Why is it so dead here ?

[rob64]

This is the Full Time Ministry area of CF, it should be lit up like a neon sign with posts

 

[drich0150]

I guess,
This is the place set a side for those in the administrative portion of ministry, or at least that how it seems. Mostly those in a leadership position. Seemingly most of the "leaders" here have direction, or at least know where to find it on there own..

 

[rob64]

I guess,
This is the place set a side for those in the administrative portion of ministry, or at least that how it seems. Mostly those in a leadership position. Seemingly most of the "leaders" here have direction, or at least know where to find it on there own..

I see. Thanx ! It does make perfect sense.

 

[vespasia]

Plus if your working in any form of full time ministry you rarely have spare time to be on any forum.

 

[rob64]

Plus if your working in any form of full time ministry you rarely have spare time to be on any forum.

Aren't all true believers in the ministry full time?

 

[married asaph]

"The ministry" is generally assumed to consist of ordained clergy working fulltime in a church or parachurch setting.

Of course, true believers will be involved in a ministry, and that ministry might even be fulltime.

It's just a question of terminology, I think.

 

[windcatcher]

Your simple question made this forum alive!

 

[rob64]

"The ministry" is generally assumed to consist of ordained clergy working fulltime in a church or parachurch setting.

Of course, true believers will be involved in a ministry, and that ministry might even be fulltime.

It's just a question of terminology, I think.

As I understand the Bible;
There is only ONE ministry with various "callings". ..."for the edifying of the body of Christ, for the "WORKING OF THE MINISTRY..." [Singular]
Our ministry is to proclaim the good news to all mankind.
In a church setting, there are different 'offices'. as well as "CALLINGS". "...Paul, CALLED to be an apostle..."
We are all one BODY with Jesus as the head. And the body is made up of different members...
Some water, some cultivate, but GOD alone gives the increase.
That's the way the NT describes ministry, callings, offices, service, etc...
Man comes in and starts his own "ministry". Or clings to tradition. Or wants to do things his own way !

 

[drich0150]

I don't think the issue is with the biblical translation of what a ministry is or is not.. It's when it's translated into English the word ministry or the phrase "full time ministry" (In English) would indicate someone in an administrative role as apposed to the broad term you have eloquently have given a definition for. even though the word or phrase is the same, it takes on a different meaning in "Popular christian" terms.

So when one would read "Full time ministry" it would more than likely be understood as someone who is employed by a church.. And as i said earlier most of the people in that sort of position know how to resolve the majority of there issues with other forms of support.

 

[rob64]

I don't think the issue is with the biblical translation of what a ministry is or is not.. It's when it's translated into English the word ministry or the phrase "full time ministry" (In English) would indicate someone in an administrative role as apposed to the broad term you have eloquently have given a definition for. even though the word or phrase is the same, it takes on a different meaning in "Popular christian" terms.

So when one would read "Full time ministry" it would more than likely be understood as someone who is employed by a church.. And as i said earlier most of the people in that sort of position know how to resolve the majority of there issues with other forms of support.

Have you ever done any word studies ? Say... taking a word and going back to the origional language, such as greek, via the 'Strongs Exaustive Concordance' ? When one does this, sometimes the true meaning of scripture rings loud and clear.

Example; When the Lord Jesus asked Peter, "...do you love me...?"
He repeatedly asked him that question. What is the significance of the passage in your eyes?

 

[drich0150]

Have you ever done any word studies ?

Yes, I have been known to crack the Critical Lexicon And Concordance To The English And Greek New Testament. When trying to discern word origins or meanings. But may I say again Biblical Definitions Are not the culprit here..

Pop christianity has taken words like "love and ministry" and has changed the meanings for the masses or to all who would claim belief. Like it or not, we are all apart of Pop christianity at some point or another. Especially when we misuse words like "Ministry" or "Love." Pop christianity isn't all bad some times it even has it moments, but it's down fall is when we begin to worship our popular beliefs as gospel truth.. Or when we begin to worship the method of belief as we should God himself. This is when the poison of religion winds up hurting our relationship with the lord rather than helping it.

I know this is your thread, but I think your intent or focus should be directed towards shining the light of truth on religion or pop christianity, and how it can destroy personal Godly relationships.. Rather than trying to re-educate us to the biblical definitions that most of the people who would come to this section of the web site should/would already know. If you shine the light on the reason for the darkness rather than the darkness itself we would have the opportunity to remove the obstruction ourselves and let our own light in..

For example: using the term or definition for "Full Time Ministry" as you have pointed out in one of your previous posts.

This particular section that is labeled "full time ministry" may be some what in active.. but, when you apply the actual definition of ministry to the collective efforts here on this website one would quickly realize that this entire site in an exercise in "full time ministry" and that the label that the web master used to title this portion of the site would probably refer to the people who are "employed full time in the ministry."

So you see, the word association trap works both ways in pop christianity. It would have some to believe that this is a section reserved for full time employees of the church, and it would have others who know what biblical definition of ministry is, to only associate true ministry with the sections of the website so named..

I know you personally are probably a little smarter than all of that and were just looking for an opportunity to spread some knoweledge.. That's why the last two paragraphs were used just as an example. My focus was not to reeducate you, to specific definitions, but to shine a little light on the actual issue, a person's perception.
From here Your or anyone's knowledge would automatically take over testing the facts presented to be true or not. and if the personal questions can be satisfied, and there are no pride issues, perceptions (in this case) will normally change.


I don't want to seem condescending, nor do I usually go to these lengths in my explanations, but your query and follow up dialog with my assumption of this being a place for the leaders of the church to seek advise or help.. has me writing to you as a leader or a Shepard, rather than someone seeking advise. as a leader you know it's not the thought that misdirects, but the thought process behind that thought that can mislead. Again i know i am taking a risk in that if you were just looking for an opportunity to soap box or preach to the quire, and in that all of my efforts may seem alittle condescending. I do say with great respect for your efforts here and at your home congregation that I do not intend any disrespect, but merely to share what has been given me.

I do apologize if I intruded on any personal quests.

 

[rob64]

I do apologize if I intruded on any personal quests.

Not to worry,my friend. This is good stuff IMO. You have brought up some fascinating ideas. It's very thought provoking.

I apologize if I have offended anyone who reads this, or If I seem criticle.

My purpose for this thread;
In this area of CF, there must be leaders from all 'denominations'. Even tho we're all leaders, it certainly doesn't mean that we have 'arrived'.

During my walk with Christ, I've had the oportunity to visit countless churches, of many different denominations. What I have witnessed through all of this, is that churches for the most part are DEAD.
Alot of churches are being run like a business, or corporation. The world has crept into the church.
People put on their church faces and go to a sevice for an hour or two, and then put God on a shelf till the next Sunday. The other 6 days, they forget about the poor, the hungry, the needy, the widows, the prisoners, etc...

There is a verse that says, "As the king is, so is the people"
How does this relate to "dead churches" ?
It's simple; If the king is dead, so are the people.

Why have I written all this? This is the "full time ministry" forum, where the leaders are at. This is the forum for the 'kings'.

IMO, we should be seing hundreds of posts here, telling of all the miricles, and healings, and stories of salvation, and all the mighty things God has been doing.

I'm not addressing anyone on this forum personally, it's just that I find it alarming that it is so DEAD.

 

[drich0150]

I feel the same way.. I have made journeys to different churches of different denom, and Non-denominations, and have found this same phenomenon at work.. This luke warm popular version of christianity is what I've labeled your dead king syndrome.

The biggest issue with it, is we are all infected to a degree, but once your consumed, people tend to get locked into worshiping their faith, and vigorously defend it as if they were defending God, when in fact they are worshiping tradition. With God out of the picture the heart for God withers away, and all that is left is the tradition of our "righteous" fore fathers.. Leaving behind a society of brothers and sisters going thru the motions of religion.

So I guess the real question should be is how does one Save the saved?

Which brings me back to the whole shedding light on the way people think, rather than re-education.. If someone already thinks he/she knows it all academically, (Or has a firm grasp of it) then you have to approach it differently. People tend to shut down when a "different Gospel" is preached. I have found some success in going after the thought process that cements in hard hearts.. leading or directing a person in such a way to allow them (in most cases) to use there current knoweledge of scripture to free them from what I generally found to be a pop-christian dilemma.

Your experence in other forms of christian worship should aid you in how those groups think. With a heart for this form of ministry, some intense prayer and God's blessing you could help lead the true Church into it's next evolution.. What ever that may look like.

 

[rob64]

I feel the same way.. I have made journeys to different churches of different denom, and Non-denominations, and have found this same phenomenon at work.. This luke warm popular version of christianity is what I've labeled your dead king syndrome.

The biggest issue with it, is we are all infected to a degree, but once your consumed, people tend to get locked into worshiping their faith, and vigorously defend it as if they were defending God, when in fact they are worshiping tradition. With God out of the picture the heart for God withers away, and all that is left is the tradition of our "righteous" fore fathers.. Leaving behind a society of brothers and sisters going thru the motions of religion.

So I guess the real question should be is how does one Save the saved?

Which brings me back to the whole shedding light on the way people think, rather than re-education.. If someone already thinks he/she knows it all academically, (Or has a firm grasp of it) then you have to approach it differently. People tend to shut down when a "different Gospel" is preached. I have found some success in going after the thought process that cements in hard hearts.. leading or directing a person in such a way to allow them (in most cases) to use there current knoweledge of scripture to free them from what I generally found to be a pop-christian dilemma.

Your experence in other forms of christian worship should aid you in how those groups think. With a heart for this form of ministry, some intense prayer and God's blessing you could help lead the true Church into it's next evolution.. What ever that may look like.

VERY PROFOUND !!!

You've said exactly what I think !

How do you do that? lol

 

[drich0150]

How do you do that?

...Not me but the Spirit that dwells in both of us. Truth is universal, and it doesn't matter who diagnosed why or how the church is broken.. The truth is it is broken, and it only takes a Spirit trained tech to spot it.

 

[rob64]

...Not me but the Spirit that dwells in both of us. Truth is universal, and it doesn't matter who diagnosed why or how the church is broken.. The truth is it is broken, and it only takes a Spirit trained tech to spot it.

WOW !!!