Why do you believe you are Christian?

[Lotar]

Another question here for Mormans.

Do you hold the Creeds to be true? If not, why then do you make this claim?

Honest question.

Nicene Creed​

We believe in one God,
the Father, the Almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all that is, seen and unseen.

We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
eternally begotten of the Father,
God from God, light from light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made,
of one Being with the Father;
through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven,
was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary
and became truly human.
For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered death and was buried.
On the third day he rose again
in accordance with the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and his kingdom will have no end.

We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father [and the Son],
who with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look for the resurrection of the dead,
and the life of the world to come. Amen.

 

[JoelB]

I am former LDS. I have examined the matter and I believe the Creeds to be true. I amin the process of forumlating my exit letter for the LDS. Any thoughts would be very welcome

 

[Lotar]

​

The Apostle's Creed
​

I believe in God, the Father Almighty,
the Creator of heaven and earth,
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:

Who was conceived of the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried.

He descended into hell.
​

The third day He arose again from the dead.

He ascended into heaven
and sits at the right hand of God the Father Almighty,
whence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy *catholic church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and life everlasting.

Amen.

​

​

​

​

​

The Athanasian Creed

Written against the Arians.

Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the catholic faith. Which faith except every one do keep whole and undefiled, without doubt he shall perish everlastingly.

And the catholic faith is this, that we worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity; Neither confounding the Persons, nor dividing the Substance. For there is one Person of the Father, another of the Son, and another of the Holy Ghost. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost is all one: the glory equal, the majesty coeternal. Such as the Father is, such is the Son, and such is the Holy Ghost. The Father uncreate, the Son uncreate, and the Holy Ghost uncreate. The Father incomprehensible, the Son incomprehensible, and the Holy Ghost incomprehensible. The Father eternal, the Son eternal, and the Holy Ghost eternal. And yet they are not three Eternals, but one Eternal. As there are not three Uncreated nor three Incomprehensibles, but one Uncreated and one Incomprehensible. So likewise the Father is almighty, the Son almighty, and the Holy Ghost almighty. And yet they are not three Almighties, but one Almighty. So the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Ghost is God. And yet they are not three Gods, but one God. So likewise the Father is Lord, the Son Lord, and the Holy Ghost Lord. And yet not three Lords, but one Lord. For like as we are compelled by the Christian verity to acknowledge every Person by Himself to be God and Lord, So are we forbidden by the catholic religion to say, There be three Gods, or three Lords.

The Father is made of none: neither created nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made, nor created, but begotten. The Holy Ghost is of the Father and of the Son: neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding. So there is one Father, not three Fathers; one Son, not three Sons; one Holy Ghost, not three Holy Ghosts. And in this Trinity none is before or after other; none is greater or less than another; But the whole three Persons are coeternal together, and coequal: so that in all things, as is aforesaid, the Unity in Trinity and the Trinity in Unity is to be worshiped. He, therefore, that will be saved must thus think of the Trinity.

Furthermore, it is necessary to everlasting salvation that he also believe faithfully the incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. For the right faith is, that we believe and confess that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man; God of the Substance of the Father, begotten before the worlds; and Man of the substance of His mother, born in the world; Perfect God and perfect Man, of a reasonable soul and human flesh subsisting. Equal to the Father as touching His Godhead, and inferior to the Father as touching His manhood; Who, although He be God and Man, yet He is not two, but one Christ: One, not by conversion of the Godhead into flesh, but by taking the manhood into God; One altogether; not by confusion of Substance, but by unity of Person. For as the reasonable soul and flesh is one man, so God and Man is one Christ; Who suffered for our salvation; descended into hell, rose again the third day from the dead; He ascended into heaven; He sitteth on the right hand of the Father, God Almighty; from whence He shall come to judge the quick and the dead. At whose coming all men shall rise again with their bodies, and shall give an account of their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life everlasting; and they that have done evil, into everlasting fire.

This is the catholic faith; which except a man believe faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved.
​

 

[JoelB]

I believe all this. What must I do?

 

[Serapha]

Hey Lotar!





Members of the CoJCoLDS's believe in the Apostle's Creed.


~seraph`

 

[Lotar]

I'm sorry, but what is the CoJCoLD?

Do they follow the other Creeds?

 

[happyinhisgrace]

Hey Lotar!





Members of the CoJCoLDS's believe in the Apostle's Creed.


~seraph`

Actually, no...they don't. They don't believe in the holy catholic church. They also don't believe that Jesus decended to HEll but rather that he went to Paradise before he rose again.

Grace

 

[happyinhisgrace]

Actually, no...they don't. They don't believe in the holy catholic church. They also don't believe that Jesus decended to HEll but rather that he went to Paradise before he rose again.

Grace

Paradise=Spirit Prison

 

[fatboys]

Paradise=Spirit Prison

Paradise=spiritworld where repentant, good and also honorable people go to await the resurrection. This is where Christ refered to the theif who hung beside him on the cross, and told him that today he would be in paradise with him. After death there is a partial judgement. Peter taught that Christ taught as a spirit those who were not in paradise, so they could accept or reject the gospel. Why? So they could be fairly judged according to men in the flesh. We know that Christ did not go to the kingdom of God after his death, since he told Mary that she was not to touch him for he had not yet ascended to heaven. Then after he returned, they felt the prints of the nails in his hands and feet. So Paradise= spirit world for repentant, good and honorable people. Spirit prison=a place where those who were disobedient, yet have not had the chance to hear the complete gospel.

 

[Rescued One]

Hey Lotar!





Members of the CoJCoLDS's believe in the Apostle's Creed.


~seraph`

What :o in the world are you talking about? When did they decide that Joseph Smith was a liar?

19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: "they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof."
Joseph Smith, Jr.

All their creeds were an abomination, not just some of their creeds!

 

[12volt_man]

Members of the CoJCoLDS's believe in the Apostle's Creed.


~seraph`

Really? Let's see about that...

I believe in God, the Father Almighty, the Creator of heaven and earth,
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:
Who was conceived of the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried. He descended into hell.

The third day He arose again from the dead.
He ascended into heaven and sits at the right hand of God the Father Almighty,
whence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic church,
the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body, and life everlasting.

In addition to what Grace has already pointed out, Mormonism doesn't teach that Jesus was "conceived of the Holy Spirit". Mormonism teaches that Jesus was concieved as the result of a physical, sexual relationship between God the Father and Mary.

 

[Serapha]

Hi there!

Mormons are expressedly not allowed to post in our Christian-only forums as we believe the Mormon faith and the LDS church are in error and follow heretical doctrines. However, a few of our Mormon members pointed out that their church beliefs do conform to the Apostle's Creed. Specifically, the Apostle's Creed does not address the Trinitarian nature of God and the Divinity of Christ. This could be a loophole for other cult or sect members to post in Christian-only forums.

http://www.christianforums.com/t75378

 

[Rescued One]

Hi there!







http://www.christianforums.com/t75378

Any Mormon who says he believes in the Apostles' Creed is either lying or thinks Joseph Smith lied.

 

[True Believer]

Quote:

Mormons are expressedly not allowed to post in our Christian-only forums as we believe the Mormon faith and the LDS church are in error and follow heretical doctrines. However, a few of our Mormon members pointed out that their church beliefs do conform to the Apostle's Creed. Specifically, the Apostle's Creed does not address the Trinitarian nature of God and the Divinity of Christ. This could be a loophole for other cult or sect members to post in Christian-only forums.

So why not call them the Trinitatian Forums instead of the Christian forums since there are Christians who are not trinitarian. Christian is someone who follows Christ Jesus not some man made creed or tradition Jesus was against man made traditions not for them.

 

[Rescued One]

Quote:

Mormons are expressedly not allowed to post in our Christian-only forums as we believe the Mormon faith and the LDS church are in error and follow heretical doctrines. However, a few of our Mormon members pointed out that their church beliefs do conform to the Apostle's Creed. Specifically, the Apostle's Creed does not address the Trinitarian nature of God and the Divinity of Christ. This could be a loophole for other cult or sect members to post in Christian-only forums.

So why not call them the Trinitatian Forums instead of the Christian forums since there are Christians who are not trinitarian. Christian is someone who follows Christ Jesus not some man made creed or tradition Jesus was against man made traditions not for them.

It isn't necessary to change the name of the forums. There cannot be two groups worshipping different gods and yet both being Christian. Ye cannot serve two masters.

 

[True Believer]

But the differences are man made not God made. Man made the doctrine of the Trinity.Nowhere does Jesus say believe in the Trinity. Nowhere does Jesus say worship me! Claiming the right to be Christian and exclude others based on a man made tradition is going directly against what Jesus taught. He said to obey his voice not the Catholic Church or the Baptist Church or the Methodist Church or the Watchtower Church or the Latter Day Saint Church. He said obey his voice and every single one of the Churches mentioned and lots of others believe they are doing so. The creeds are man made just like the many rules set down upon the jews by the Pharisees. Jesus teaching was simple, He said you must love God (Jehovah because this is a quote from the OT) with your whole heart,with your whole soul and with your whole mind. The second is you must love your neighbor as yourself on these two commandments the whole law hangs and on the prophets. Matthew 22: 37-40 ( parts paraphrased)
Agape',TB

 

[Rescued One]

But the differences are man made not God made. Man made the doctrine of the Trinity.Nowhere does Jesus say believe in the Trinity. Nowhere does Jesus say worship me! Claiming the right to be Christian and exclude others based on a man made tradition is going directly against what Jesus taught. He said to obey his voice not the Catholic Church or the Baptist Church or the Methodist Church or the Watchtower Church or the Latter Day Saint Church. He said obey his voice and every single one of the Churches mentioned and lots of others believe they are doing so. The creeds are man made just like the many rules set down upon the jews by the Pharisees. Jesus teaching was simple, He said you must love God (Jehovah because this is a quote from the OT) with your whole heart,with your whole soul and with your whole mind. The second is you must love your neighbor as yourself on these two commandments the whole law hangs and on the prophets. Matthew 22: 37-40 ( parts paraphrased)
Agape',TB

The creeds should be examined to see if they line up with scripture. The Nicene creed does line up.

Jehovah our Elohim is one Jehovah. Jesus is God and was with God. Jesus was the Creator and was not created. Jesus was worshiped and never forbad anyone to worship Him. Who worshiped Jesus?

Angels.....Hebrews 1:6
Disciples.....Matt. 14:33, 28:9, 28:17, Luke 24:52
Wise men.....Matt. 2:2, 2:11
Leper.....Matt. 8:2
Ruler.....Matt. 9:18
Woman of Canaan.....Matt. 15:25
Mother of Zebedee's children.....Matt. 20:20
Blind man.....John 9:38

 

[ChoirDir]

The creeds were created to combat Heresies like the LDS (even though it wasn't around then)

 

[AMMON]

Another question here for Mormans.

Do you hold the Creeds to be true? If not, why then do you make this claim?

Honest question.

First, we're not "Mormons," and we are certainly not "Mormans." We are members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Second, as to why I believe I am a Christian, please see my extensive analysis of this issue in my Brass Tacks thread. Thanks.

 

[Rescued One]

First, we're not "Mormons," and we are certainly not "Mormans." We are members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Second, as to why I believe I am a Christian, please see my extensive analysis of this issue in my Brass Tacks thread. Thanks.

Give me a break! You correct someone's spelling of Mormon when you can't even correctly spell the name of your church? Your church is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

By the way, why have we met so many LDS who call themselves Mormons? Even Apostle Bruce R. McConkie called his book Mormon Doctrine.