why are there so many evil people in the world?

[expos4ever]

Quoting statistics about crime & poverty are poor indicators of the real suffering, especially psychological suffering, experienced by people in their everyday lives.

Poverty not related to suffering? Come on now.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

How do you know the "poverty of the spirit" is worse now than it was in earlier times?

If what you are implying is true, how come we see:

- dramatic reductions in violence among humans;
- reductions in poverty;
- increasing life expectancies;
- increasing literacy;
- improving women's rights;
- etc.

There is hard evidence for such claims. You appear to offer mere claims for your position (at least so far).

These advancements are made through science and legislation, not increased morality. Ask black people if racism is declining and they will likely opine that it has just gone underground.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Poverty not related to suffering? Come on now.

If you don't know you're suffering are you really suffering? Many accept poverty as a reasonable price to pay for a lifestyle they are comfortable with.

 

[expos4ever]

Sinc this is a Christian Forum you can expect posters to define evil according to Jesus' teaching which is disobedience to God's laws. Social approval of abortion, euthanasia, homosexuality, etc, along with the increasing animosity towards expression of Christian faith in the public place, are evil and help to produce the social climate in which many people are suffering.

First, you are cherry-picking. It is difficult, for example, to believe that increased acceptance of homosexuality, if we agree it is an "evil", more than offsets dramatic reductions in global poverty. And methinks you greatly exagerate the degree to which Christians are really being suppressed re public expressions of faith.

Second, how is it not obvious that reductions in violence and poverty are not central to the gospel imperative?

Who said "blessed are the peacemakers"?

Who said "the gospel is good news for the poor"?

 

[expos4ever]

These advancements are made through science and legislation, not increased morality.

False either / or. It is clear that science has been harnessed in service of moral principles - you cannot separate the two the way you appear to be doing.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

First, you are cherry-picking. It is difficult, for example, to believe that increased acceptance of homosexuality, if we agree it is an "evil", more than offsets dramatic reductions in global poverty. And methinks you greatly exagerate the degree to which Christians are really being suppressed re public expressions of faith.

Second, how is it not obvious that reductions in violence and poverty are not central to the gospel imperative?

Who said "blessed are the peacemakers"?

Who said "the gospel is good news for the poor"?

I think global poverty has been reduced by good weather and chemicals rather than the good will of others (notwithstanding the fact that the increased population is at greater risk for future poverty as a result).

 

[OldWiseGuy]

False either / or. It is clear that science has been harnessed in service of moral principles - you cannot separate the two the way you appear to be doing.

Science has been harnessed in service of profits. Societal benefits are secondary, and tenuous. Science is a two-edged sword, and we are more and more feeling the destructive edge.

 

[Rajni]

And in Christianity, God didn't create people evil, he only allowed for free choices.

I think your statement above answers your question in post 86.
(And I agree with you there -- people aren't evil, though
that which they do may, at times, be perceived as such).

 

[expos4ever]

Science is a two-edged sword, and we are more and more feeling the destructive edge.

Obviously a gross misrepresentation. Of course, science has given us things like nuclear weapons and pollution. But, on balance, the benefits far outweigh the drawbacks:

- medicines that dramatically slash rates of early death;
- huge reduction in need for people to perform drudge work;
- incredible advance in access to information and learning;
- general increase in leisure time;
- almost instantaneous communications worldwide;
- significant improvements in the ability to travel on global scales.
- etc., etc. , etc.

There is no denying (except, sadly by many here) that science has brought us global warming. But if the deniers would remove their heads from the sand, perhaps science can save us from this real threat.

I politely suggest you have a narrative to defend, and are not evaluating the facts that are right in front of us.

500 years ago, huge percentages of people spent significant portions of their lives enduring dental pain. Do you want to go back to that?

 

[renniks]

There are no "evil" people per se. There are however people operating with different degrees of ignorance/delusion, greed, and aversions, all of which give rise to unskillful behavior.

Oh there are truly evil people. You can't blame everything on ignorance or delusion etc. Some people just want to see the world burn. and that may be a quote from a movie but it's still true.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Some people would like to think that the world is more ‘evil’, because it suits their narrative about the world ending.

Fact is, the world has never been better, overall, than it is at present, with regard to man’s relationship with his fellows...

I see no evidence to suggest that is the case. It may be the case but I would need to see some proof before I believed it.

 

[Ophiolite]

You would not judge anyone as evil? If someone killed a baby in front of you, you would not call him evil?

If they were mentally ill would you call them evil?
If they had been unknowingly injected with a powerful hallucinogen would you call them evil?
If the child had an untreatable, fatal disease that was causing them unbearable pain would you call them evil?

Do you sometimes wonder if making snap judgements reflects aspects of evil?

 

[grasping the after wind]

You would not judge anyone as evil? If someone killed a baby in front of you, you would not call him evil?

What someone calls another is irrelevant as to whether that person is what the other called him. If a man killed a baby on Tuesday and then saved a baby's life by willingly sacrificing his own arm in the process on Wednesday, is that a person evil or good? Was that an evil person on Tuesday but a good person on Wednesday? Does doing an evil thing make one an evil person ? If so does doing a good thing make one a good person?

 

[stevil]

You would not judge anyone as evil? If someone killed a baby in front of you, you would not call him evil?

People are people.

We are all capable of doing nasty things, some people have a better filter than others, some people have been poisoned by ideology or even by finding themselves in a position of power.

I do accept that there are some people that are so dangerous that we need to lock them up as a preventative measure in order to protect society from them. But I do not believe in evil or evil people.

 

[renniks]

If they were mentally ill would you call them evil?
If they had been unknowingly injected with a powerful hallucinogen would you call them evil?
If the child had an untreatable, fatal disease that was causing them unbearable pain would you call them evil?

Do you sometimes wonder if making snap judgements reflects aspects of evil?

Lol, you know what I'm talking about. Why pick out the most unlikely scenarios? A normal, sane person killing a baby. Is that clear enough? So, not knowing the why, would you try and stop them or just assume it was somehow justified?

 

[renniks]

Does doing an evil thing make one an evil person

According to God is does.
6 For fools speak folly, their hearts are bent on evil: They practice ungodliness and spread error concerning the LORD; the hungry they leave empty and from the thirsty they withhold water.

3 Do not drag me away with the wicked, with those who do evil, who speak cordially with their neighbors but harbor malice in their hearts.

9 For those who are evil will be destroyed, but those who hope in the LORD will inherit the land.

34 You brood of vipers, how can you who are evil say anything good? For the mouth speaks what the heart is full of. 35 A good man brings good things out of the good stored up in him, and an evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in him.

Wait, there are good men and evil men?

 

[Allandavid]

Only if you change the meaning of evil and call it good.

No, only if you do some research. Fewer wars involving fewer people, less violent crime, better care for the poor and the ill. The evidence is there if you want to examine it.

But, that doesn’t match the apocalyptic narrative, does it...?

 

[renniks]

People are people.

We are all capable of doing nasty things, some people have a better filter than others, some people have been poisoned by ideology or even by finding themselves in a position of power.

I do accept that there are some people that are so dangerous that we need to lock them up as a preventative measure in order to protect society from them. But I do not believe in evil or evil people.

I understand. As an atheist, it would be illogical to call anything evil or good. After all, you have no frame of reference for what evil is.

 

[Allandavid]

Suicide is the leading cause of death for Australians aged between 15 and 44 so we can't adopt a superior posture here.
While most people are not consciously evil they help perpetuate the social climate that allows evil to flourish and this is expressed in high levels of anxiety & depression.

Nothing new about suicide rates for that age bracket. However, it represents only a small fraction of all deaths and what does that have to do with the subject of this thread...? Are you suggesting that a desperately mentally ill teenager who takes their own life is “evil”...??

 

[Allandavid]

The stock market never looks better...just before it crashes.

Which has what to do with ‘evil’...?