Why do some people think Hell isn't real?

[he-man]

So then what is the argument against sentencing extreme sociopaths to eternity in the outer darkness? What else can you do with people who hate God at the very core of their being? (I think that is what blasphemy against the Holy Spirit really is.)

No devil, no hell, no immortal soul, no immortal torture, just extinction! The wicked ruler God will wipe out.

Newton contends that Athanasius advanced the notion of a conscious existence of the soul in the intermediate state between death and resurrection.’

Proverbs 28:15 (ESV)
15 Like a roaring lion or a charging bear is a wicked ruler over a poor people.

Psalm 22:13 (ASV)
13 They gape upon me with their mouth, As a ravening and a roaring lion.

Psalm 74:3-4 (ASV)
3 Lift up thy feet unto the perpetual ruins, All the evil that the enemy hath done in the sanctuary.

Psalm 74:4 (ESV)
4 Your foes have roared in the midst of your meeting place; they set up their own signs for signs.

For Newton, therefore, demons were figures for disordered psychotic states. The cases of demon-possession in the Synoptic Gospels do not describe the activity of literal devils, but instead reflect the (mistaken) beliefs of first-century Jews.’

‘Newton goes on to say that to beleive that men or weomen can really divine, charm, inchant, bewitch or converse with spirits is a superstition of the same nature wth beleiving that the idols of the gentiles were not vanities but had spirits really seated in them.’

‘Newton laid the blame for the rise of the pagan doctrines about demons in the Church at the door of his ecclesiastical nemesis Athanasius, whom he also saw as responsible for introducing Trinitarianism and the doctrine of the immortality of the soul. In his “Paradoxical questions concerning Athanasius”, Newton contends that Athanasius advanced the notion of a conscious existence of the soul in the intermediate state between death and resurrection.’

Later than Muggleton, but earlier than Bekker, Newton came to the same conclusion as both of them – that the devil in Scripture was never the supernatural evil being of ‘orthodox’ theology, and that all temptation comes from the lust of the heart:

‘The logical corollary to Newton’s views on evil spirits is that those who claim to be tempted by a personal devil are deluded and provoked by their own fleshly imagination. Newton’s “Paradoxical questions concerning Athanasius,” an important manuscript held at the Clark Library dating from the early 1690s, makes this clear’
The “Devil”, then, is a symbol of lust and an vivid hypostatization of idolatry in aggregate. This language cannot be reconciled with the orthodox position.’
SOURCE: Stephen Snobelen, ‘Lust, Pride, And Ambition: Isaac Newton And The Devil’, pages 7, 8,9,10,11,12 November 2002

Early Bible fundamentalist Unitarians and Dissenters like Lardner, Mead, Farmer, Ashdowne and Simpson, and Epps taught that the miraculous healings of the Bible were real, but that the devil was an allegory, and demons just the medical language of the day.

Much of the popular history of the Devil is not biblical; instead, it is a post-medieval Christian reading of the scriptures influenced by medieval and pre-medieval Christian popular mythology.

Originally, only the epithet of "the satan" ("the adversary") was used to denote the character in the Hebrew deity's court that later became known as "the Devil." (The term "satan" was also used to designate human enemies of the Hebrews that Yahweh raised against them.)

The article was lost and this title became a proper name: Satan. There is no unambiguous reference to the Devil in the Torah, the Prophets, or the Writings.
SOURCE: T. J. Wray, Gregory Mobley The birth of Satan pp.66-68
has been erroneously interpreted by some to mean Satan, "the Devil", but such is not the case. The Hebrew Bible views ha-satan as an angel ministering to the desires of God, acting as Chief Prosecutor.
SOURCE: Carus P. History of the Devil and the Idea of Evil
Thomas Hobbes (1651); Arthur Ashley Sykes (1737); Richard Mead (1755); Ashdowne, ‘‘AN INQUIRY INTO THE Scripture Meaning of the Word SATAN, AND ITS SYNONIMOUS TERMS, The DEVIL, or the ADVERSARY, and the WICKED-ONE’, page 40, 1794
Burke, J. Christianity in the Witch Hunt Era, 2008

In 1737 Sykes published ‘An enquiry into the meaning of demoniacs in the New Testament’ going further than Joseph Mede’s exposition of the ‘Doctrine of Demons’ by rejecting any belief in the existence of demons and regarding those possessed as simply suffering from mental illness, as the later work of Dr. Richard Mead. He also rejected the devil as a supernatural evil being, taking the allegory argument of John Epps.

Not only did Epps reject the orthodox church establishments, but he also rejected a number of the mainstream Christian doctrines. He rejected the doctrine of the immortal soul, emphasising instead resurrection as the escape from death. In this vein, the second coming of Christ is also emphasised. He taught that Hell is the grave, not the place of torment of mainstream Christianity. He also spoke out against the glorification of war-heroes: "the honour of the British flag is a specious phrase which blinds men's eyes to right and wrong", he said.

The most infamous of Epps' unorthodox views regards the devil (1842), though he was one of a long line of Dissenters to take this view stretching back through Simpson (1804), Lardner (1742), Sykes (1737), going back to the Dutch Anabaptist David Joris (1540).

According to Epps, references in the Bible to the devil and Satan are, in the main, to be understood as personifications of the lustful principle in man and at the Dock Head Church to demonstrate that the devil is not a personal being.

David Joris (c. 1501–1556), Against this is his rationalist approach to the topic of the devil and supernatural evil. David Joris anticipated the views of Thomas Hobbes, John Epps and Dr. John Thomas in interpreting the devil as an allegory

Reading Isa 14:4, "That you shall take up this proverb against the **king of Babylon,** and say, How has the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!", it becomes clear that this is the king of Babylon and his nation that is being spoken of here.
While this mythological information is available to scholars today via translated Babylonian cuneiform text taken from clay tablets, it was not as readily available at the time of the Latin translation of the Bible.
Thus, early Christian tradition interpreted the passage as a reference to the moment Satan was thrown from Heaven. Lucifer became another name for Satan and has remained so due to Christian dogma and popular tradition.
Devil in Christianity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[DrBubbaLove]

If there is no immortal soul, how can there be a resurrection?

I mean certainly God can recreate a duplicate of me, give that person all my memories, and I guess we could conclude that because nobody but God would be able to look at the new me and know it is not the original me, it really does not matter. Logically however I think it does matter.


The idea of a Creator remaking a pot that has been destroyed (by death) to the either reconcile it to Heaven or Hell just does not seem right.

What would be the point and how could that be considered Justice?

How could a Creator hold the new pot responsible for a life it really did not lead?

And where is the reward for the original pot that no longer exists when the copy is made for Judgment?


It is not for nothing that the idea of something human remaining of me that does transcend death seems required if we are going to say people are ‘resurrected’. If something no longer exists, then clearly that thing could only be remade or copied, not "resurrected".

If the technology existed and they had raised the Titanic in 1912 to put it back together, that could be called a resurrection, because something remained of the original. Depending on how long afterwards, a good part of the ship remained. If it had sunk in one piece and then raised again in 1912, no one would doubt the Titanic had been resurrected. If someone remade the ship today, even in exact detail, no one would call that a resurrection.

 

[he-man]

If there is no immortal soul, how can there be a resurrection?

Only the King of Kings has immortality!
1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

Hos 13:14 I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death: O death, I will be thy plagues; O grave, I will be thy destruction: repentance shall be hid from mine eyes.

And for the goats on the left:
Isa 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy.

 

[Fascinated With God]

So you don't believe that the resurrection makes the soul of at least the saved immortal?

 

[DrBubbaLove]

Heman, If you think that responded to my question you are mistaken.

The closest that post came to being a response was taking something out of context to suggest there is only one who is immortal. Two points, I did not state humans are born immortal. I asked how we can speak of a resurrection absent the belief that we have immortal souls. Having an immortal soul obviously does not make our bodies immortal - we still die.

2nd point
Paul in Tim 6:16 in context is speaking a risen MAN, and Who is the ONLY risen man, Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. As such Jesus is the only current immortal MAN. The rest of us must await resurrection to be immortal. None of that speaks to our souls or answers the question about whether or not our souls are immortal.

But never mind that. The point was how to see resurrection as possible WITHOUT there being immortal human souls.

 

[he-man]

The closest that post came to being a response was taking something out of context to suggest there is only one who is immortal. None of that speaks to our souls or answers the question about whether or not our souls are immortal.
But never mind that. The point was how to see resurrection as possible WITHOUT there being immortal human souls.

Since there are not immortal souls you are out of luck.

BDAG ψυχή : the life

Luke 21:19 (text according to Stephanus (1550), Westcott-Hort (1881) and Scrivener (1894))
ἐν τῇ ὑπομονῇ ὑμῶν κτήσασθε τὰς ψυχὰς ὑμῶν
Stand firm, and you will win life. (NIV)

This passage Luke 21:19 may be thus translated: By persevering in bearing these trials you will save your lives, or you will be safe; or, by persevering preserve your lives, that is, do not yield to these calamities, but bear up under them, for he that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved. Comp. Matthew 24:13.
Barnes' Notes on the New Testament Explanatory and Practical.

Luke 21:19 (ESV)
19 By your endurance you will gain your lives.

Pindar, Νεμεόνικοι, Χρομιῳ Αιτναιῳ Αρματι (Nemean Ode 9), lines 37-39:
παῦροι δὲ βουλεῦσαι φόνου / παρποδίου νεφέλαν τρέψαι ποτὶ / δυσμενέων ἀνδρῶν στίχας / χερσὶ καὶ ψυχᾷ δυνατοί
cited by Liddell and Scott as an example of "ψυχή" meaning "the conscious self or personality as centre of emotions, desires, and affections"

ψυχή in A Greek-English Lexicon by Liddell & Scott, Clarendon Press, Oxford, 1940 life
Strong’s concordance number: G5590 breath, that is, (by implication) spirit, abstractly or concretely (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from G4151, which is the rational and immortal spirit

You also forgot David Joris, Thomas Hobbes, John Epps and Dr. John Thomas, Simpson (1804), Lardner (1742), Sykes (1737),

Not only did Epps reject the orthodox church establishments, but he also rejected a number of the mainstream Christian doctrines. He rejected the doctrine of the immortal soul, emphasising instead resurrection as the escape from death. In this vein, the second coming of Christ is also emphasised.

He taught that Hell is the grave, not the place of torment of mainstream Christianity. He also spoke out against the glorification of war-heroes: "the honour of the British flag is a specious phrase which blinds men's eyes to right and wrong", he said.

..though he was one of a long line of Dissenters to take this view stretching back through Simpson (1804), Lardner (1742), Sykes (1737), going back to the Dutch Anabaptist David Joris (1540).

 

[Theodore1]

I... wait... What's the difference between the 'pursuit of pleasure and the avoidance of pain' and the 'pursuit of heaven and the avoidance of hell'? Is this not just pushing the desires of the flesh into the kingdom of God?

There is a big difference.

John 3:3 "In reply Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
You can not see the kingdom of heaven, as the Lord says, if you are not born again, that is, if the Lord doesn't help you see it through His grace.

So, a man does not really think of heaven or hell in the first place. As i said, in order to first think about the existence of heaven or hell, and i mean really think about it, and believe in it, the Lord must help you through His grace.
Otherwise, it is just another fairytale to you.

So, a man will seek what is TANGIBLE to him, and what i tangible Without the Lord's grace, is the desires of the flesh. Avoidance of the flesh's pain and seeking its pleasures.
He does not see heaven or hell as real. So he doesn't associate pleasure with heaven, or pain with hell in the first place.

And what does flesh have to do with the kingdom of God?
The afterlife is without any physical body, both for those going to heaven and those going to hell.

And who is this Tony Robbins? i am Greek Orthodox. If i had heard or read someone, his name would have been 99% of the time Greek.

Fear has nothing to do with making people believe. Greek Orthodox dogma and priests have nothing to do with the average screaming evangelist who is screaming about "FEW WILL BE SAVED" or about "HELL's Torments"

 

[Exjunkman]

There is a big difference.

John 3:3 "In reply Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
You can not see the kingdom of heaven, as the Lord says, if you are not born again, that is, if the Lord doesn't help you see it through His grace.

So, a man does not really think of heaven or hell in the first place. As i said, in order to first think about the existence of heaven or hell, and i mean really think about it, and believe in it, the Lord must help you through His grace.
Otherwise, it is just another fairytale to you.

So, a man will seek what is TANGIBLE to him, and what i tangible Without the Lord's grace, is the desires of the flesh. Avoidance of the flesh's pain and seeking its pleasures.
He does not see heaven or hell as real. So he doesn't associate pleasure with heaven, or pain with hell in the first place.

And what does flesh have to do with the kingdom of God?
The afterlife is without any physical body, both for those going to heaven and those going to hell.

And who is this Tony Robbins? i am Greek Orthodox. If i had heard or read someone, his name would have been 99% of the time Greek.

Fear has nothing to do with making people believe. Greek Orthodox dogma and priests have nothing to do with the average screaming evangelist who is screaming about "FEW WILL BE SAVED" or about "HELL's Torments"

John 3:3 is NOT talking about heaven. He is talking about the "kingdom of God", that is, the scenario where God is out King, our leader, our savior and we are His subjects-that's all.

As far as us not having bodies in the afterlife, what is the resurrection of the dead all about then?

 

[Theodore1]

John 3:3 is NOT talking about heaven. He is talking about the "kingdom of God", that is, the scenario where God is out King, our leader, our savior and we are His subjects-that's all.

As far as us not having bodies in the afterlife, what is the resurrection of the dead all about then?

Yes it is.

John 18:36
Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews. But now my kingdom is from another place."

Heaven IS the kingdom of God.
Where, if not in Heaven, will God be our King, our Leader, our Savior and we His subjects

As for the resurrection, it is not meant for our physical bodies as they are now.

Matthew 22:30
"At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven"

Angels do not have physical bodies, and nor will we. We will be like angels are.

 

[seeingeyes]

Forgive me for not being clearer, I am just trying to get a grasp on what you are saying.

There is a big difference.

John 3:3 "In reply Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
You can not see the kingdom of heaven, as the Lord says, if you are not born again, that is, if the Lord doesn't help you see it through His grace.

Amen!

So, a man does not really think of heaven or hell in the first place. As i said, in order to first think about the existence of heaven or hell, and i mean really think about it, and believe in it, the Lord must help you through His grace.
Otherwise, it is just another fairytale to you.

This might be where I'm getting fuzzy. Heaven and hell are all over western culture, so plenty of people think about it without any grace at all (hence, I'm sure, all the arguments about it.)

But if you mean that by the grace of God people think of heaven and hell as an extension of who God is and what He is doing in this world, then yes, amen.

So, a man will seek what is TANGIBLE to him, and what i tangible Without the Lord's grace, is the desires of the flesh. Avoidance of the flesh's pain and seeking its pleasures.
He does not see heaven or hell as real. So he doesn't associate pleasure with heaven, or pain with hell in the first place.

Is it 'gooder' for me to chase after something intangibly good for myself then it is to chase after something tangibly good for myself? Probably.

But isn't it 'gooder' by far for me to chase after something (tangibly or intangibly) good for someone else?

See what I'm saying?

I believe this is the model Christ gave us when he laid down his life for us. Not just delayed gratification, but true humility and selflessness.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

Since there are not immortal souls you are out of luck.
...............................{just a lot of stuff that does not address the point that was made.}

So rather than address the point, one just repeats what one believes. I realize some here believe differently than myself and some even think everyone else disagreeing with them is going to Hell. .

Personally I hope I make to Heaven and see all of you there, no matter what you think of me or the Church.

Again the point was that speaking of humans having an afterlife without any connection to this life via some element of our nature/existence transcending death is IMO meaningless. There is no afterlife if we cease to be at death. The only thing to be discussed at that point if that is so, is whether God could re-create each us. As we should all agree He could do so, we need to move past that and explain how that recreation is the SAME person and not a NEW person.

If we do not have souls/spirits which survive our death (because that part of us is IMMORTAL) then there is nothing left of us when we die. We can then only be recreated, not resurrected.

As no one of the various opposing views here has of yet explained how they see meaning in God creating duplicates of us to then judge and reconcile those duplicates to whatever fate the life of the originals gives them, I can only conclude it is has either never occured to them to attempt to make sense out of the whole bigger picture of such an afterlife or because there is no adequate answer it is simply a "matter of faith" for them to accept it is so.

I predict another lengthy sermon completely off topic response and also more not so subtle suggestions that I, anyone following the Church and certainly anyone else daring to disagree are being led by Satan and going to Hell.

 

[he-man]

Personally I hope I make to Heaven and see all of you there, no matter what you think of me or the Church.
If we do not have souls/spirits which survive our death (because that part of us is IMMORTAL) then there is nothing left of us when we die. We can then only be recreated, not resurrected.
I, anyone following the Church and certainly anyone else daring to disagree are being led by Satan and going to Hell.

Since you do not understand the usage of the word "SOUL" as BDAG ψυχή : the life

I can understand why you do not understand the usage of the word "Satan" [διάβολος] (to the point of dualistic ditheism/bitheism), since it only came into being from the early 20th cent.: from Ital., from eccles. L. diabolus 'devil' OE dēofol, via late L. from Gk diabolos 'accuser, slanderer' (used in the Septuagint to translate Heb. śāṭān 'Satan'), from diaballein 'to slander'.

and the word "HELL" ruler of Hel, the location in Anglo-Saxon (Germanic) and Norse mythology OE hel, hell, of Gmc origin. Gmc. Germanic, a branch of Indo-European, ancestral language of English, German, Dutch, Frisian, Scandinavian tongues and several extinct languages such as Gothic and Frankish.
© Oxford University Press, 2004

Where in Genesis or anywhere else does it say So God created Satan in His own image; in the image of God He created him;


Are there male and female Satans?

The meaning of the word SOUL BDAG ψυχή : the life

Luke 21:19 (text according to Stephanus (1550), Westcott-Hort (1881) and Scrivener (1894))
ἐν τῇ ὑπομονῇ ὑμῶν κτήσασθε τὰς ψυχὰς ὑμῶν
Stand firm, and you will win life. (NIV)

This passage Luke 21:19 may be thus translated: By persevering in bearing these trials you will save your lives, or you will be safe; or, by persevering preserve your lives, that is, do not yield to these calamities, but bear up under them, for he that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved. Comp. Matthew 24:13.
Barnes' Notes on the New Testament Explanatory and Practical.

Luke 21:19 (ESV)
19 By your endurance you will gain your lives.

Pindar, Νεμεόνικοι, Χρομιῳ Αιτναιῳ Αρματι (Nemean Ode 9), lines 37-39:
παῦροι δὲ βουλεῦσαι φόνου / παρποδίου νεφέλαν τρέψαι ποτὶ / δυσμενέων ἀνδρῶν στίχας / χερσὶ καὶ ψυχᾷ δυνατοί
cited by Liddell and Scott as an example of "ψυχή" meaning "the conscious self or personality as centre of emotions, desires, and affections"

ψυχή in A Greek-English Lexicon by Liddell & Scott, Clarendon Press, Oxford, 1940 life
Strong’s concordance number: G5590 breath, that is, (by implication) spirit, abstractly or concretely (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from G4151, which is the rational and immortal spirit

 

[Hillsage]

Yes it is.

John 18:36
Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews. But now my kingdom is from another place."

Heaven IS the kingdom of God.
Where, if not in Heaven, will God be our King, our Leader, our Savior and we His subjects

So if "heaven is the kingdom of heaven", are you 'in heaven' now?

Jesus was still 'on earth' when He said he/us were also "not of the world"...as believers?

JOH 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

While myprophesy of an entirely off topic response to the point asked came true, we at least were spared another sermon of how everyone disagreeing with a certain poster are going to Hell. Yeah (off topic - Does that make me a prophet?

Left un-responded to, is how those who do not believe in an immortal human soul see any meaning in an afterlife.

 

[he-man]

While myprophesy of an entirely off topic response to the point asked came true, we at least were spared another sermon of how everyone disagreeing with a certain poster are going to Hell. Yeah (off topic - Does that make me a prophet?

Left un-responded to, is how those who do not believe in an immortal human soul see any meaning in an afterlife.

Since you do not understand the usage of the word "SOUL" as BDAG ψυχή : the life

1Cor 2:14, 15:44,46 According to Souter Lex. s.v. the reference is to φυχη in the sense of "the principle of life and the basis of it's emotional aspect, animating the present body of flesh, in contrast to the higher life".
Moulton-Milligan, The Vocabulary of the Greek Testament

I can understand why you do not understand the usage of the word "Satan" [διάβολος] (to the point of dualistic ditheism/bitheism), since it only came into being from the early 20th cent.: from Ital., from eccles. L. diabolus 'devil' OE dēofol, via late L. from Gk diabolos 'accuser, slanderer' (used in the Septuagint to translate Heb. śāṭān 'Satan'), from diaballein 'to slander'.

and the word "HELL" ruler of Hel, the location in Anglo-Saxon (Germanic) and Norse mythology OE hel, hell, of Gmc origin. Gmc. Germanic, a branch of Indo-European, ancestral language of English, German, Dutch, Frisian, Scandinavian tongues and several extinct languages such as Gothic and Frankish.
© Oxford University Press, 2004

Where in Genesis or anywhere else does it say So God created Satan in His own image; in the image of God He created him;

Are there male and female Satans?

The meaning of the word SOUL BDAG ψυχή : the life

Luke 21:19 (text according to Stephanus (1550), Westcott-Hort (1881) and Scrivener (1894))
ἐν τῇ ὑπομονῇ ὑμῶν κτήσασθε τὰς ψυχὰς ὑμῶν
Stand firm, and you will win life. (NIV)

This passage Luke 21:19 may be thus translated: By persevering in bearing these trials you will save your lives, or you will be safe; or, by persevering preserve your lives, that is, do not yield to these calamities, but bear up under them, for he that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved. Comp. Matthew 24:13.
Barnes' Notes on the New Testament Explanatory and Practical.

Luke 21:19 (ESV)
19 By your endurance you will gain your lives.

Pindar, Νεμεόνικοι, Χρομιῳ Αιτναιῳ Αρματι (Nemean Ode 9), lines 37-39:
παῦροι δὲ βουλεῦσαι φόνου / παρποδίου νεφέλαν τρέψαι ποτὶ / δυσμενέων ἀνδρῶν στίχας / χερσὶ καὶ ψυχᾷ δυνατοί
cited by Liddell and Scott as an example of "ψυχή" meaning "the conscious self or personality as centre of emotions, desires, and affections"

ψυχή in A Greek-English Lexicon by Liddell & Scott, Clarendon Press, Oxford, 1940 life

Strong’s concordance number: G5590 breath, that is, (by implication) spirit, abstractly or concretely (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from G4151, which is the rational and immortal spirit

 

[DrBubbaLove]

Ok, one player obviously has no answer and elects to double down. Anyone else?

 

[he-man]

Ok, one player obviously has no answer and elects to double down. Anyone else?
Originally Posted by DrBubbaLove

While myprophesy of an entirely off topic response to the point asked came true, we at least were spared another sermon of how everyone disagreeing with a certain poster are going to Hell. Yeah (off topic - Does that make me a prophet?

Left un-responded to, is how those who do not believe in an immortal human soul see any meaning in an afterlife.
​

Looks to me like you responded as one player who obviously has no answer!

Don't know who Souter was? Alexander Souter, Greek New Testament Lexicon

1Cor 2:14, 15:44,46 According to Souter Lex. s.v. the reference is to φυχη in the sense of "the principle of life and the basis of it's emotional aspect, animating the present body of flesh, in contrast to the higher life".
Moulton-Milligan, The Vocabulary of the Greek Testament

 

[Fascinated With God]

So you don't believe that the resurrection makes the soul of at least the saved immortal?

You never answered my question, He-man.

 

[Fascinated With God]

He taught that Hell is the grave, not the place of torment of mainstream Christianity.

You must mean Sheol is the grave. Gehenna, Hades and Tartarus clearly do not refer to an earthly grave site.

There exists in Hebrew a specific word for the grave: kever. When the biblical authors wanted to speak of the grave, they used the word kever. That they did not view kever and Sheol as synonymous is clear from the way these words are used throughout the Old Testament. For example, in Isa 14:19, the king is cast out of his grave (kever) in order to be thrown into Sheol where the departed spirits can rebuke him (vv.9,10). In this passage, Sheol and kever are opposites, not synonyms.

This distinction is maintained in the Septuagint as well. In the Septuagint, Sheol is never translated as mneema, which is the Greek word for grave. It is always translated as Hades which meant the underworld.

In Psalm 139:8 the great depth of Sheol is contrasted with the great height of heaven in order to describe God's omnipresence. The frequent references to Sheol's great depth cannot be referring to the shallow six foot depth of a grave, much less an above ground tomb as per Jesus' burial. The name Pit is synonymous with Sheol and it is at a great depth at "the roots of the mountains" (Jonah 2:6).

While we can enter and leave a tomb or grave (2 Kings 23:16), no one is ever said to enter and then leave Sheol. While touching a grave brings ceremonial defilement (Num. 19:16), the Scriptures never speak of anyone being defiled by Sheol. Many other such distinctions can be found in the Hebrew scriptures.

Sheol is a place of conscious existence after death, not simply the common grave of mankind. It was viewed as a place where one can reunite with his ancestors, tribe or people (Gen. 15:15; 25:8; 35:29; 37:35; 49:33; Num. 20:24, 28; 31:2; Deut. 32:50; 34:5; 2 Sam. 12:23). This cannot refer to one common mass grave where everyone was buried. No such graves ever existed in recorded history.

At death man becomes a rephaim--a "ghost, "shade," or "disembodied spirit" according to Job 26:5; Ps. 88:10; Prov. 2:18; 9:18; 21:16; Isa. 14:9; 26:14,19. Instead of describing man as passing into nonexistence, the Old Testament states that man becomes a disembodied spirit. The usage of the word rephaim establishes this truth. Langenscheidt's Hebrew-English Dictionary to the Old Testament (p.324) defines rephaim as referring to the "departed spirits, Hades." Brown, Driver and Briggs (p.952) define rephaim as "Hades, ghosts...name of dead in Sheol." Keil and Delitzsch define rephaim as referring to "those who are bodiless in the state after death." This concept is carried on into the New Testament in such places as Luke 24:37-39 where the Disciples think that Jesus is a spirit without flesh, i.e. ghost.

 

[he-man]

You must mean Sheol is the grave. Gehenna, Hades and Tartarus clearly do not refer to an earthly grave site. There exists in Hebrew a specific word for the grave: kever. When the biblical authors wanted to speak of the grave, they used the word kever. That they did not view kever and Sheol as synonymous is clear from the way these words are used throughout the Old Testament. For example, in Isa 14:19, the king is cast out of his grave (kever) in order to be thrown into Sheol where the departed spirits can rebuke him (vv.9,10). In this passage, Sheol and kever are opposites, not synonyms.

Your Hebrew is lacking:The word for Sheol is: שׁאול nm. Sheol H7585 and is not in Isa 14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave (H6913 קברה nm. grave, tomb, sepulcher) like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit (H953 בּור nm. hole, pit); as a carcase trodden under feet.

20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

NOW, as you can see from the following verses, the terms hell, pit, and grave are used synonymously:

Isa 14:15 none the less art thou brought down to Sheol, to the recesses of the pit.

Gen 37:35 And all his sons and all his daughters rose up to comfort him; but he refused to be comforted; and he said, For I will go down into the grave <Sheol H7585> unto my son mourning. Thus his father wept for him.

Deu 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell <Sheol H7585>, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

Num 16:32 And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah, and all their goods.
33 They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive into the pit <Sheol H7585>, and the earth closed upon them: and they perished from among the congregation.

This distinction is maintained in the Septuagint as well. In the Septuagint, Sheol is never translated as mneema, which is the Greek word for grave. It is always translated as Hades which meant the underworld.

Isn't it a little strange that the word Hades is never used in the OT? Where does God send GOG?
Eze 39:11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will give unto Gog a place there of graves in Israel, the valley of the passengers on the east of the sea: and it shall stop the noses of the passengers: and there shall they bury Gog and all his multitude: and they shall call it The valley of Hamongog. [multitude of Gog, the name of the valley in which the slaughtered forces of Gog are to be buried (Ezek. 39:11,15) Bible Dictionary]

In Psalm 139:8 the great depth of Sheol is contrasted with the great height of heaven in order to describe God's omnipresence. The name Pit is synonymous with Sheol and it is at a great depth at "the roots of the mountains" (Jonah 2:6).

Psa 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell <Sheol H7585>, behold, thou art there.
15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lower parts of the
earth.

Jon 2:6 I went down to the chopped of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God.

Tartarus classic Greek mythology (c. 400 BC) and was never used in the OT.

Would you care to explain how Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. Rev 20:13

The word "Hades" in Greek &#940;&#948;&#951;&#962; [death, grave]&#900; was originally a proper noun, the name of the god of the underworld. In time the word came to denote a place or state, and in the King James Version it is usually rendered "hell," [instead of] and once "grave" (1 Cor 15:55).
"Persistent Problems Confronting Bible Translators" by Bruce M. Metzger

Hades (from Greek , Hades, originally , Haides or , Aides, probably from Indo-European * 'unseen') refers to both the ancient Greek underworld and the god of the dead. The word originally (as in Homer) referred to just the god; , Haidou its genitive, was an elision (omission of a vowel of "the house of Hades". Eventually, the nominative, too, came to designate the abode of the dead.
Hades Greek Mythology the abode of the spirits of the dead; the underworld.
© Oxford University Press, 2004

Hades The nether world (according to classical mythology, the abode of the shades, ruled over by Hades or Pluto); the invisible world; the grave.
Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913)

Hades 1. (Greek mythology) the god of the underworld in ancient mythology; brother of Zeus and husband of Persephone
WordNet 2.0

[Greek] Hades is the lord of the dead and ruler of the nether world, (underworld, inferno ) which is referred to as the domain of Hades or, by transference, as Hades alone.
Hades

Hades that which is out of sight, a Greek word used to denote the state or place of the dead. All the dead alike go into this place. To be buried, to go down to the grave, to descend into hades, are equivalent expressions.

In the LXX. this word is the usual rendering of the Hebrew sheol, the common receptacle of the departed (Gen. 42:38; Ps. 139:8; Hos. 13:14; Isa. 14:9). This term is of comparatively rare occurrence in the Greek New Testament. Our Lord speaks of Capernaum as being "brought down to hell" (hades), i.e., simply to the lowest debasement, (Matt. 11:23).

In Acts 2:27-31 Peter quotes the LXX. version of Ps. 16:8-11, plainly for the purpose of proving our Lord's resurrection from the dead. David was left in the place of the dead, and his body saw corruption. Not so with Christ. According to ancient prophecy (Ps. 30:3) he was recalled to life.
Easton's Bible Dictionary

Isa 14:15 none the less art thou brought down to Sheol, to the recesses of the pit.