Why do you believe you are Christian?

[Krystina661]

Give me a break! You correct someone's spelling of Mormon when you can't even correctly spell the name of your church? Your church is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

By the way, why have we met so many LDS who call themselves Mormons? Even Apostle Bruce R. McConkie called his book Mormon Doctrine.

Mormon is kind of a nick name for LDS Members.

 

[Krystina661]

Latter-Day Saints believe in the Same Christ of Christianity. They believe the Bible to be the WORD OF GOD, and that JESUS WAS OUR SAVIOR! The SAME Christ in the HOLY BIBLE.

 

[Starcrystal]

I'm not a Mormon, but I will tell you, I've read the book of Mormon and for the most part what I read wasn't too far out. I believe theres a bit of strictness in the LDS church (I read one of the Doctrines booklets) ~ But the bottom line is that the Scripture tells us "Whosoever calleth upon the Lord shall be saved."

and,

"If you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe that God raised him from the dead, you shall be saved."

Pretty simple. I believe there are people of all denominations, INCLUDING Mormon and Jehovahs Witnesses that sincerely and SIMPLISTICLY believe this, therefore are we to deny Gods word and say someones going to hell because of doctrinal differences???

Its when we get caught up and bogged down with the technicalities, and begin to DENY Christ, THEN thats when we're in trouble.

Keep it simple. Serve the Lord with your whole heart, and HE shall guide your paths.

 

[Rescued One]

I'm not a Mormon, but I will tell you, I've read the book of Mormon and for the most part what I read wasn't too far out. I believe theres a bit of strictness in the LDS church (I read one of the Doctrines booklets) ~ But the bottom line is that the Scripture tells us "Whosoever calleth upon the Lord shall be saved."

and,

"If you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe that God raised him from the dead, you shall be saved."

Which Jesus? The Mormon Jesus was a racist until he repented in 1978.

In 1855 Brigham Young said: "You must not think, from what I say, that I am opposed to slavery. No! The negro is ******, and is to serve his master till God chooses to remove the curse of Ham . . ." (New York Herald, May 4, 1855, as cited in Dialogue, Spring 1973, p.56).

On June 9, 1978 the Mormon church's Deseret News carried a startling announcement by the First Presidency which said that a new revelation had been given and that blacks would be allowed to hold the priesthood.

 

[AMMON]

Which Jesus? The Mormon Jesus was a racist until he repented in 1978.

In 1855 Brigham Young said: "You must not think, from what I say, that I am opposed to slavery. No! The negro is ******, and is to serve his master till God chooses to remove the curse of Ham . . ." (New York Herald, May 4, 1855, as cited in Dialogue, Spring 1973, p.56).

On June 9, 1978 the Mormon church's Deseret News carried a startling announcement by the First Presidency which said that a new revelation had been given and that blacks would be allowed to hold the priesthood.

This is truly a disgusting post... borderline religious discrimination (i.e., bigotry).

 

[Krystina661]

I agree, that was an awful thing to say..


The Book of Mormon, Joseph Smith, and LDS doctrine in general have always taught that people of all races are part of the same heavenly family, sons and daughters of God, and that salvation is available to all regardless of race.

 

[True Believer]

Jehovah our Elohim is one Jehovah. Jesus is God and was with God. Jesus was the Creator and was not created. Jesus was worshiped and never forbad anyone to worship Him. Who worshiped Jesus?

This statement just can't be! "Jesus is God and was with God." these would make two GODS to be worshipped It only makes sense in the context of Jesus being in subjection to Jehovah but also higher than we are!
Jesus was the Creator and was not created. Jesus was first created and then became a creator also. Check out who was doing the original creations before the creation of mankind in the book of Job.
Jesus was worshipped possibly but he NEVER said to worship him he knew it was to Jehovah alone you must render sacred service. Many worship cows but the act of doing so doesn't make it right.
Agape', TB

 

[Starcrystal]

If I recall, the LDS Church teaches Native Americans are part of one of the lost tribes of Israel (lamanites?) Wheres the racism there?
Which Jesus? I am fully aware of the "other Jesus" and "Another Spirit" Apostle Paul warns about in galatians 1 and 2 Corinthians 11.
I DO NOT beleive Jesus was the spirit brother of Lucifer.

But while I disagree with some LDS doctrine, I also must disagree with MANY, MANY mainstream denominational doctrines. (pre-trib rapture, speaking in tongues being the evidence of baptism in Holy spirit, the Kingdom movement, Theistic Evolution, etc, etc etc.)

why does every sect have to batter the others?

Simple belief in Jesus Christ as your personal saviour according to John 3:16, the Roman verses I mentioned, by FAITH, without works - yet letting the Holy Spirit (Who is God along with Jesus & The Father ~ One God~ Deut. 6:4, John 1:1) sanctify you unto living a holy life.

Lets get with it! If we all stopped arguing over petty issues and stood together in fellowship, maybe God would send us revival in a sin plagued nation!

 

[Rescued One]

If I recall, the LDS Church teaches Native Americans are part of one of the lost tribes of Israel (lamanites?) Wheres the racism there?
Which Jesus? I am fully aware of the "other Jesus" and "Another Spirit" Apostle Paul warns about in galatians 1 and 2 Corinthians 11.
I DO NOT beleive Jesus was the spirit brother of Lucifer.

But while I disagree with some LDS doctrine, I also must disagree with MANY, MANY mainstream denominational doctrines. (pre-trib rapture, speaking in tongues being the evidence of baptism in Holy spirit, the Kingdom movement, Theistic Evolution, etc, etc etc.)

why does every sect have to batter the others?

Simple belief in Jesus Christ as your personal saviour according to John 3:16, the Roman verses I mentioned, by FAITH, without works - yet letting the Holy Spirit (Who is God along with Jesus & The Father ~ One God~ Deut. 6:4, John 1:1) sanctify you unto living a holy life.

Lets get with it! If we all stopped arguing over petty issues and stood together in fellowship, maybe God would send us revival in a sin plagued nation!

God's word and God's doctrine are NOT petty! We are not battering Mormons. We are responding to their battering of Christianity and their false teachings.

 

[Lotar]

Latter-Day Saints believe in the Same Christ of Christianity. They believe the Bible to be the WORD OF GOD, and that JESUS WAS OUR SAVIOR! The SAME Christ in the HOLY BIBLE.

But if you do not believe Christ is 100% God and 100% man, and if you believe Christ is a created being, then the Christ you believe in is different than the Christ of Christianity.

If you believe God is something different the Trinity, then you believe in a different God than Christianity.

LDS believe in Jesus and God, but it seems that who you believe they are is different. You use the same names, but use different definitions. Muslims believe in Jesus and God, would you call them Christians too?


Not trying to flame or anything, just seeking your reasoning.

 

[Starcrystal]

I wouldn't even begin to compare Muslims and Mormons!
Islam does NOT believe Christ is the saviour.

Now heres where it gets sticky: I believe God is ONE, that He is manifest in the offices of father, Son (Jesus Christ) and Holy Spirit. They are 3 distinct manifestations, distinct personALITIES, and carry out 3 distinct offices or responsibilities. They can appear in separate manifestations, such as at Jesus baptism or the transfiguration. Yet I hesitate to call them three separate PERSONS, as this might denote 3 GODS as one God.
So I believe in the "trinity" in a slightly (and VERY SLIGHTLY) different way than many churches. Of course Oneness Pentacostals and a few others have a more extreme concept than this which I wont get into at this time.
Actually what i beleive has been benificial in witnessing Christ to Jehovahs witnesses who have a major problem with the concept of the trinity.

Let us consider this, which was a prophetic word my pastor received today, and i have added further to it under the anointing of the Holy Spirit:

"I AM SOUGHT OF THEM THAT ASKED NOT FOR ME; I AM FOUND OF THEM THAT SOUGHT ME NOT; I SAID, BEHOLD ME, UNTO A NATION THAT WAS NOT CALLED BY MY NAME.
I HAVE SPREAD OUT MY HANDS ALL THE DAY UNTO A REBELLIOUS PEOPLE, WHICH WALKETH IN A WAY THAT WAS NOT GOOD, AFTER THEIR OWN THOUGHTS..."

~ Isaiah 65:1 - 2

Ancient Israel rebelled against God, so God turned to another people (the Gentiles) who were not even seeking Him. Today the professing Christian Church is rebelling against God, walking in a way that is not good, after their own thoughts, and not after the thoughts of God.
It has been said That Gods glory is departing from the physical church and God will reach out and call others who are not of his Church. Those who've been despized by the church, those shunned, those persecuted - these He shall call, for He is able to choose whom He will, and set apart vessels that will honor him with their lives."

Krystina661:
" Latter-Day Saints believe in the Same Christ of Christianity. They believe the Bible to be the WORD OF GOD, and that JESUS WAS OUR SAVIOR! "

Romans 10:9 ~ "If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, THOU SHALT BE SAVED."

So, what is the problem here???????????

By the way, I am a born again Christian, saved 19 years, not affiliated with any denominational church, called to prophetic ministry in 1987, have seen numerous prophecies come to pass, have seen numerous "supernatural" miracles done by Gods hand in my life, my wifes life, and in those around me. I've seen confirmed signs, confirmed inspirations, and timely messages, such as the one I borrowed and posted here tonight. I've been to Bible college, but the main inspiration & power comes from reading the Word, lots of prayer, and time alone in the wilderness, literally. Just to let you know this is nothing new to me. But yet I give GOD OUR SAVIOUR, LORD JESUS CHRIST, all the honor, for without HIM, none of this would be possible.

 

[Rescued One]

Now heres where it gets sticky: I believe God is ONE, that He is manifest in the offices of father, Son (Jesus Christ) and Holy Spirit. They are 3 distinct manifestations, distinct personALITIES, and carry out 3 distinct offices or responsibilities. They can appear in separate manifestations, such as at Jesus baptism or the transfiguration. Yet I hesitate to call them three separate PERSONS, as this might denote 3 GODS as one God.
So I believe in the "trinity" in a slightly (and VERY SLIGHTLY) different way than many churches. Of course Oneness Pentacostals and a few others have a more extreme concept than this which I wont get into at this time.
Actually what i beleive has been benificial in witnessing Christ to Jehovahs witnesses who have a major problem with the concept of the trinity.

The beliefs you describe are modalism.

 

[Starcrystal]

The beliefs you describe are modalism.


Ah, what, who? Now theres one I'm not familaiar with, and trying to think if I ever even heard it applied to a Christian doctrine.

Explain please.....

 

[happyinhisgrace]

If I recall, the LDS Church teaches Native Americans are part of one of the lost tribes of Israel (lamanites?) Wheres the racism there?
Which Jesus? I am fully aware of the "other Jesus" and "Another Spirit" Apostle Paul warns about in galatians 1 and 2 Corinthians 11.
I DO NOT beleive Jesus was the spirit brother of Lucifer.

But while I disagree with some LDS doctrine, I also must disagree with MANY, MANY mainstream denominational doctrines. (pre-trib rapture, speaking in tongues being the evidence of baptism in Holy spirit, the Kingdom movement, Theistic Evolution, etc, etc etc.)

why does every sect have to batter the others?

Simple belief in Jesus Christ as your personal saviour according to John 3:16, the Roman verses I mentioned, by FAITH, without works - yet letting the Holy Spirit (Who is God along with Jesus & The Father ~ One God~ Deut. 6:4, John 1:1) sanctify you unto living a holy life.

Lets get with it! If we all stopped arguing over petty issues and stood together in fellowship, maybe God would send us revival in a sin plagued nation!

The Nature of God is hardly a petty issue.

Grace

 

[happyinhisgrace]

Now heres where it gets sticky: I believe God is ONE, that He is manifest in the offices of father, Son (Jesus Christ) and Holy Spirit. They are 3 distinct manifestations, distinct personALITIES, and carry out 3 distinct offices or responsibilities. They can appear in separate manifestations, such as at Jesus baptism or the transfiguration. Yet I hesitate to call them three separate PERSONS, as this might denote 3 GODS as one God.
So I believe in the "trinity" in a slightly (and VERY SLIGHTLY) different way than many churches. Of course Oneness Pentacostals and a few others have a more extreme concept than this which I wont get into at this time.
Actually what i beleive has been benificial in witnessing Christ to Jehovahs witnesses who have a major problem with the concept of the trinity.


What you have described as your beliefs in the "trinity" is not the trinity at all. Grace

 

[Starcrystal]

What you have described as your beliefs in the "trinity" is not the trinity at all. Grace

Trinity is not found in the Bible. Of course neither is the word rapture, but I believe the Lord will come to gather us out before God pours out his wrath on earth. (1 Thess 4:16 - 18, etc.)

Secondly, how can people say "persons" when in fact the only "person" of the 3 was Jesus Christ????
Holy Spirit only is seen as a dove descending, and a later manifestation accompanied by tongues of fire in Acts 2.
The Father, Yahweh? What Moses saw pass before him that showed only his back parts does NOT appear to be a "person."

God is NOT a man, or a person. God BECAME flesh and dwelt among us. Then He was manifest in the form of a person. Prior to the incarnation He was the Word, and the description of that (being the creative part of God) is beyond our comprehension.

So I don't refute there being 3 in One. But show me the "3 persons" in Scripture??

As far as petty issues, NO, the nature of God is NOT a petty issue, but I've been in numerous churches and seen brothers and sisters split hairs over baptisms, and raptures, and whether or not a woman can wear pants or cut her hair. One baptist church years ago actually had a tract that warned women wearing pants that they wore the mark of the beast!! Others taught if you didn't speak in tongues you were not saved. On and on and on.

As I've said, LDS teachings in certain areas I DO NOT AGREE. But I like finding common ground. Paul preached at THE ALTAR TO THE UNKNOWN GOD, in Acts, and used the commonality of the situation to tell the pagans about Jesus.

For years I blindly accepted some of the doctrines I mentioned simply because I had lack of knowledge. Between study of Scripture & much prayer, I often had to change my views.

All I know is in February 1985 when I was on the verge of suicide from too much partying, immorality, and occult involvement, I cried out to God, and Jesus answered. I awoke a new creature and put away my idols (witchcraft books, pentagram jewelry, cigarettes, etc...) That change was real, and that God is real, and that God is Jesus Christ.

"Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." ~
I do believe the Greek means "whosoever".....

 

[Starcrystal]

By Rnmomof7 on "If What Joseph Smith said is not true". (Sorry for borrowing this and dragging it over here, but it answered my earlier question I asked here.)

"I just wanted to comment that the idea that God is one person with 3 "expressions" is a heresy called Modalism

****** Modalism is probably the most common theological error concerning the nature of God.* It is a denial of the Trinity which states that God is a single person who, throughout biblical history, has revealed Himself in three consecutive modes, or forms.* Thus, God is a single person who first manifested himself in the mode of the Father in Old Testament times.* At the incarnation, the mode was the Son.* After Jesus' ascension, the mode is the Holy Spirit.**These modes are consecutive and never simultaneous.* In other words, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit never all exist at the same time, only one after another.* Modalism denies the distinctiveness of the three persons in the Trinity even though it retains the divinity of Christ.
**** Present day groups that hold to this error are the United Pentecostal and United Apostolic Churches.* They deny the Trinity, teach that the name of God is Jesus, and require baptism for salvation.* These modalist churches often accuse Trinitarians of teaching three gods.* This is not what the Trinity is.* The correct teaching of the Trinity is one God in three eternal coexistent persons:* The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit."

Rebuttal: "These modes are consecutive and never simultaneous." I DO NOT BELIEVE IN MODALISM THEN!!!!!!!!!!
I believe all 3 can manifest simultaneously as at Jesus Baptism.

I believe they are distinctly different, which apparently Modalism denies as well.

The name of God is Yahweh, or "The Father."

Now, who said I was a modalist? If this quote is an accurate representation of modalism, then just by reading my prior post you will see that I am not.

Its late, goodnight

 

[Lotar]

I was hoping to get Mormon points of view. Starcrystal, if you have a problem with the orthodox view of the Trinity please start another thread.

 

[Krystina661]

But if you do not believe Christ is 100% God and 100% man, and if you believe Christ is a created being, then the Christ you believe in is different than the Christ of Christianity.

If you believe God is something different the Trinity, then you believe in a different God than Christianity.

LDS believe in Jesus and God, but it seems that who you believe they are is different. You use the same names, but use different definitions. Muslims believe in Jesus and God, would you call them Christians too?


Not trying to flame or anything, just seeking your reasoning.

I do believe Christ is 100% God. LDS believe that Jesus is our Lord, Savior, and of course God. Why is it so hard to understand? God is Heavenly Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost, the Godhead. I may not agree with the theology of some other Christians.. but I don't go around saying they are not Christians just because they don't believe everything exactly like me. If someone believes in Jesus Christ, that he is our Lord and Savior, and follows his word.. that to me is enough to call someone a Christian, regardless of the theological differences.

 

[unbound]

The problem is the additional teachings made by the same person who is proclaiming Christ. Lo, he is here, lo his over there. Certain religions try to take away what Christ truly says we will inherit. They tangle a web to ensnare the un-knowing. They use the name of Jesus Christ to propogate a doctrine of flesh, causing the initiate to put on dirty clothing and proclaiming in truth that it is white. I read where some who are looking for answer, eventually join the LDS church, then leave it, settling for more error yet in some other doctrine not of God. The LDS church is GUILTY of denying the REAL Christ to children who seek God.