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I guess in the end those who choose not to apologise for false accusations simply don't want to.I guess in the end those that do want to believe the truth of Genesis and creation
simply do not want to.
Pity.
To choose a lie over the truth may well have dire consequences.
But each person is responsible for their themselves in matters of salvation.
I agree, but alas, people are very stubborn. You know not the pain of trying to explain to a person with the flexibility of pencil lead that Homo sapiens is not the only species that exists, and that the definition of species doesn't demand that organisms with that label be intelligent. I wish I was just giving a hypothetical example, but no, that was a real experience of mine.Ok. I'll do my best.
Debating and talking, tossing things around is a good thing. But we must be teachable. Able to set aside preconceived notions long enough to honestly consider another 's perspective.
I would say that most of the atheists on here are open to the idea of deities existing. However, people on here tend to give very weak or absolutely no evidence for their existence. I have perhaps the lowest standard of evidence for this, but even I have to say that the beauty of a sunset is not evidence for the existence of any deities (yes, people do push the "look around you" argument a lot).If we can not, then the religious box of our indoctrination will make us (them) outright reject new perspectives...in error. If God doesn't fit into the box and it challenges ones belief system, then rejection (without honest consideration) comes in and the pride of intellect then veiled (or outright) insults...and no edification is possible.
I find it best to laugh at the snarky-ness of the people on here rather than bothering to put anyone on ignore. If one wishes to ignore their posts, they can simply not read them. Besides, with people quoting their posts in responses, it's not like you won't be seeing their posts anyways.Those guys are here. Over educated. I won't respond to them. I got one snarky guy on ignore now because that's all he has is snarks.
Thanks for saying that. Here's hoping for some nice conversations with you in the futureYou don't seem to be like that. We may not see eye to eye on some things, but you're...reasonable and open minded.
I (no one) has all the answers...and you ask pretty good questions.
Comment: I am not an atheist by choice. I have been trying to gain belief for 9 years. My choice is to be a theist, and yet, I can't force myself to believe something that hasn't met my minimal standard of evidence. I couldn't force myself to believe in a god any more than I could force myself to believe in the boogeyman.I guess in the end those that do want to believe the truth of Genesis and creation
simply do not want to.
Pity.
To choose a lie over the truth may well have dire consequences.
But each person is responsible for their themselves in matters of salvation.
An excellent question, pshun. The reason why Triops haven't changed much in tens of millions of years (variable by species) is because they are already tough suckers to kill. In fact, they were virtually unaffected by multiple mass extinctions just because their eggs can be dormant for decades and still hatch, and because they can reproduce 3 different ways (sexually between 2 individuals, self fertilize, and through parthenogenesis (parts of their bodies that are broken off heal, and the severed portion becomes a new individual)), populations are easily reestablished even if only a few individuals survive.SArah you stated "10 years for Triops means that about 173 generations of them will pass. To put that into perspective, it takes more than 2500 years for humans to have that many generations pass. Furthermore, I am putting them under the most extreme natural selection pressures possible from generation 2 onward. Unless the mutation rate of Triops is exceedingly low, it is entirely possible for the morphology of these organisms to change so much that they are unrecognizable by the final generation."
But if nature and natural selection has not changed them into another creature in 100s of millions of years what makes you think this 10 year period will have such an effect?
I actually was drawn to Triops BECAUSE they have remained unchanged for so long. Should this experiment result in a drastically different experimental population from the control group, it will demonstrate that Triops didn't remain unchanged for so long because they can't change. There simply wasn't any pressure to change that impacted them. I mean, why would a population start to change color when they already perfectly blend in with the sand at the bottom of the pond?Try something other and do not waste your time on this. I like you, and appreciate your vigor, but triops are still triops even after all this time by natural means...only the intervention in nature by an outside intelligent force (by design such as inserting new sections into their normal genome) could do it...and what would that prove?
I would say that most of the atheists on here are open to the idea of deities existing. However, people on here tend to give very weak or absolutely no evidence for their existence. I have perhaps the lowest standard of evidence for this, but even I have to say that the beauty of a sunset is not evidence for the existence of any deities (yes, people do push the "look around you" argument a lot).
I find it best to laugh at the snarky-ness of the people on here rather than bothering to put anyone on ignore. If one wishes to ignore their posts, they can simply not read them. Besides, with people quoting their posts in responses, it's not like you won't be seeing their posts anyways.
Thanks for saying that. Here's hoping for some nice conversations with you in the future
Actually, that's an incorrect stereotype that atheists like me can't stand. Do you not worship Vishnu because you hate Vishnu? Of course not, you simply don't believe Vishnu exists.I have a theory...That if there was really no God, then there'd be no atheists! I suspect that most atheists, are simply mad at God for...whatever.
You may have misinterpreted me at some point down the line, given that I am an evolution supporter. Did you mistake my willingness to test the theory for me being against it? Theories are made to be tested, even if the testers don't doubt the reliability of the theory at all. There's always room for improvement! And if my test results didn't fit in with the theory, that's also fine! As long as it isn't the result of some mistake on my part, I would have no issue with running an experiment that produced evidence against evolution. The expansion of human knowledge is always a work in progress.Question: How can you be an atheist, and not believe in evolution? That strikes me as a bit odd. Refreshing, but odd.
You mean the veins in the leaves... which are a part of the plant version of the circulatory system? Because I assure you, trees with all their branches don't look like a human circulatory system at all; more like the branches of the pulmonary system, in a loose sense.I will push the "look around you" argument. To me, God's fingerprints are everywhere. Step outside, look around...See the trees? See how much they resemble a blood circulatory system? Wow.
Uh... the different cells in the nervous system don't even have their axons and dendrites physically touch, so, no, not like branches. Here, I'll post a picture of the pulmonary branches in the lungs, to show you that those really do look like tree branches quite a bit:Similarly, the photos we see occasionally of the brain and it's uh, neural pathways (?) and stuff? Just like trees, branches everywhere.
I had a similar problem, and let me tell you, forcing myself to respond nicely to people on this site, regardless as to my personal feelings about their posts, has worked wonders for helping to fix that problem in real life. The forced changes in discussion habits on here eventually began to leak into my speaking habits with people in person. The nice thing about posting on here is the fact that you can type out your snarky response, look it over, and edit it to not be snarky before posting. You can rethink what you want to say, and how other people will view it. It makes being considerate a lot easier.Yeah, I know. And you're right. The problem for me though, is that all my life I have been a real S**t-talker. Offend me, it's on...Why you...blah blah blah. So my natural instinct to respond in kind is pretty automatic. It's something that I'm working on. So to read their post and their snark would automatically give me a response that isn't nice. Being a little impulsive, it's pretty easy to answer too fast and say the wrong thing.
There are plenty of areas on this site that are Christian only. If your posts are mostly just for other believers, why not make them in those subforums? No snarky atheists there to burst your bubble.That's the first guy I've put on ignore. I mean, just because he's always a butt-head...doesn't mean that I have to be. So I tried the ignore feature. When he posts, I only see a message, "You have this member on ignore, click here to see his post" That's kinda cool. Many times my posts are geared towards other believers and when non-believers post a crack in effort to demean me, it's prolly best I don't even see it or put their crap into my head. I wasn't talking to them anyway.
and @Ophiolite and @PsychoSarahWhy is it a lie, and not just wrong?
Waggles, you still haven't acknowledged that your statement that my post was "Complete Rubbish" was a false assertion. I really don't find any value in listening to people who don't acknowledge their errors even when reminded. One has no sure way of telling if they are talking truth, partial rubbish, or complete rubbish. Go in peace. I'm done with you.and @Ophiolite and @PsychoSarah
7 He that overcomes shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers,
and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire
and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 21:
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defiles, neither whosoever works
abomination, or makes a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.
Revelation 21:
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loves and makes a lie.
Revelation 22:
1 To the chief Musician upon Gittith, A Psalm of David.
O LORD our Lord, how excellent is thy name in all the earth! who hast set thy glory
above the heavens.
2 Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength because of thine enemies,
that thou might still the enemy and the avenger.
3 When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou have ordained;
4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visit him?
5 For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour.
6 Thou made him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet:
7 All sheep and oxen, yea, and the beasts of the field;
8 The fowl of the air, and the fish of the sea, and whatsoever passes through the paths of the seas.
9 O LORD our Lord, how excellent is thy name in all the earth!
Psalm 8:
That's all very well, but it does not explain why the theory of evolution is a lie--an intentional falsehood--rather than just wrong.and @Ophiolite and @PsychoSarah
7 He that overcomes shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers,
and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire
and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 21:
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defiles, neither whosoever works
abomination, or makes a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.
Revelation 21:
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loves and makes a lie.
Revelation 22:
1 To the chief Musician upon Gittith, A Psalm of David.
O LORD our Lord, how excellent is thy name in all the earth! who hast set thy glory
above the heavens.
2 Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength because of thine enemies,
that thou might still the enemy and the avenger.
3 When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou have ordained;
4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visit him?
5 For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour.
6 Thou made him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet:
7 All sheep and oxen, yea, and the beasts of the field;
8 The fowl of the air, and the fish of the sea, and whatsoever passes through the paths of the seas.
9 O LORD our Lord, how excellent is thy name in all the earth!
Psalm 8:
That's because it was not a false assertion.Waggles, you still haven't acknowledged that your statement that my post was "Complete Rubbish" was a false assertion.
Nonsense. Assertion and speculation. Illogical as Spock would say.As someone well versed in Judaism he would have understood that the creation passages in Genesis were not meant to be taken literally.
Evolution and Darwinism are lies directly opposing and contradicting the word of God.That's all very well, but it does not explain why the theory of evolution is a lie--an intentional falsehood--rather than just wrong.
You stated that my post was "Complete Rubbish". You later agreed with one of my statements in that post. That means it was not complete rubbish. I already explained this to you. Please don't play dumb, it is not attractive behaviour.That's because it was not a false assertion.
Your posting was illogical and of the most convoluted arguments I have read for some time.
You are nuts to presume so much about me,
You are nuts to presume so much about me - but great job employing the fallacious appeal to false authority to rescue Missler the minister.and Chuck Missler. Chuck was seriously highly educated and in the business world for 30+ years before going into ministry and did more research in a day than you have in a lifetime.
My poor memory does not invalidate his work.
Neither does your P'shawing him with your narrow minded view.
I notice that some of the best teachers are attacked the most and the fiercest from the people who are the most threatened by them, lol.
Chuck's no dummy.
Even if I am and some others here are.
Genesis clearly states that the light [of God] sustained all plant life on Earth before the
creation of our Sun and Moon, and other stars.
That is not allegorical. That is a direct challenge to the "science" of men in creating their
own explanations for existence and life.
From the beginning God already knew all about Darwin, and his aficionados, who would zealously
promote a lie against the word of God.
So participate in my experiment, then. You just need to pick 2 out of 6 traits listed to vote for, it's so easy!Though you are 100% correct that it is not "because they can't change." Because they can and they do. The problem is in what one expects to see with such change. Production of varieties with different characteristics IS expected, but the level of morphological change evolutionists (not evolution itself) would have predicted has been proven false by nature itself. But they cannot admit it!
Their life cycle literally demands that all the adults of the previous generation die before the next generation can even hatch, because the adults will gobble up any babies, even their own, that they find. Since the eggs can wait out decades of environmental change, and the environment they require is pretty bare bones, it's not outrageous to conclude that rather than change, they just wait until the environment is suitable for them again. I think the Australian species was actually discovered thanks to atypical flooding of the continent within the past couple years.The idea that "There simply wasn't any pressure to change that impacted them" is a misnomer. You could never devise (by you as an outside intelligent force) any more "natural pressures to change" than nature has pressed upon them as a species in over 200,000,000 years. In fact you nor I can even conceive of all the various pressures that they been exposed to and have endured without any change in the kind of organism that they are...triops...(outside of new varieties, just like cats and bats, and so many others).
Ha, publish my experiment I am doing mostly out of frustration and spite? I'm pretty sure posting my results on a public forum along the way would disqualify it from publishing anyways.I do wish you luck but sincerely hope that when the 10 years is completed and all you have are still triops, you will at least admit to yourself (though you would never be allowed to publish the truth) that all that this exercise actually demonstrates is that all it can and does produce is new varieties of the same creature and nothing more.
No worries, I am going to do that.In other words, to thine own self be true and do not allow the accepted presupposition to have to re-explain the conclusion. Let the actual data speak for itself.
No gene splicing or forced mutation here, but I am utilizing artificial selection so I don't have to make the Triops suffer from less than ideal conditions for the sake of an experiment. I work on this principle: animals can be used for experiments, but their pain and suffering should be minimized as much as possible.I am no Prophet but I KNOW you will start and end with triops unless you intervene with intelligently designed unnatural selection or gene splicing or some other intelligently designed impact.
I have a theory...That if there was really no God, then there'd be no atheists! I suspect that most atheists, are simply mad at God for...whatever.
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