Why is dating the unsaved easier?

[saelestis]

Suppose you want to go out with someone to do something wholesome and safe, like go for coffee, visit a museum, or see a holiday display. When I used to go out with someone unsaved, it was very easy. We would go, enjoy this, share a warm farewell, and see each other again. I was (and still am) a virgin after having gone out with an unsaved woman for 4 years. This is to dispel the notion that if you do, you will wind up jumping in bed. There were boundaries and they were honored.

She is gone (left me) and I am alone now. We got along, got strained near the end and she disappeared with very rude silence.


I try to initiate a relationship now with Christian women now and invite to things just as safe and innocent, and yet the response is as distant and guarded as if I were some potential soul-sucker waiting to rip one out through someone’s ear. Am I, in trying to do the right thing now, doing the wrong thing? Why is it so hard to get a good Christian woman to at least begin a friendship?

It was easier going out with someone unsaved. Does this mean I will wind up with someone unsaved? Pagan? Witch? I am trying to go in the right direction, but it seems I will ultimately just have to do whatever gives me satisfactory results.

 

[MN John]

Hey bro,

I hear you. I think that there is one thing to take into account that might shed some light. If what you want is a casual friendship, then make that clear and you'll get positive responses from like-minded Christian ladies. But if that's what you ask for, don't be surprised if the relationship doesn't last if one of you decides that they want marriage.

However, if what your ultimate goal is is actually marriage, then make that clear too. There are Christians out there who don't want to marry and ones who do. Many who desire marriage see no reason to date someone who isn't a potential mate. A man who is looking only for casual fun and companionship isn't making himself a potential mate.

I actually find it much harder to date a nonbeliever because when I used to do that there were always tensions between our lifestyles and beliefs.

Whichever kind of relationship you want, if you are clear and up front about it, you'll get a better response from women who want what you offer. Of course, if you're asking women who don't already know you well, then they may not know whether to believe you when you make it clear what you're seeking. The solution to this is to be active in church groups and get to know other Christian singles there and then they will know you well enough to be able to assess your offer correctly.

 

[oncewas]

After becoming a Christian, I learned that yes, I was divorced on biblical grounds in my favor. However, having made the requirement to date only Christian men, not one will even venture friendship for I am a "fallen, tainted, jaded, you name it woman." I've been experiencing this for almost 20 years. So are you living in the law or by grace when you meet these women? Are you holding a Christian woman to such a high standard she may not ever measure up but expect less of the unsaved?

And if you're curious it has only been the unsaved that have ever called me a "good" Christian woman. I haven't been on too many dates especially since I don't hop into bed with the saved or unsaved. I've been told that's my biggest problem.

 

[mysparrow]

Hey bro,

I hear you. I think that there is one thing to take into account that might shed some light. If what you want is a casual friendship, then make that clear and you'll get positive responses from like-minded Christian ladies. But if that's what you ask for, don't be surprised if the relationship doesn't last if one of you decides that they want marriage.

However, if what your ultimate goal is is actually marriage, then make that clear too. There are Christians out there who don't want to marry and ones who do. Many who desire marriage see no reason to date someone who isn't a potential mate. A man who is looking only for casual fun and companionship isn't making himself a potential mate.

I actually find it much harder to date a nonbeliever because when I used to do that there were always tensions between our lifestyles and beliefs.

Whichever kind of relationship you want, if you are clear and up front about it, you'll get a better response from women who want what you offer. Of course, if you're asking women who don't already know you well, then they may not know whether to believe you when you make it clear what you're seeking. The solution to this is to be active in church groups and get to know other Christian singles there and then they will know you well enough to be able to assess your offer correctly.

Good solid advice , and much appreciated . Even in the Christian world there is so many that have been not treated as the bible says we should , men and women , and people get wary. Its sad , but true. I personally dont date anymore, cause I found that although they said i was a mature Christian lady, solid in my faith, and walking close to God, and thats what attracted them to me, obviously, there were underlying motives, which i wouldnt agree with, in order to keep myself where God would have me , so it just didnt work out. It would be nice to have someone to just go to dinner with, a museum, etc, without having to worry about all the other stuff, and thinking that every man thinks your ready to get married. Go to Christian functions, singings, etc, church group stuff, and get to know single women casually, once they see you for who God made you, then youll be able to ask someone out . They are out there, and for me personally I wont date a non Christian, just because its too much of hardship . God comes first in my life, period, and a non Christian just wont have that same love that i do . Anyways, im done ramblin now LOL

 

[whitestar]

Suppose you want to go out with someone to do something wholesome and safe, like go for coffee, visit a museum, or see a holiday display. When I used to go out with someone unsaved, it was very easy. We would go, enjoy this, share a warm farewell, and see each other again. I was (and still am) a virgin after having gone out with an unsaved woman for 4 years. This is to dispel the notion that if you do, you will wind up jumping in bed. There were boundaries and they were honored.

She is gone (left me) and I am alone now. We got along, got strained near the end and she disappeared with very rude silence.


I try to initiate a relationship now with Christian women now and invite to things just as safe and innocent, and yet the response is as distant and guarded as if I were some potential soul-sucker waiting to rip one out through someone’s ear. Am I, in trying to do the right thing now, doing the wrong thing? Why is it so hard to get a good Christian woman to at least begin a friendship?

It was easier going out with someone unsaved. Does this mean I will wind up with someone unsaved? Pagan? Witch? I am trying to go in the right direction, but it seems I will ultimately just have to do whatever gives me satisfactory results.

First I wanted to say how much I admire you for remaining a virgin and standing up for your convictions...and second I love your sense of humor...

I was going to reply to this saying...dating..what's that? I also haven't dated for years either...I am divorced from an abusive marriage and he committed adultery who knows how many times...since I haven't really dated in such a long time I have no idea how a Christian man might see if, if I am considered tainted too....if so, fine, I don't need that kind of judgemental person in my life to start with so those men can just stay far away from me!!

I have on son I am raising by myself (which I was even when I was married as his dad sure didn't do anything to help raise him)...so I can be more of a target for those type of men that see me as some lonely single mom that will snap up any man that looks her way! blah!!

I finally decided if God wants me to remarry one day, He will take care of things for me....and that man would have to come with a letter of recommendation from God anyway!! ha!!

I think maybe just try relaxing a bit and praying for God to guide you on finding Miss Right...if that is what you are looking for. I will keep you in my prayers too.

God bless

 

[woman.at.the.well]

Suppose you want to go out with someone to do something wholesome and safe, like go for coffee, visit a museum, or see a holiday display. When I used to go out with someone unsaved, it was very easy. We would go, enjoy this, share a warm farewell, and see each other again. I was (and still am) a virgin after having gone out with an unsaved woman for 4 years. This is to dispel the notion that if you do, you will wind up jumping in bed. There were boundaries and they were honored.

She is gone (left me) and I am alone now. We got along, got strained near the end and she disappeared with very rude silence.


I try to initiate a relationship now with Christian women now and invite to things just as safe and innocent, and yet the response is as distant and guarded as if I were some potential soul-sucker waiting to rip one out through someone’s ear. Am I, in trying to do the right thing now, doing the wrong thing? Why is it so hard to get a good Christian woman to at least begin a friendship?

It was easier going out with someone unsaved. Does this mean I will wind up with someone unsaved? Pagan? Witch? I am trying to go in the right direction, but it seems I will ultimately just have to do whatever gives me satisfactory results.

Don't give up! Maybe God needs you alone this time so He can lead you and guide you or for growth purposes. Whatever you do, don't listen to the evil one and give up on doing the right thing EVER!!! Please keep the faith. Keep in prayer and stay in good company. Remember what happens with just a little yeast.

 

[tryme]

BTW the gent who started this thread had a follow up thread:

Ten reasons why I prefer Christian Women: An Open letter to godly and eligible women.

 

[woman.at.the.well]

I just went and read this awesome letter. He should have no trouble at all finding the woman of his dreams with priorities like that.

Bless you brother saelestis!!

 

[saelestis]

Hi,

Thanks.

I just went and read this awesome letter. He should have no trouble at all finding the woman of his dreams with priorities like that.

Bless you brother saelestis!!

 

[saelestis]

I have essentially experienced a very discouraging series of brush-offs that resulted in not even having decent friendships (with Christian women), and distant, grudgingly tolerant attitudes. It turned out that the one I was with for 4 years came after me on the rebound, so to speak. We did have some good times together but I could barely go towards plain, blatant Biblical truth without friction. Not a good sign. It took a long time to get over her and the unanswerable insult that breakup was (dumped me without a word, could never reach her again, never saw her again. I am relieved that we never “did it”- I have less regrets.



I only expected companionship; I never expected sex. We talked about expectations right away, so the matter was settled immediately and the terms honored. The problem I have had with trying to initiate other relationships has basically been “No, no, no” to everything, no matter how wholesome and safe even, Like the guy in that annoying credit card commercial. Anyone who says refusing sex your biggest problem actually has a problem, not you. You are doing the right thing by abstaining. Making sex in dating a requirement shows that whoever is saying this is operating from the standards of the world and not of Christ.



There is a jewel growing inside you called Jesus, the treasure that brought you to this forum in the first place. There is an eternal soul inside you that was injured, broken, and lost once. Jesus reached in and made it new. It’s real. How do I know? He taught me that it is in a way, fascinating, unusual, startling, so profound I cannot discuss it publicly. I have gained a new appreciation and respect for the way we were created as a result. Fallen, tainted, jaded? We all are. Sin is all equally bad but God’s forgiveness is powerful enough to forgive all sins. There must be someone for you.



What do I expect? Basically that a woman be friendly, Christ-like, gentle, and good company. Not a doormat, but not an inaccessible fortress either, in the sense of becoming personally acquainted. No tempting and leading on, please! You play with fire if you do. Modest and attractive adornment aside, a sweet spirit, a good heart, and a lovely personality are more than sexy enough.

Also if I were going astray and beginning to behave sinfully, I need to be stopped immediately in reasonable proportion. I am willing to mutually submit to a chaste relationship. Boundaries? Mild kissing, a hug, holding hands. Yes, there is much more a part of me would love to get but I know if things went there, it would destroy everything I’ve been longing and praying for. Better to be reasonably satisfied by gentle reassurance within boundaries now and enjoy full intimacy and its delights and benefits later in the proper context.

Don't compromise your Christian walk for anyone, ever. If they can't see you commitment to Christ as beautiful, then they are not worthy to have you.

After becoming a Christian, I learned that yes, I was divorced on biblical grounds in my favor. However, having made the requirement to date only Christian men, not one will even venture friendship for I am a "fallen, tainted, jaded, you name it woman." I've been experiencing this for almost 20 years. So are you living in the law or by grace when you meet these women? Are you holding a Christian woman to such a high standard she may not ever measure up but expect less of the unsaved?

And if you're curious it has only been the unsaved that have ever called me a "good" Christian woman. I haven't been on too many dates especially since I don't hop into bed with the saved or unsaved. I've been told that's my biggest problem.

 

[woman.at.the.well]

I have essentially experienced a very discouraging series of brush-offs that resulted in not even having decent friendships (with Christian women), and distant, grudgingly tolerant attitudes. It turned out that the one I was with for 4 years came after me on the rebound, so to speak. We did have some good times together but I could barely go towards plain, blatant Biblical truth without friction. Not a good sign. It took a long time to get over her and the unanswerable insult that breakup was (dumped me without a word, could never reach her again, never saw her again. I am relieved that we never “did it”- I have less regrets.



I only expected companionship; I never expected sex. We talked about expectations right away, so the matter was settled immediately and the terms honored. The problem I have had with trying to initiate other relationships has basically been “No, no, no” to everything, no matter how wholesome and safe even, Like the guy in that annoying credit card commercial. Anyone who says refusing sex your biggest problem actually has a problem, not you. You are doing the right thing by abstaining. Making sex in dating a requirement shows that whoever is saying this is operating from the standards of the world and not of Christ.



There is a jewel growing inside you called Jesus, the treasure that brought you to this forum in the first place. There is an eternal soul inside you that was injured, broken, and lost once. Jesus reached in and made it new. It’s real. How do I know? He taught me that it is in a way, fascinating, unusual, startling, so profound I cannot discuss it publicly. I have gained a new appreciation and respect for the way we were created as a result. Fallen, tainted, jaded? We all are. Sin is all equally bad but God’s forgiveness is powerful enough to forgive all sins. There must be someone for you.



What do I expect? Basically that a woman be friendly, Christ-like, gentle, and good company. Not a doormat, but not an inaccessible fortress either, in the sense of becoming personally acquainted. No tempting and leading on, please! You play with fire if you do. Modest and attractive adornment aside, a sweet spirit, a good heart, and a lovely personality are more than sexy enough.

Also if I were going astray and beginning to behave sinfully, I need to be stopped immediately in reasonable proportion. I am willing to mutually submit to a chaste relationship. Boundaries? Mild kissing, a hug, holding hands. Yes, there is much more a part of me would love to get but I know if things went there, it would destroy everything I’ve been longing and praying for. Better to be reasonably satisfied by gentle reassurance within boundaries now and enjoy full intimacy and its delights and benefits later in the proper context.

Don't compromise your Christian walk for anyone, ever. If they can't see you commitment to Christ as beautiful, then they are not worthy to have you.

& Amen! This is absolutely wonderful saelestis. I could not think of a better way to say:

"Don't compromise your Christian walk for anyone, ever. If they can't see you commitment to Christ as beautiful, then they are not worthy to have you."

It's the God's honest truth! Good stuff brother! Good stuff!

 

[loribee59]

Not sure this relates to the OP, but I thought to share this~ I had the foresight to save this because this young man is so wise beyond his years and in his faith, and it touched my heart to read it...btw, this was originally posted in August 2003...

Well.....here's what I truly think about women


*Warning: I'm a perfectionist, and I don't think this came out quite right. I'm trying to express my appreciation for all of my sisters in Christ, so if you misinterpret something I said as being cheauvenistic, please cast it down, because it's far from my intention. On the contrary, I'm trying to express just how valuable you all are.*

The other day, I was at work and was just thinking as I always do. And for some reason, I was thinking about the story of Adam and Eve. I personally believe that the first few books of Genesis contain the deepest love story ever written, but that's besides my point. Actually, it has a lot to do with my point, but I'll try not to mense words. I was basically thinking about how Adam was in the Garden of Eden with God and all the animals, birds, creeping things, etc. and God was looking at him with love, but something struck a form of compassionate pain in His heart: the fact that Adam was alone while all the other animals had equals. I kind of saw it like a father looking at his child, and with a concerned expression saying, "Hmmm....it's not good for man to be alone like that." Then, His face brightening up as He got the idea and said, "I know what I'll do. I'll make someone just for him who He'll love with that signifies the love I have for Him". So what did He do but take a rib from Adam and make (what I think) the most precious non-sacrificial (IOW besides Jesus lol) personal gift ever to man.....woman. This sudden revelation of mine immediately crushed any leftover bitterness and resentment towards females (personal reasons), crushed any possibility of resentment towards females if they may try to pull the "we're the dominant gender" (because because of this revelation, I know it's all....umm..hootie ) and gave me a greater revelation of God's love towards men, women, and mankind alike:

God loved man so much that he thought it good to give him a personal perfected gift to perfectly compliment him.

God loves women so much that he took great care into making sure that she was perfect for man. Now before you take this the wrong way, consider this: God won't give His children anything but the best....and He wouldn't settle until He had formed the perfect creation as a gift (did that come out right? )

Basically, my admiration for women has skyrocketed in that I view them as the most perfect gift that God has ever made (of course other than Jesus). I wish I could really express what I'm saying because something tells me that it may come off the wrong way to some. I'm usually better at writing than this, but I guess I'm going through some kind of block. But my whole point is that since I thought about that, it kind of hurts me when women think they're not pretty because they think they're not worthy of being on the cover of Cosmopolitan. I wish that they'd realize how precious a gift they are and take heart to that so they can actually realize their worth.

*aaagghhh!!! There's so much more I wish I could type, but it's just not coming out right. Hopefully this made sense. *

 

[Mercy4u]

Hi, I'm new here and was reading your post about dating nonChristians easier. I've actually found nonChristian men harder to date. NonChristian men are usually out for one thing only(or at least the ones I've met). I too am a virgin and intend to stay that way until my wedding night. I haven't found a lot of men understanding about that nonChristian OR believe it or not Christian.
I try to live within Biblical guidelines. I don't think I could have a dating relationship with a nonChristian because he wouldn't understand me and why I choose to live in the guideleines I live in. I can't seperate who I am from my Christianity. It's just a part of my personality that comes out in everything I do. I have some nonChristian friends but I can only get so close to them.
I'm sorry you were hurt in your past relationship. I pray God sends you the women He has for you. I know how hard it is to wait for that person and how lonliness is a huge battle. Honestly It's the hardest struggle in my life as a single woman and the only way I walk through it on a daily basis is with the strength God gives me through the Holy Spirit. Without Him I would have never made it this far!

 

[mesue]

Suppose you want to go out with someone to do something wholesome and safe, like go for coffee, visit a museum, or see a holiday display. When I used to go out with someone unsaved, it was very easy. We would go, enjoy this, share a warm farewell, and see each other again. I was (and still am) a virgin after having gone out with an unsaved woman for 4 years. This is to dispel the notion that if you do, you will wind up jumping in bed. There were boundaries and they were honored.

She is gone (left me) and I am alone now. We got along, got strained near the end and she disappeared with very rude silence.


I try to initiate a relationship now with Christian women now and invite to things just as safe and innocent, and yet the response is as distant and guarded as if I were some potential soul-sucker waiting to rip one out through someone’s ear. Am I, in trying to do the right thing now, doing the wrong thing? Why is it so hard to get a good Christian woman to at least begin a friendship?

It was easier going out with someone unsaved. Does this mean I will wind up with someone unsaved? Pagan? Witch? I am trying to go in the right direction, but it seems I will ultimately just have to do whatever gives me satisfactory results.

Think about this from the woman's perspective. How would it appear for her to be out with you, anywhere, by herself? Billy Graham was never in the room alone with another woman, except family. He never walked into his hotel room first, he always had someone check the room beforew he went in. Why? Because this way he remained beyond reproach. No falsehoods or speculations could be made. In our church, no one person is allowed to be in the church with a member of the opposite sex alone. Legalistic? Perhaps. But at least rumors and gossip won't get started because of that. We have plenty of fodder for rumors and gossip as it is.
Have you considered group dating? Going out with a bunch of friends? Especially for a "first date" kinda thing?

 

[Mercy4u]

Have you considered group dating? Going out with a bunch of friends? Especially for a "first date" kinda thing?

That is a great idea saelestis. Speaking as a Christian women, I prefer going on dates in a group at first. There isn't as much pressure and it's a good way to get to know each other before you go out alone. It's also a good testing ground to see if you are compatible with the person and want to carry the relationship further. If not, it hasn't gome far enough for either of you to get hurt.
I'm currently reading "Wild at Heart" and "Captivating" which are great Christian books to read to understand how the opposite sex thinks and how miscommunications can happen just because of the different ways men and women percieve things. Women want to feel safe and for me taking things slow and being in a group really helps break the ice in a starting friendship especially if there is a possibility of it becomming more than a friendship.
Just my opinion though. Other women may not feel the same way.

 

[NicelyAged]

Saelstis, hello

I definitely understand how you feel. Non Christian women are easier because they are more willing to use dating as a means to discover if there's long term relationship potential. In the old days, Christian women did this to, but this has changed.

The Christian community has backtracked to a modified form of arranged marriages. There's no longer a process of discovering who you're soulmate is. Supposedly, it's arranged for you. The prevailing belief now is that we don't choose who we marry anymore, God "arranges" if for us. Although I'm not sure exactly how that works.

Consequently, you're seeing exactly what you're describing. Christian women tend to "inpenetrable fortresses" because they believe they've already been chosen for the husband that's been arranged for them. They're just waiting for him to appear.

None the less, be active in your Christian social circle and make friends. A strong base of friendships makes being single a lot funner. If you meet women that peak your interest, get to know them in your social activities. If you meet the woman that has supposedly been arranged for you by Providence, something will happen or a course of events that will make you both realize you've met your arranged soulmate.

As far as going out with women to do one on one activities goes, as you have already seen, you'll fair a lot better with non Christian women. Since you seem to have a good lock on boundaries, I'd say go out with them and have fun. Just keep your guard up. It's probably not a good idea to fall in love with one of them unless she discovers the Lord.

 

[Mercy4u]

Saelstis, hello

I definitely understand how you feel. Non Christian women are easier because they are more willing to use dating as a means to discover if there's long term relationship potential. In the old days, Christian women did this to, but this has changed.

The Christian community has backtracked to a modified form of arranged marriages. There's no longer a process of discovering who you're soulmate is. Supposedly, it's arranged for you. The prevailing belief now is that we don't choose who we marry anymore, God "arranges" if for us. Although I'm not sure exactly how that works.

Consequently, you're seeing exactly what you're describing. Christian women tend to "inpenetrable fortresses" because they believe they've already been chosen for the husband that's been arranged for them. They're just waiting for him to appear.

None the less, be active in your Christian social circle and make friends. A strong base of friendships makes being single a lot funner. If you meet women that peak your interest, get to know them in your social activities. If you meet the woman that has supposedly been arranged for you by Providence, something will happen or a course of events that will make you both realize you've met your arranged soulmate.

As far as going out with women to do one on one activities goes, as you have already seen, you'll fair a lot better with non Christian women. Since you seem to have a good lock on boundaries, I'd say go out with them and have fun. Just keep your guard up. It's probably not a good idea to fall in love with one of them unless she discovers the Lord.

Wow, NicelyAged, That's certainly a different concept. I'm going to have to give that some thought and some serious prayer in my own life. I don't consider myself an "inpenetrable fortress" (unless it's a nonChristian man) but I do beleive in soulmates and that God has someone picked out for me. I beleive it's a process of finding out who that is.

As for dating nonchristians, I personaly wouldn't recommend it. I think even the strongest person can get caught up in something they will regret later.

Do you beleive we are on our own as far as finding a mate and that there is more than one person out there that could be right for a person? Do you think that it doesn't matter to God as long as the person is compatible to us and a CHristian?
I'm just curious on your viewpoint not looking to start an arguement.

By the way, I noticed that this is a 40's thread, I won't be 40 for another year and a half, is it ok to post here? I don't want to be disrespectful of the rules or anything, I just found this thread interesting.

 

[MN John]

By the way, I noticed that this is a 40's thread, I won't be 40 for another year and a half, is it ok to post here? I don't want to be disrespectful of the rules or anything, I just found this thread interesting.

I'm still rather new here myself, so this is just my opinion. But it seems to me that the 40's forum isn't as strict as say the men's or women's forums. If you find that you fit in well with us, I believe you are welcome to stay and play.

 

[NicelyAged]

Hi Mercy4U

Well, if you read my posts in this a few other forums, you will see some different ideas comming from me. While my core faith and beliefs have always been intact, my life experience has proven (Im my opinion) some areas of traditional christian thinking and biblical application to be wrong. I post about those thoughts here.

I enjoy this forum because it's so lopsided which creates a lot of opportunity to present and alternate view. Thank for your reply.

 

[NicelyAged]

Mercy4U

I'll let you know ahead of time that I don't argue. I just enjoy thought provoking discussion whether I'm right or wrong. ;-) Maybe I'll learn something.

To answer your question and speaking only for myself:


"Do you beleive we are on our own as far as finding a mate...."

--No, I do not believe we are "on our own". I believe the Lord participates with us by developing us to be ready for a long term relationship (if we allow him) and giving us the the tools we need to make a sound decision regarding who we marry and when, PROVIDED, we remain in HIM. I believe the Lord recognizes that our culture is different than 1st century culture in the sense that we can choose who we marry rather than it being arranged.

"and that there is more than one person out there that could be right for a person?"

--In my view, absolutely. Just the shear numbers of people out there make a virtual certainty and there could be more than one person that is a good match. Which one of these people one would run in to would be determined by a whole host of factors though the course of their life, way to many to mention here.

"Do you think that it doesn't matter to God as long as the person is compatible to us and a CHristian?"

---I'm not speaking for God, but I believe what matters to God is that you made the decsion for the right reasons and your reasoning to come your conclusion included the Lord's counsel. I guess to be more specific, I would say yes, I think God is happy with who we choose if they're in the faith and a sensible choice in terms of compatibility.

Cheers!