Why is Satan mentioned so rarely in the Old Testament?

[victoryword]

Great, so God controls evil! What's the point, then? It seems bizarre praying for help with temptation to Him, when He's the one doing the tempting all along. How could I love such a God? A god mockingly telling me to fight against temptation, promising me help from it, yet all the time use Satan like a stupid little pawn to shove temptations in my face. :S

Hi AudioArtist

First, I hope you didn't gather this idea from my post. If you did, then I apologize for not being clearer. While the Bible is clear that Satan must occasionally ask God for permission to do things (Luke 22:31-34), I don't find this to be a hard fast rule. Satan is a rebel who has free-will and does most acts of evil on his own accord in an attempt to frustrate Gopd and His plans. Even in Job, Satan tells God that He has been walking to and fro about the earth and there is nothing in the passage indicating that he was doing this by God's ordination. I have recently done some research on Job and was surprised to find some scholarly insights on the subject. Calvinism has truly distorted God's role in the Job debacle. God was not siccing Satan on Job as some would imply. He knew Satan already desired to destroy Job.

Furthermore, if we read, it was SATAN WHO CHALLENGED GOD and not vice versa. Satan was the one who told God to destroy him. God refused to do it. Furthermore, when you read chapter 2, God was quite frustrated and upset with Satabn's malicious acts against Job and accused Satan of wanting God to destroy Job without any good reason. This proves that God did not have some predestined plan to use Satan as a tool to make Job a better man. Job was already a great man. Anyone who could go through what he went through and still not curse God (though he said some other dumb things about God) already has strength of character.

I preached on this some months ago. I have some of the notes at home if you ever want to read them, but they are NOT in a real organized manner. I am planning to write a book on this subject in the future.

I believe that God, being omni-wise, can use any situation to bring about His planned purposes. For example, I do NOT believe that God either wanted or ordained the evil acts of those who murdered Jesus. However, God worked through those free-will murderous acts to bring about our redemption. God is able to turn the evil acts of men to some benefit for those who love Him and will cooperate with Him.

As far as temptation, I don't believe that God ordains it. God tests His people (like a teacher would his students) but NEVER tempts them to evil. Nonetheless, we are in a spiritual warfare and temptation is inevitable. Rather than God being or ordaining temptation, He gives us all of the tools to fight against it (Eph. 6:10-18).

I could write a lot more on this subject, but since this is a forum and not a BLOG, I have to keep my posts to a minimum so that someone might read them I know that many reading this will not agree with me (what else is knew) but since I have studied and researched it, I am confident that God is no tempter and has no outside "temptation tools".

 

[ywjosh]

Hey! This is a great thread! I have been in several churches in my life (all pentecostal/charismatic) and the difference in the attitude towards Satan and demons is remarkable.

For me, I think of Scripture as being a light (like the whole 'light to my path thing'). In my mind, this is a picture of a flashlight (or torch for you British people). Flashlights don't shine everywhere all the time but only reveal some things.

Satan, in the Old Testament, is nowhere close to being the focus of what is going on. The Old Testament tells the narrative of God's dealings with Israel (with foreshadowings and outright promises to the rest of the world). Because the narrative often centres on a whole nation and not just individual people I think the role of Satan as tempter is downplayed. Later, when salvation becomes very much an individual thing (in the New Testament) the role of Satan (or demons) to tempt individuals is brought more in focus.

Of course, I hold to a very high view of the Bible so don't misunderstand my analogy. The Bible is inspired and authoritative but it is not a textbook on all things.

A couple of points (briefly) that have slipped into this thread that should be mentioned:

1. God did NOT create evil. Someone said this a few pages back and it is a terrible thought as well as being opposed to Scripture.
2. Progressive revelation is an interesting thought but does it help to think of God willingly keeping the existence or nature of Satan a secret?

 

[victoryword]

Hey! This is a great thread! I have been in several churches in my life (all pentecostal/charismatic) and the difference in the attitude towards Satan and demons is remarkable.

For me, I think of Scripture as being a light (like the whole 'light to my path thing'). In my mind, this is a picture of a flashlight (or torch for you British people). Flashlights don't shine everywhere all the time but only reveal some things.

Satan, in the Old Testament, is nowhere close to being the focus of what is going on. The Old Testament tells the narrative of God's dealings with Israel (with foreshadowings and outright promises to the rest of the world). Because the narrative often centres on a whole nation and not just individual people I think the role of Satan as tempter is downplayed. Later, when salvation becomes very much an individual thing (in the New Testament) the role of Satan (or demons) to tempt individuals is brought more in focus.

Of course, I hold to a very high view of the Bible so don't misunderstand my analogy. The Bible is inspired and authoritative but it is not a textbook on all things.

A couple of points (briefly) that have slipped into this thread that should be mentioned:

1. God did NOT create evil. Someone said this a few pages back and it is a terrible thought as well as being opposed to Scripture.
2. Progressive revelation is an interesting thought but does it help to think of God willingly keeping the existence or nature of Satan a secret?

First of all, excellent post

As for your question about "progressive revelation" (since I was the one who brought it up), I wouldn't say that God kept him a secret. Some scholars say that Job is the oldest book in the Bible. If this is true, then God definitely was not attempting to hide his role concerning evil.

However, I believe, like you so aptly pointed out, that God's dealings with Israel is the main focus of the OT. However, since God does mention Satan at least four (or more) times in the OT, God certainly was not attempting to hide him. But again, as you appear to state, more insight and revelation of things in the spirit are given in the New Testament.

 

[JimB]

Yes, you usually do.

Usually?

Why the personal insult, S4? Have I ticked you off or something?

~Jim

Idealism increases in direct proportion to one’s distance from the problem.​

 

[stone]

Hi AudioArtist

First, I hope you didn't gather this idea from my post. If you did, then I apologize for not being clearer. While the Bible is clear that Satan must occasionally ask God for permission to do things (Luke 22:31-34), I don't find this to be a hard fast rule. Satan is a rebel who has free-will and does most acts of evil on his own accord in an attempt to frustrate Gopd and His plans. Even in Job, Satan tells God that He has been walking to and fro about the earth and there is nothing in the passage indicating that he was doing this by God's ordination. I have recently done some research on Job and was surprised to find some scholarly insights on the subject. Calvinism has truly distorted God's role in the Job debacle. God was not siccing Satan on Job as some would imply. He knew Satan already desired to destroy Job.

Furthermore, if we read, it was SATAN WHO CHALLENGED GOD and not vice versa. Satan was the one who told God to destroy him. God refused to do it. Furthermore, when you read chapter 2, God was quite frustrated and upset with Satabn's malicious acts against Job and accused Satan of wanting God to destroy Job without any good reason. This proves that God did not have some predestined plan to use Satan as a tool to make Job a better man. Job was already a great man. Anyone who could go through what he went through and still not curse God (though he said some other dumb things about God) already has strength of character.

I preached on this some months ago. I have some of the notes at home if you ever want to read them, but they are NOT in a real organized manner. I am planning to write a book on this subject in the future.

I believe that God, being omni-wise, can use any situation to bring about His planned purposes. For example, I do NOT believe that God either wanted or ordained the evil acts of those who murdered Jesus. However, God worked through those free-will murderous acts to bring about our redemption. God is able to turn the evil acts of men to some benefit for those who love Him and will cooperate with Him.

As far as temptation, I don't believe that God ordains it. God tests His people (like a teacher would his students) but NEVER tempts them to evil. Nonetheless, we are in a spiritual warfare and temptation is inevitable. Rather than God being or ordaining temptation, He gives us all of the tools to fight against it (Eph. 6:10-18).

I could write a lot more on this subject, but since this is a forum and not a BLOG, I have to keep my posts to a minimum so that someone might read them I know that many reading this will not agree with me (what else is knew) but since I have studied and researched it, I am confident that God is no tempter and has no outside "temptation tools".

what he said.

 

[NikkiLee]

In a school book that I have been reading it says that the period prior to 586.B.C.E there are no satan figure. Can anyone tell me why to confirm this for me?

 

[Svt4Him]

Usually?

Why the personal insult, S4? Have I ticked you off or something?

~Jim

Idealism increases in direct proportion to one’s distance from the problem.​

Wow, old thread popped up. Personal insult? You may take it that way, I simply answered your question. I personally think it's best to not ask them if you are insulted by the answers.

Back to the op, I think Jesus revealed more about the spiritual battle we are in than the OT did, as well as empowered us to fight it. I don't think it's dualism that was the root.

Now because it's not mentioned much doesn't make it insignificant. If that were the case, then why is being born again/born from above not mentioned more?