Matt 23:15 "Woe to ye, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! that ye go-about the sea and the Dry/xhran <3584> to make one proselyte, and when he becomes/genhtai <1096> (5638), ye make him a son of geennhV <1067> two-fold of-ye-selves.

Luke 16:26 And on all of these, between Us [NC Faith/Life] and Ye [OC Law/Death] a great chasm/casma <5490> hath been established, so that those willing to cross-over/diabhnai <1224> (5629) hence toward ye not be able to, no yet thence toward us may be ferrying/diaperwsin <1276>.
[# 1276 used as ferrying Matt 9:1, 14:34, Mark 5:21, 6:53, Acts 21:2]

 

[ChavaK]

First, let me say up front that I hate neither Muslims nor Islam. I have stated many times that Islam has great potential. I have had Muslim friends who I considered quality people. My daughter was very close friends with two Muslim sisters most of her life, and our families got along well because of our shared values: decency, fairness, kindness, honesty, modesty, chastity... Their father very much approved of his daughters hanging around my daughter, just as I approved of my daughter hanging around his. I have studied both the Quran & Hadith, and Arabic culture. As with most things, there is stuff I appreciate, and stuff I don't like.

You have asked why the hatred towards Islam. I think it is a disingenuous question -- the answer should be obvious even to you. First of all, you say that countries like Saudi Arabia, Jordon, Malaysia, etc., are fine countries. That is just nonsense. Not only would I not want to live in such dictatorships, but they are not even truly benevolent dictatorships -- the poor suffer. A Muslim is better off living in Israel than any of those countries: not only would he be free to practice his religion, but his standard of living would be significantly higher. (One reason why Arabs in Israel do NOT emigrate to Islamic states.)

But second, the greatest violence in the world is presently perpetrated presently by those identifying as Muslims. Not JUST that, but in ADDITION, they commit this violence IN THE NAME OF ISLAM. And not JUST THAT, but you just don't see moderate Muslims getting hot and bothered and protesting in the streets about it. You would think that such blasphemy, doing evil in the name of G-d, would be more of a concern.

So if there are those who hate Islam, it is a sentiment that Muslims have brought upon their own culture and religion.

Great post, Ger.

 

[ChavaK]

I do not hate Muslims or Islam.
What I do hate is the actions that many
take in the name of Islam....

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

But second, the greatest violence in the world is presently perpetrated presently by those identifying as Muslims. Not JUST that, but in ADDITION, they commit this violence IN THE NAME OF ISLAM. And not JUST THAT, but you just don't see moderate Muslims getting hot and bothered and protesting in the streets about it. You would think that such blasphemy, doing evil in the name of G-d, would be more of a concern.

Shalom Ger!!!! I hear ya. Also remember the early Christ-ian church persecuted and killed many that did not agree with the Dictates of the ruling heirarchy and their interpreations of the NT. Thoughts?

http://www.scripture4all.org/
fairly good hebrew/greek interlinear

Matt 23:34 `Because of this, lo!, I am Commissioning toward ye Prophets and Wisemen and Scribes, out of Them Ye shall be Killing/apokteneite <615> (5692) and ye shall be Crucifying/staurwsete <4717>(5692),...............

Matt 24:9 then they shall be delivering ye up into tribulation, and They shall be Killing/apoktenousin <615> (5692) Ye, and ye shall be being hated by all of the nations thru/because-of the Name of Me;

 

[ChavaK]

I have come to appreciate Islam so much.

Does this mean you are changing your "I love the Torah"
to " I love the koran"?

 

[Ramona]

Does this mean you are changing your "I love the Torah"
to " I love the koran"?

He isn't supposed to respect more than one religion?

 

[DanielRB]

Hello,

First off, I want to admit.. A few months back, I was very anti Islam. Anyone here could tell you that.

Thankfully though, I promised a member here that I would do more research into Islam and be open minded about it.(The member was Oxy2Hydro)

I have, and have learned a lot. And, I have come to appreciate Islam so much.

And now as I view this forum, it brings me to tears, because people are so hateful here of Islam. Some people say the meanest things, and make the same accusations over and over.

Every Muslim on this site has condemned 9/11 and terrorism against innocents.

Many Muslims are pro Palestine, but so what! If you could not go to work without crossing checkpoints, and if your homes were being bulldozed, I am sure you would be pro palestine too.

and then people call Hamas terrorist, simply because they do not recognize Israel.

Well you know, there are MANY Israeli's who are anti Palestine and want them dead. But we always look over this. A good friend of mine named Eliad is lives in Israel. I told him how I did not like his government because they kill a lot of innocents. He said "So, that is good and I hope we kill more, because they are nasty people." And he had a smile on his face too because he was on webcam.

And sure, many Muslims support the fighters in Iraq. But hey, if 140,000 people invaded your country and pushed and shoved you, wouldn't you?!

Over 600,000 people have died in Iraq, and over 2 million displaced. How does this not upset you guys? How can people go to sleep with a straight face knowing this!!!!

Muslims have EVERY right to want US troops out of Iraq, and they have every right to support the "terrorists" who are simply trying to get the troops to leave.

If people invaded your country, and did countless things bad, wouldn't you want them out?!!!

Sure, many Muslims may support these things.. But how many support killing innocent Jews at a mall, or 9/11, or killing innocent people elsewhere? VERY FEW. And the Muslims on this forum have made it loud and clear many times.

Malaysia is Muslim majority, and is a BEAUTIFUL country. So is Jordan, and Syria, and Turkey, and Egypt, and Morocco, and Albania, and Saudi Arabia.

Sure, Islam is an ultra conservative religion. And I, as a neo liberal, do not like that. But Islam had divisions.. There is fiqh, Aqeedah, etc. How often do Muslims worry about killing people for committing adultery?! Not often! Instead, they worry about other issues, more contemporary issues that the average Joe and Joanne would worry about.

So please, just leave your anti Islam outside. If you sincerely have questions, then go to a MUSLIM FORUM and ask, but do not post the same things here over and over.

If you hate Islam, then that is your right.. But please, do not let it out by making hate threads. Instead, go boxing or something to let your bigotry out.

I am just sick of these hate threads. I am sick of the close mindedness. I am sick of the anti Islamic brainwashing and the same threads over and over. Change is needed.

I would also like to apologize to all Muslims about my behavior here just a few months ago. I was so mean and I made so many false claims and I was so close minded. I hope you guys know that I have changed those views, and I hope you will forgive me for being so rude in the past.

I just had to let this all out. If you are a Muslim hater who does not like what I am saying, then fine. If you do not want to read all this, then that is ok too.. Just leave this thread! I could care less.

Thanks,
Kyle

Hi, français!

I was off for several months. I remember a few heated threads in which we both participated. I'm glad to see the change in attitude--I know that when you feel something, you feel it passionately, and I understand where you were coming from. And you're doing something all too rare: admitting when you have a change of heart. I don't see that much here...I know I am scared of doing it myself.

Daniel