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peepnklown

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Roller, it’s truly sad that you are deceitful and continue to promote falsehoods. Look at the etymology of the world religion and you can easily see that it comes from a reverence to god/s or divine things. This is the opposite of the definition of atheism. Even the modern definition of religion does not fit: “a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.”
So, I should be the one saying, ‘come on!’ Do your research, know the roots of the words you use and the definition but, you won’t because you are not here to promote knowledge, you are here to promote propaganda.
 
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Caitlin.ann

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sacredsin, where is cognitive? I didn't scare him away with my brilliance, did I?

Of course not..he loves trampling others arguments almost as much as he loves me. He's around, probably scribbling up a brilliant response. There's absolutely NOTHING you could say to scare him away.
 
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Minty

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Ding! Wrong again. The Atheist religion is that religion which has faith in the non-existence of a theistic G-d. Where there's faith there's religion.
Must I correct your beliefs all the time? C'mon, guys!
And there was me thinking that Atheism was the lack of religion!
 
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IBM

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+1
 
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peepnklown

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I will not deal with propagandists.
I came back to this forum to promote research, questions and knowledge. So, please everyone who has questions about anything, ask your questions and be prepared to learn from the answers and be prepared to go out and research more about the issue.
 
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Holy Roller

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But the problem begins when they attack Christianity in general. I'd say certain of Atheists are justified if they focus their efforts on the crackpots like Jerry Falwell or Phelps. But they don't; they attack Christianity (and us Jews) in general, assuming the crackpots speak for everyone.
They assume that any Christian/Jew is a 'fundie', and with it, accuse the believer of thinking the earth was made in six days or something. This is bad for Christianity, because the crackpots do believe in those childbook stories of creation.
By painting Christians with this broad brush, they harm the whole apparatus. I am here to defend the apparatus.
I agree, of course, with your statements about Carl Sagan, and thoroughly enjoy reading his books (Demon-haunted world is spot-on 98% of the time. Here he seems to critisize psychotherapy with a greater zeal than that for religion--a sensible approach. It's patently clear Sagan is acutely and shrewdly aware of the social benefit Christianity and Judaism play for humanity).
One thing about the Demon-haunted world is Sagan seems to be perhaps too preoccupied with the emergence of the occult. THe occult is hogwash, sure, and alot of persons call those psychic hotlines, sure, but let's not forget that the very people calling those hotlines or visiting the palm-readers would never visit a science lecture hall or open a Scientific American mag in the first place, so there's nothing lost there.
Sagan may have wanted to force science on people.This to me seems noble at first, but it's a failing cause, since I believe people were born scientists; they aren't made. Just my $2...
 
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Holy Roller

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You don't get it, do you? Both of us are in the same boat!
You would be correct to say, "HR, I won't believe because you haven't shown me any evidence." And I'd be correct in saying, "peepnklown, I will believe because you haven't shown me any absence of evidence."
But I'm in the better position, of course, since I can show the known Universe as evidence of G-d's existence; you really have nothing that shows the Universe came into being somehow by itself.
 
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Caitlin.ann

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You have nothing to show that it didn't.
 
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Holy Roller

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Jesus is hogwash.

Or how about: Lets mutilate a baby's genitals as a sign of our covenant with god.

Trust me, the occult is the least of your worries.

sacredsin (Holy Roller shakes his head down low with a smile on his face...), your manipulations will not entrap me. Keep trying...
...keep trying...
 
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Holy Roller

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And there was me thinking that Atheism was the lack of religion!

No, MintyAngel, it is proper to say that the glass is half-full. It's also proper to say it's half empty.
Specifically, Atheism is blind faith, just like Christianity is blind faith: the Atheist has the blind faith that there is no G-d. So when you say it's a 'lack of a religion', what you're really saying is Atheism is 'faith that there is no religion*'.

*Religion being, of course, the presence of G-d.
 
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Minty

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And then you turn around and do exactly the same thing, thus bringing it full circle, HR. I have nothing against you as a person or your faith, you however rarely extend the same curtesy to others. As an intelligent man, it does you no justice.

They assume that any Christian/Jew is a 'fundie', and with it, accuse the believer of thinking the earth was made in six days or something. This is bad for Christianity, because the crackpots do believe in those childbook stories of creation.
No, all of them don't. Unless you have spoken to every single atheist in the whole world, this is just a generalisation.

By painting Christians with this broad brush, they harm the whole apparatus. I am here to defend the apparatus.
By attacking and insulting non-believers? There has to be a better way, surely?

Sounds good...I'll have to read up on him

 
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Minty

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Atheism, as an explicit position, can be either the affirmation of the nonexistence of gods, or the rejection of theism. It is also defined more broadly as synonymous with any form of nontheism, including the simple absence of belief in deities.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism#cite_note-3
 
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Holy Roller

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My responses to the Atheists are more articulated than you think, MintyAngel. If you were to take a cursory glance at them they may initially seem somewhat offensive and high in ridicule, but my dialogue is actually precisely metered and measured.
If you venture outside this or the other agnostic-centric forums, you'll note with a high degree of relief that I am actually very courteous. Call this fluff, but the quiz on beliefnet.com says I am.
 
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You amuse me still, and why did you not invite me here? I had no idea you were mucking about in things you don't understand again.

Firstly Atheism is a rejection of all Gods/Goddesses, just because their are Christians doesn't mean there aren't loads more deities out there. You're special... but the bad kind of special.

I choose to mock all gods, including my fiancee's deities of worship because I don't play favorites in my lack of belief... I'm just a good guy like that.
 
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Holy Roller

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Caitlin.ann

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Don't make me kick you to the couch you A.R.S.E hole.
 
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Holy Roller

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Ummm, I never accused you of being inconsistent, cognitive.
BTW, thanks for not using the 'F' word...
 
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