Why does the Sabbath Start on the International Date Line?

[guevaraj]

The sabbath starts at sundown local time. The OP is just a chain puller.

Brother, happy Sabbath! I have the biblical evidence to back up what I say, but those who oppose me only have their tradition to back up what they say. United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Brother, according to Hebrews 3 and 4, the "rest" of God's Sabbath is not the seventh day of the week near the Promised Land. Although the Jews kept the seventh day Sabbath with the manna for 40 years, it was not God's Sabbath "rest" near the Promised Land. United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Then we have what the bible says..

Hebrews 4:3-4 [3], For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, AS I HAVE SWORN IN MY WRATH, IF THEY SHALL ENTER INTO MY REST: ALTHOUGH THE WORKS WERE FINISHED FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD. [4], FOR HE SPAKE IN A CERTAIN PLACE OF THE SEVENTH DAY ON THIS WISE, AND GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY FROM ALL HIS WORKS. [5], And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

Anyhow this has already been discussed before in the same threads you keep on making over and over. I will leave this between you and God George as all aspects of scripture have already been shared with you showing why your teachings are not biblical which you choose not to believe. So that is between you and God.

Time for me to say goodbye George.

Take Care.

 

[guevaraj]

Then we have what the bible says..

Hebrews 4:3-4 [3], For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, AS I HAVE SWORN IN MY WRATH, IF THEY SHALL ENTER INTO MY REST: ALTHOUGH THE WORKS WERE FINISHED FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD. [4], FOR HE SPAKE IN A CERTAIN PLACE OF THE SEVENTH DAY ON THIS WISE, AND GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY FROM ALL HIS WORKS. [5], And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

Anyhow this has already been discussed before in the same threads you keep on making over and over. I will leave this between you and God George as all aspects of scripture have already been shared with you showing why your teachings are not biblical which you choose not to believe. So that is between you and God. Time for me to say goodbye George. Take Care.

Brother, translations do not always convey the original meaning. Here is a translation that best suits the general message. Now, only those who "share the faith of those who obeyed" can enter the "rest" of God on the Sabbath, because the oath made it clear with the manna that the Sabbath in Israel is not a day of the week from morning to morning: evening to evening is not a day of the week and the Sabbath in Israel falls between two days of the week. Those before Jesus "whose corpses lay in the wilderness" could not have entered what was still future. We must enter the "rest" in which they had not entered for 40 years by oath due to their disobedience. The only "rest" available to them as for us is the "rest" on the Sabbath.

And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn’t it the people who sinned, whose corpses lay in the wilderness? And to whom was God speaking when he took an oath that they would never enter his rest? Wasn’t it the people who disobeyed him? So we see that because of their unbelief they were not able to enter his rest. (Hebrews 3:17-19 NLT)​

The "rest" they could have entered into as we "can" is the Sabbath "rest".

For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” (Hebrews 4:3-4 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[chevyontheriver]

Brother, happy Sabbath! I have the biblical evidence to back up what I say, but those who oppose me only have their tradition to back up what they say. United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Are you sure you are not just seeking to yank the chains of people who don't see things exactly like you do?

I don't know about your evidence. It seems so ... partial. And that because it seems uninformed about the actual history of the Church, about the concept of the eighth day, the day of the commemoration of the resurrection of the Lord. So you go do your thing on the day set aside to commemorate Saturn. I won't condemn you for doing your thing. And you?

 

[guevaraj]

Are you sure you are not just seeking to yank the chains of people who don't see things exactly like you do? I don't know about your evidence. It seems so ... partial. And that because it seems uninformed about the actual history of the Church, about the concept of the eighth day, the day of the commemoration of the resurrection of the Lord. So you go do your thing on the day set aside to commemorate Saturn. I won't condemn you for doing your thing. And you?

Brothers, we are growing into the likeness of Jesus, who kept the Sabbath even in His death. Apart from Jesus, who lives to "intercede" for us in the heavenly temple as our High Priest until He returns, there is no example of what we will be.

Therefore he is able to save completely those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them. Such a high priest truly meets our need—one who is holy, blameless, pure, set apart from sinners, exalted above the heavens. Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself. For the law appoints as high priests men in all their weakness; but the oath, which came after the law, appointed the Son, who has been made perfect forever. (Hebrews 7:25-28 NIV)​

Not even Seventh-day Adventists living today are an example of what we will be, because we continue to grow into the likeness of Jesus, some more than others. Everyone is wrong about the Sabbath! The Holy Spirit has not corrected the Sunday tradition because no denomination has the truth about the Sabbath. Not even Seventh-day Adventists, who need to grow more in their understanding of the Sabbath.

See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure. (1 John 3:1-3 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[chevyontheriver]

Not even Seventh-day Adventists living today are an example of what we will be, because we continue to grow into the likeness of Jesus, some more than others. Everyone is wrong about the Sabbath! The Holy Spirit has not corrected the Sunday tradition because no denomination has the truth about the Sabbath. Not even Seventh-day Adventists, who need to grow more in their understanding of the Sabbath.

It's really not that hard.

Friday night sundown starts the sabbath, which goes to Saturday sundown. That doesn't change. But we have something much bigger than the sabbath now. We have the day of resurrection, the culmination of days. Each day is a day of worship, and holy mass is offered every day of the week, and yet from the earliest days of the history of the Church the day of the resurrection has been central.

The thing to examine is the concept of the eighth day, the culmination day. If you don't get that you just argue Sabbath or Sunday endlessly, not getting it. Looks like I have entered into a squabble among the SDAs. You can have that if that's what you want. I'll leave you to it and drop out now. I doubt any of you want to consider the opinions of a Catholic anyhow. Bye.

 

[guevaraj]

It's really not that hard. Friday night sundown starts the sabbath, which goes to Saturday sundown. That doesn't change. But we have something much bigger than the sabbath now. We have the day of resurrection, the culmination of days. Each day is a day of worship, and holy mass is offered every day of the week, and yet from the earliest days of the history of the Church the day of the resurrection has been central. The thing to examine is the concept of the eighth day, the culmination day. If you don't get that you just argue Sabbath or Sunday endlessly, not getting it. Looks like I have entered into a squabble among the SDAs. You can have that if that's what you want. I'll leave you to it and drop out now. I doubt any of you want to consider the opinions of a Catholic anyhow. Bye.

Brother, stay, everyone's input is important. The works of Jesus in Calvary are not the "rest" in which God wants us to enter in Hebrews 3 and 4 because those before Jesus "whose corpses lay in the wilderness" could not have entered what was still future. We must enter the "rest" in which they had not entered for 40 years by oath due to their disobedience. The only "rest" available to them as for us is the "rest" on the Sabbath.

And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn’t it the people who sinned, whose corpses lay in the wilderness? And to whom was God speaking when he took an oath that they would never enter his rest? Wasn’t it the people who disobeyed him? So we see that because of their unbelief they were not able to enter his rest. (Hebrews 3:17-19 NLT)​

The "rest" they could have entered into as we "can" is the Sabbath "rest".

For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” (Hebrews 4:3-4 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[SabbathBlessings]

It's really not that hard.

Friday night sundown starts the sabbath, which goes to Saturday sundown. That doesn't change. But we have something much bigger than the sabbath now. We have the day of resurrection, the culmination of days. Each day is a day of worship, and holy mass is offered every day of the week, and yet from the earliest days of the history of the Church the day of the resurrection has been central.

The thing to examine is the concept of the eighth day, the culmination day. If you don't get that you just argue Sabbath or Sunday endlessly, not getting it. Looks like I have entered into a squabble among the SDAs. You can have that if that's what you want. I'll leave you to it and drop out now. I doubt any of you want to consider the opinions of a Catholic anyhow. Bye.

This isn't really a squabble among SDA's although it does appear that way. The SDA's has 28 fundamental beliefs including the Sabbath is from Friday sundown to Saturday sundown. The 28 fundamental beliefs is what sets the SDA church apart. Not everyone who says they are SDA goes to an SDA church or believes in the 28 fundamental beliefs for some reason. I personally would just call myself Christian if I didn't believe what the SDA church stands for nor went to a SDA church, as it doesn't make sense to me to tag myself to something you disagree with and teach the opposite of what the SDA church stands for.

 

[guevaraj]

This isn't really a squabble among SDA's although it does appear that way. The SDA's has 28 fundamental beliefs including the Sabbath is from Friday sundown to Saturday sundown. The 28 fundamental beliefs is what sets the SDA church apart. Not everyone who says they are SDA goes to an SDA church or believes in the 28 fundamental beliefs for some reason. I personally would just call myself Christian if I didn't believe what the SDA church stands for nor went to a SDA church, as it doesn't make sense to me to tag myself to something you disagree with and teach the opposite of what the SDA church stands for.

Sister, happy Sabbath! Does God decide our "rest" day or can humans decide our "rest" day by changing sides on the International Date Line? You have no biblical answer for Seventh-day Adventists in Western Samoa who keep the Sabbath on Sunday after the government switched sides on the International Date Line to aid trade. What would the Jews have done in that situation? United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Sister, happy Sabbath! Does God decide our "rest" day or can humans decide our "rest" day by changing sides on the International Date Line? You have no biblical answer for Seventh-day Adventists in Western Samoa who keep the Sabbath on Sunday after the government switched sides on the International Date Line to aid trade. What would the Jews have done in that situation? United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Happy Sabbath Jorge. The International Date Line is not mentioned in the bible, I like to stick with scriptures. The Jews have been keeping the Sabbath correctly for centuries taught by Jesus commanded by God, so this "new" way of keeping God's Sabbath is not biblical.

 

[guevaraj]

Happy Sabbath Jorge. The International Date Line is not mentioned in the bible, I like to stick with scriptures. The Jews have been keeping the Sabbath correctly for centuries taught by Jesus commanded by God, so this "new" way of keeping God's Sabbath is not biblical.

Sister, on the "rest" of the Sabbath, they had "milk" in the Promised Land. They could follow a simple direct instruction from God, but we, scattered throughout the world, have "solid food" to enter that "rest" of the Sabbath in other places besides Israel's time zone. We need to really understand God's Sabbath "rest" to rest from our works "just as God did from His" on the Seventh day of creation.

Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings? (1 Corinthians 3:1-4 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Sister, on the "rest" of the Sabbath, they had "milk" in the Promised Land. They could follow a simple direct instruction from God, but we, scattered throughout the world, have "solid food" to enter that "rest" of the Sabbath in other places besides Israel's time zone. We need to really understand God's Sabbath "rest" to rest from our works "just as God did from His" on the Seventh day of creation.

Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings? (1 Corinthians 3:1-4 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

It doesn't say the Sabbath is from the time zone of Israel either in the bible. This is just nonsense and leading people away to breaking one of God's commandments. The bible also says we should not judge, so only God knows if I am worldly not a stranger on the internet. Maybe something to pray about.

 

[BABerean2]

Sister, on the "rest" of the Sabbath, they had "milk" in the Promised Land. They could follow a simple direct instruction from God, but we, scattered throughout the world, have "solid food" to enter that "rest" of the Sabbath in other places besides Israel's time zone. We need to really understand God's Sabbath "rest" to rest from our works "just as God did from His" on the Seventh day of creation.

Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings? (1 Corinthians 3:1-4 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Are you claiming Jews who lived in other parts of the world, such as Babylon, adjusted their clocks in order to keep the Jerusalem Sabbath? Where is the scripture to back up your claim?



Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Act 2:2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Act 2:3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Act 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Act 2:5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.
Act 2:6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
Act 2:7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
Act 2:8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
Act 2:9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia,
Act 2:10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes,
Act 2:11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.
Act 2:12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?
Act 2:13 Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine.


.

 

[guevaraj]

It doesn't say the Sabbath is from the time zone of Israel either in the bible. This is just nonsense and leading people away to breaking one of God's commandments. The bible also says we should not judge, so only God knows if I am worldly not a stranger on the internet. Something to pray about.

Sister, the oath in Hebrews 3 and 4 made it clear with the manna that the seventh day of the week is not God's Sabbath "rest" near the Promised Land. In Israel, the Sabbath is not a day of the week from morning to morning, as established were the days of the week in Genesis. Evening to evening is not a day of the week and the Sabbath in Israel falls between two days of the week. Those before Jesus "whose corpses lay in the wilderness" could not have entered what was still future. We must enter the "rest" in which they had not entered for 40 years by oath due to their disobedience. The only "rest" available to them as for us is the "rest" on the Sabbath.

And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn’t it the people who sinned, whose corpses lay in the wilderness? And to whom was God speaking when he took an oath that they would never enter his rest? Wasn’t it the people who disobeyed him? So we see that because of their unbelief they were not able to enter his rest. (Hebrews 3:17-19 NLT)​

The "rest" they could have entered into as we "can" is the Sabbath "rest".

For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” (Hebrews 4:3-4 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[guevaraj]

Are you claiming Jews who lived in other parts of the world, such as Babylon, adjusted their clocks in order to keep the Jerusalem Sabbath? Where is the scripture to back up your claim?

Brother, happy Sabbath! They should have, but they didn't because they haven't understood that God defined the days of creation in Genesis from morning to morning. They think that a Sabbath in Israel from evening to evening is a day of the week when it is not a day of the week according to Genesis.

And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was MORNING—the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Sister, the oath in Hebrews 3 and 4 made it clear with the manna that the seventh day of the week is not God's Sabbath "rest" near the Promised Land. In Israel, the Sabbath is not a day of the week from morning to morning, as established were the days of the week in Genesis. Evening to evening is not a day of the week and the Sabbath in Israel falls between two days of the week. Those before Jesus "whose corpses lay in the wilderness" could not have entered what was still future. We must enter the "rest" in which they had not entered for 40 years by oath due to their disobedience. The only "rest" available to them as for us is the "rest" on the Sabbath.

And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn’t it the people who sinned, whose corpses lay in the wilderness? And to whom was God speaking when he took an oath that they would never enter his rest? Wasn’t it the people who disobeyed him? So we see that because of their unbelief they were not able to enter his rest. (Hebrews 3:17-19 NLT)​

The "rest" they could have entered into as we "can" is the Sabbath "rest".

For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” (Hebrews 4:3-4 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

This is not what God said. God commanded us to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy, not two days in scripture. Exodus 20:8-11, Genesis 2:1-3 We do not have a God of confusion, so International Date Lines, Sabbath on the time zone of Eden or Israel only is confusing and non-biblical. I truly hope you can take this in prayer so you stop teaching people to break God's Sabbath commandment by adding confusion and misinterpretations to the holy scriptures and the holy day of the Lord thy God. God bless

 

[guevaraj]

This is not what God said. God commanded us to keep the seventh day Sabbath, not two days in scripture. Exodus 20:8-11, Genesis 2:1-3 We do not have a God of confusion, so International Date Lines, Sabbath on the time zone of Eden or Israel only is confusing and non-biblical. I will not be further responding and I truly hope you can take this in prayer so you stop teaching people to break God's Sabbath commandment by adding confusion and misinterpretations to the holy scriptures and the holy day of the Lord thy God. God bless

Sister, it's very simple! It means that when God made the seventh day of creation holy, he set it apart from the week and permanently established the Sabbath in that time zone. The Sabbath is a reminder of creation in the sense that it gives us the place of our origin, revealing that God established the International Date Line when He taught us to count the days with the week. United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Sister, it's very simple! It means that when God made the seventh day of creation holy, he set it apart from the week and permanently established the Sabbath in that time zone. The Sabbath is a reminder of creation in the sense that it gives us the place of our origin, revealing that God established the International Date Line when He taught us to count the days with the week. United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Yet no scripture saying the Sabbath is on a certain time zone or mention of the International Time zone. It's important to follow scriptures and the Word of God and not made-made teaching.

 

[guevaraj]

Yet no scripture saying the Sabbath is on a certain time zone or mention of the International Time zone. It's important to follow scriptures and the Word of God and not made-made teaching.

Sister, man-made teachings are what happens when God has something complicated to tell us and we don't understand it. The church will understand in due time according to the prophecy of the Angel below. I know God helped our church understand the longest time to make this correction by holding an incorrect hour for more than 8 years before doing the Bible study to learn more. God prepared our church to understand His Sabbath. Note that the angel speaks positively that we will "understand, but not yet, not yet". It is difficult to correct a tradition, especially one that has been around for so long! We understood "what even is" but we have not understood "when it is": even falls in the middle of the first day and not as supposed was at the beginning because the Sabbath in Israel is not as supposed a day of the week.

I saw that it is even so: “From even unto even, shall ye celebrate your Sabbath.” Said the angel: “Take the word of God, read it, understand, and ye cannot err. Read carefully, and ye shall there find what even is, and when it is.” I asked the angel if the frown of God had been upon His people for commencing the Sabbath as they had. I was directed back to the first rise of the Sabbath, and followed the people of God up to this time, but did not see that the Lord was displeased, or frowned upon them. I inquired why it had been thus, that at this late day we must change the time of commencing the Sabbath. Said the angel: “Ye shall understand, but not yet, not yet.” Said the angel: “If light come, and that light is set aside or rejected, then comes condemnation and the frown of God; but before the light comes, there is no sin, for there is no light for them to reject.” I saw that it was in the minds of some that the Lord had shown that the Sabbath commenced at six o'clock, when I had only seen that it commenced at “even,” and it was inferred that even was at six. I saw that the servants of God must draw together, press together. (Testimonies for the Church, vol. 1, Page 116)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Bob S]

This is not what God said. God commanded us to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy,

Absolutely a misnomer. God has not required US to keep the seventh-day holy, He required the Israelites to keep the seventh-day holy.

not two days in scripture. Exodus 20:8-11, Genesis 2:1-3 We do not have a God of confusion, so International Date Lines, Sabbath on the time zone of Eden or Israel only is confusing and non-biblical. I truly hope you can take this in prayer so you stop teaching people to break God's Sabbath commandment by adding confusion and misinterpretations to the holy scriptures and the holy day of the Lord thy God.

You dn't have any confusion because you refuse to take into account that indeed the start of your Sabbath was moved from Sinai to the International Date Line. New Zealand now starts the Sabbath that before the IDL was recognized the Sabbath started in Israel. You are trying to keep the wrong day. The Samoa SDAs have split over the moving of the date line from one side of the island to the other. Don't say there is no confusion. I sure wouldn't depend on the Jews to have kept the day sacred. History tells us they have not.