Why did John deny he was Elijah?

[Mr_E]

Jesus clearly states in the New Testament that John is Elijah. Why does John deny that he is Elijah at the beginning of the Gospel of John? Was he unaware of who he was at the time, or was he afraid people would think he was greater than or on the same level as Christ?

 

[snoochface]

Where does Jesus ever say that John is Elijah?

 

[Mr_E]

Matt 17:10-13
And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias(Elijah) must first come?
And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.
But I say unto you, That Elias(Elijah) is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.
Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

 

[snoochface]

Okay, I found it.

[bible]Matthew 11:11-15[/bible]

This is what my Bible commentary says about those verses:

The prophet Malachi Mal_4:5-6 predicted that “Elijah” would be sent before the coming of the Messiah to prepare the way for him. By this was evidently meant, not that he should appear “in person,” but that one should appear with a striking resemblance to him; or, as Luke Luk_1:17 expresses it, “in the spirit and power of Elijah.” But the Jews understood it differently. They supposed that Elijah would appear in person. They also supposed that Jeremiah and some other of the prophets would appear also to usher in the promised Messiah and to grace his advent. See Mat_16:14; Mat_17:10; Joh_1:21. This prevalent belief was the reason why he used the words “if ye will receive it,” implying that the affirmation that “John” was the promised Elijah was a doctrine contrary to their expectation.

The Prophet Malachi, who predicted the coming of the Baptist in the spirit and power of Elijah, gave the three following distinct characteristics of him. First, That he should be the forerunner and messenger of the Messiah: Behold I send my messenger before me, Mal_3:1. Secondly, That he should appear before the destruction of the second temple: Even the Lord whom ye seek shall suddenly come to his temple, ibid. Thirdly, That he should preach repentance to the Jews; and that, some time after, the great and terrible day of the Lord should come, and the Jewish land be smitten with a curse, Mal_4:5, Mal_4:6. Now these three characters agree perfectly with the conduct of the Baptist, and what shortly followed his preaching, and have not been found in any one else; which is a convincing proof that Jesus was the promised Messiah.

The concluding prophecy of the Old Testament was, Behold, I will send you Elijah, Mal_4:5, Mal_4:6. Those words prophesied until John, and then, being turned into a history, they ceased to prophecy. First, Christ speaks of it as a great truth, that John the Baptist is the Elias of the New Testament; not Elias in propria persona - in his own person, as the carnal Jews expected; he denied that (Joh_1:21), but one that should come in the spirit and power of Elias (Luk_1:17), like him in temper and conversation, that should press repentance with terrors, and especially as it is in the prophecy, that should turn the hearts of the fathers to the children. Secondly, He speaks of it as a truth, which would not be easily apprehended by those whose expectations fastened upon the temporal kingdom of the Messiah, and introductions to it agreeable. Christ suspects the welcome of it, if ye will receive it. Not but that it was true, whether they would receive it or not, but he upbraids them with their prejudices, that they were backward to receive the greatest truths that were opposed to their sentiments, though never so favourable to their interests. Or, “If you will receive him, or if you will receive the ministry of John as that of the promised Elias, he will be an Elias to you, to turn you and prepare you for the Lord,” Note, Gospel truths are as they are received, a savour of life or death. Christ is a Saviour, and John an Elias, to those who will receive the truth concerning them.

Based on this, the conclusion is that John came in the spirit and power of Elijah, but was not Elijah himself (in the flesh).

 

[snoochface]

Matt 17:10-13
And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias(Elijah) must first come?
And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.
But I say unto you, That Elias(Elijah) is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.
Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.

I'll use my software's commentaries again - it's the best way I have to understand passages like these.

Mat 17:10 -

Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come

Compare (Mat_11:14); (Mar_9:11-13); (Luk_1:17); (Mal_3:1); (Mal_4:5-6).

All the passages must be construed together.

(1) Christ confirms the specific and still unfulfilled prophecy of (Mal_4:5-6): "Elias shall truly first come and restore all things." Here, as in Malachi, the prediction fulfilled in John the Baptist, and that yet to be fulfilled in Elijah, are kept distinct.

(2) But John the Baptist had come already, and with a ministry so completely in the spirit and power of Elijah's future ministry (Luk_1:17) that in an adumbrative and typical sense it could be said: "Elias is come already."

Compare (Mat_10:40); (Phm_1:12); (Phm_1:17) where the same thought of identification, while yet preserving personal distinction, occurs. (Joh_1:27).

Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things - He did not mean by this that Elijah was yet to come, for he tells them immediately Mat_17:12 that he had come; but he meant to affirm that it was a true doctrine which the scribes taught, that Elijah would appear before the coming of the Messiah. To “restore” means to put into the former situation. See Mat_12:13. Hence, it means to heal, to correct, to put in proper order. Here it means that Elijah would put things in a proper state; he would be the instrument of reforming the people, or of restoring them, in some measure, to proper notions about the Messiah and preparing them for his coming. Before the coming of John their views were erroneous, their expectations were worldly, and their conduct were exceedingly depraved. He corrected many of their notions about the Messiah (see Matt. 3), and he was the instrument of an extensive reformation, and thus restored them, in some degree, to correct views of their own system and of the Messiah, and to a preparation for his advent.

Mat_17:12
Elias is come already - That is, John the Baptist has come, in the spirit and power of Elias. See Luk_1:17.

 

[Mr_E]

I see. What I am getting from this is that John denied that he was Elijah in the flesh as they had meant when they questioned him, but not that he was Elijah in spirit. I wonder whether he fully understood who he was?

 

[Tenorvoice]

Okay, I found it.

Matthew 11:11-1511 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he. 12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force. 13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. 14 And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come. 15 He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

This is what my Bible commentary says about those verses:







Based on this, the conclusion is that John came in the spirit and power of Elijah, but was not Elijah himself (in the flesh).

To say this then you are basically saying that he was Elijah reincarnated??

I would have to question that myself

 

[snoochface]

To say this then you are basically saying that he was Elijah reincarnated??

I would have to question that myself

No, exactly the opposite.

He was not Elijah reincarnated. He was not Elijah in the flesh. He met the spiritual characteristics of Elijah and satisfied the prophesy that Elijah would come before the messiah "to restore all things". John the Baptist came in the spirit and power of Elijah, to the point that it could be said (and was in fact said by Jesus) that Elijah had come.

If you read the commentaries I posted, they all say pretty much the same thing.

 

[Tenorvoice]

Sorry I have a hard time reading such small type.

It will take me some time to do that.

 

[KingdomScribe]

I see. What I am getting from this is that John denied that he was Elijah in the flesh as they had meant when they questioned him, but not that he was Elijah in spirit. I wonder whether he fully understood who he was?

Thanks, Mr_E, for letting me know about this thread! It raises a few, interesting issues.

First -- the commentaries cover the question well.

As said above, the Jews expected the "person" of Elijah in the flesh. (Much as in Jewish Passover today in which a place setting is left at the supper table "for Elijah", should he appear... He would probably be hungry, having been gone for 3,000 years...)

Anyway --based on the widespread misunderstanding the Old Testament prophecies, neither the Jews nor John "recognized" that he was "Elijah".

Remember how after Peter declared that Jesus was the Messiah (the Christ, in Greek), Jesus said, "Flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven"?

Well, for someone to understand that John was "spiritually" Elijah, it would have to be a revelation "from the Father" --no "flesh and blood" rabbi could have come up with that.

You might wonder --if John were "filled with the Spirit from the womb", why didn’t he just know that he was the "spiritual Elijah"?

Well -- God doesn’t choose to reveal everything to us. For example, despite the incredible anointing of the Spirit on Elisha (2Kngs 4.25), God withheld some things from him. When the Shunammite woman’s son had died, and she ran to find Elisha. He saw her in the distance and sent his servant to run and meet her and find out what the problem was, because "the LORD hath hid it from me, and hath not told me."

So, (for whatever reason) Heaven chose NOT to clue John in on his identity as "Elijah". John only had the same Scriptures as the other Jews, and they weren’t sufficient to disclose his "spiritual identity".

NOW THERE’S A REASON I’M CARRYING ON LIKE THIS! Not only did the Jews misunderstand the "coming of Elijah" since it didn’t happen like they thought the prophecies said it would...but based on misunderstanding Old Testament prophecies, they also misunderstood the coming of the Messiah and so did NOT recognize Jesus as the Messiah.

HERE’S THE KICKER: John ALSO misunderstood the coming of the Messiah. He ALSO didn’t recognize that Jesus was the Messiah.

Now, you might say, "Hold it! John is the one who identified Jesus as "the Lamb of God which taketh away the sins of the world".

And that’s right. But at that moment, John was acting under the illumination of the Holy Spirit. "Heaven" was speaking through him -- not "flesh and blood" – when he said, "I have need to be baptized by you..."

But later – when he sat in Herod's dungeon waiting to be killed -- he sent his disciples to Jesus to ask if Jesus really was the Messiah or not.

It isn't that John doubted...it's that John only understood the prophecies with his natural mind. He interpreted the prophecies about the Messiah (AND the coming of "Elijah") just as the rest of the Jews interpreted them.

In other words – John "spotted" Jesus in the Spirit, told everyone to go and follow the "Messiah" – then he waited to see the Judgment of God fall on the wicked, destroy the occupying forces of the Roman soldiers, topple the rule of Rome and set up His Throne in Jerusalem on the Throne of David His Father.

He'd already warned everyone to repent because the Messiah was coming to baptize them, not with water, but with the Spirit and with fire. Judgment! He'd said, "You better repent, because the 'axe is already at the root of the tree'!" This meant to his listeners that the "tree" (the wicked world of unrighteous mankind) was so close to being "chopped down", that the axman had already come and (in order to bind his loose robes up and out of the way of swinging the axe) had set his Axe of Judgment at the roots of the Tree, and in any moment would begin to swing the Axe and topple Unrighteous Humanity.

Instead, he sat in prison, waiting for his head to be chopped off.

And Jesus – the Messiah Who had come to bring Judgment as according to the Old Testament prophecies – Jesus just went all over the place doing good deeds.

How confusing. It didn't fit his interpretation of the prophecies. So he sent his disciples to Jesus to ask, "are you really the Messiah?"

And Jesus just had John's disciples hang around and watch Him open blind eyes, heal the sick, cast out demons, and generally deliver people from all the works of evil. And then He said, "Go tell John what you've seen."

This was a hard and bitter thing for John to understand. Not only was he anxious for judgment to fall,, he ALSO thought that the "supernatural works" Jesus was busied with, were supposed to be part of the Messianic Kingdom! They weren't supposed to be happening before judgment came. That would be like us today, if "peace" covered the earth and the lion laid down with the lamb – we'd say, "Hold it! That can't happen yet! Jesus has to Come again first!"

So, here's John, stuck with the "natural mind" interpretation of Old testament prophecies – confused at what Jesus insisted on doing and meanwhile, waiting for the axe to fall on his own neck. (He wanted the Axe to fall, for sure, but not on his neck!)

Here's one "today Word" for us -- If you're studying someone's explanations of New Testament "prophecy", never forget that if John the Baptist (no greater man in the flesh "ever born of woman", says Jesus), if John can get prophecy wrong without the benefit of divine illumination, you better be careful about swallowing Dr. Joe Blowhard's schematic of the End Times.

Now, Dr. Blowhard may claim he has "divine revelation" which has "showed him the truth", but you be careful about the claims people make about themselves!

ONE FINAL APPLICATION: So -- John did NOT recognize that he had come as "spiritual Elijah". People tried to tell him that they thought he was "Elijah" but he rejected the idea. Why? Because he knew as well as anyone that "Elijah" was going to come in the flesh as the original person of "Elijah. (Don't try to teach HIM "prophecy"! He knew what it said!)

Having said that, if John the Baptist "came in the spirit of Elijah", what's there to stop God from sending the "spirit of Elijah" again today? In fact, if that spirit is sent again today ("preparing the way for the Second Coming of the Messiah") does the "spirit of Elijah" have to come upon an "individual" human being? Is it possible that the spirit of Elijah can come today in preparation for the soon return of Jesus, and come upon the Man, Jesus, upon His Body which is us, the Church?

Hey! That can sure be "pure" "flesh and blood" speculation -- but I am saying we have let John's confusion cultivate in us a deep "humility" when interpreting New Testament prophecies.

KingdomScribe

P.S. I, for one, am praying for the "spirit of Elijah" to "come upon the Body of Christ", "turning the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the hearts of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse." (Mal 4.6) ks

 

[Mr_E]

^Very good answer! Now it makes sense.

 

[Endure2]

i would say that there easily could have been a time when John doubted who he was, he did come to a time of questioning or doubt as whether or not Jesus was actually the messiah when he was in prison and sent a man to ask Jesus the truth, even though john previously proclaimed to all that Jesus was the messiah upon baptising him.

if he could have doubted this, he could have certainly doubted his own supernatural significance and calling too. i mean, he was in prison and was about to die... and his messiah wasnt doing the things he and many jews expected him to do.

 

[Tenorvoice]

This is what the book "All the men of the Bible" has to say about John the Baptist:

3. The son of Zacharias and Elisabeth, who appeared as the forerunner of Christ, and who was beheaded by Herod (Matt. 3:1, 4, 13).

The Man Who Was Plain But Powerful
​

​

With the appearance of John the Baptist we have the burial of the Old Dispensation and the emergence of the New. We seem to see his rugged figure standing with arms outstretched, as with one hand he takes the Old Testament, and with the other holds the New, and who, through his ministry, makes the transition from Law to Grace. He was the foreclosure of the old and the forerunner of the new. Perhaps we can helpfully gather the witness of John around these salient features:

I. His parentage. John came as the child of promise and was born in a city of Judah when his parents were old, and his mother long past conception (Luke 1:7, 13, 39). His parents were of priestly descent, his mother being a kinswoman of Mary the mother of our Lord (Luke 1:36).

II. His ascetic affinities. John, as a man of the desert, knew what it was to practice self-denial (Matt. 3:4). A Nazarite from his birth, he developed self-reliance and spiritual strength as he communed with God in the desert solitudes he loved (Luke 1:15). He was a plain man in every way, akin to Elijah whom many took him for.

He was plain of dress. He dressed simply, his raiment consisting of camel’s hair, that is, either a robe of camel’s skin or cloth woven from camel’s hair. What a humble habit compared with the luxurious robes of soft wool worn by the fashionable and great of his time!

He was plain of food. No sumptuous dishes for this Elijah-like prophet. It was on rough food he thrived. Vegetable honey exuding from fig-trees and palms, and edible locusts, classed among the flying, creeping things the Israelites were allowed to eat (Lev. 11:22), formed his diet (Matt. 3:4). John the Baptist could subscribe to the words of a devout Englishman of a past century:

I shall be spare of sleep, sparer of diet, and sparest of time that, when the days for eating, drinking, clothing, and sleeping shall be no more, I may eat of my Saviour’s hidden manna, drink of the new wine in my Father’s kingdom, and inherit that rest which remaineth for the people of my God for ever and ever.

He was plain of speech. Living near to nature, he heard God’s voice in solitude as well as in Scripture. Familiar with the Old Testament, he made frequent use of its picturesque language (Luke 3:17; Isa. 66:24; with Amos 9:6). After his sojourn in the desert, brooding over the need and peril of his time, he came forth to speak of barren trees fit only for burning—vipers fleeing before the flaming scrub. John saw in his desert surroundings much that symbolized his nation’s calamity and which lent color to his solemn warnings of impending doom.

There is a great deal we would like to say about this man sent from God who had the privilege of acting as the forerunner and then as the baptizer of Jesus, who said of him that he was greater than a prophet. Space, however, forbids a full exposition of this mighty character in the Bible’s portrait gallery. The preacher might be able to expand the following features: his self-denial (Matt. 3:4); courage (Matt. 3:7; 14:4); powerful preaching (Mark 1:5); humility (Mark 1:7); holiness (Mark 6:20); burning zeal (John 5:35); honor (Matt. 11:11); ministry of witness (John 10:41); preparatory work (Matt. 11:10); testimony (John 1:29-36); results (Matt. 9:14); death (Matt. 14:10), of which Spurgeon said, "John was the first Baptist Minister to lose his head through dancing."

I will be doing some more research on this tonight.

 

[Tenorvoice]

Very well put Kingdom Scribe