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If you want to know that then there are websites on the internet that are just for that. They expand on it and show you how greek thought works. Salvation is not conditional. It is unconditional. You can do nothing to obtain salvation by your own merit. You have to do nothing to obtain it. When God changes you on the inside the rest, to include believing and repenting and "accepting Christ" just falls in line as he designed to do. Jesu was very clear in John 6. He said that God draws the elect to him and he said the father had already given them to him. PAST TENSE. All of the elect who haven't been saved yet are unknowingly awaiting God's regeneration.
No matter what any other post says, this one is both necessary and real and TRUTH!
It is extraordinary and should not be but is, how many times the universalists try to get their false teachings into everyplace to bring people down!
(IF that's what the purpose was in asking what the fire was in the post you replied to !)
Thanks!
And Jesus' Shalom to you and your household TODAY !
WHat kind of "Fire" can burn a "spirit"????
Yes in John:17:12 KJV Jesus, in reference to Judas Iscariot, says that of all his disciples, none has been lost except the "son of perdition". All who believe in Jesus are his disciples and they are also the elect.. ... The New International Version translates the phrase as "the one doomed to destruction." This verse refers both to Judas' character and to his destiny."EXCEPT"
First, we have to point out that all of it was explained earlier in the thread and now you are simply repeating the mistakes that we worked to clear away. So what is specifically wrong in your statement here?Don't have to. That's what TULIP teaches, plain as day.
We're Totally depraved, our "Election" is Unconditional (arbitrary), The Atonement is LIMITED to the Elect, God's grace is IRRESISTIBLE, and the Christian WILL PERSEVERE (OSAS).
What part of that is in error according to the "Reformed Paradigm"???
According to Calvin’s theology God’s expectations are impossible for the unelected to meet and this being in accordance to God’s sovereign plan ultimately makes God responsible for our unrepentant, sinful, and rebellious state since He is in control and obviously has the ability to enable everyone to repent and believe simply by bestowing grace upon them. It’s kind of like if God commanded everyone to fly to Alpha Centauri and said anyone who doesn’t make it there will be thrown into the lake of fire for all eternity. Then He gives some people a ride to Alpha Centauri in a spaceship and leaves the rest to make it there on their own. Is it just that those who were left behind are condemned to suffer for all eternity for not being capable of meeting this impossible expectation even tho there were more than enough seats on the ship that took the others there?
Now here’s the real situation, God has made a way for ALL to be saved. He provided the ship and allows EVERYONE to board it. The problem is some choose not to and as a result of their own choice they will seal their own fate on judgement day. Anyone who desires to repent will be enabled to do so by The Father.
“Opening his mouth, Peter said: "I most certainly understand now that God is not one to show partiality, but in every nation the man who fears Him and does what is right is welcome to Him.”
Acts 10:34-35 NASB
“to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life; but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation. There will be tribulation and distress for every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek, but glory and honor and peace to everyone who does good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. For there is no partiality with God. For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.”
Romans 2:7-16 NASB
Why?
It changes the character of God.
Be blessed.
Uh that English word Devouring in the Hebrew is the word Akal and it means to entirely consume.Great mystery, but Isaiah reveals what kind of FIRE can burn peoples.
Isaiah 33:v.12-14
12 And the people shall be as the burnings of lime: as thorns cut up shall they be burned in the FIRE.
13 Hear, ye that are far off (the Gentile peoples), what I have done; and, ye that are near, (the Jews) acknowledge my might.
14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?
As all here know, the everlasting Spirit of God is a devouring FIRE.
First you said I need to understand the Greek to be able to correctly interpret John 15 and now you suggest I find some random commentary on the Internet. I’m starting to think that you can’t interpret John 15 in a way that doesn’t contradict eternal security. I tried to and I couldn’t do it either.
No His character does not change, this is why bad theology should be rebuked.God's character doesn't change, only our perceptions of it as we study his word.
He isn't arbitrary and he isn't partial. Every human has the opportunity to believe and obey the gospel.
That is not what the bible says. Every human does not have the opportunity to believe. I disagree with this premise and consider it to be an unbiblical false teaching. God before the foundation of the world began chose whom he would save according to the whole counsel of his will. The only ones who are ever saved are those God predestined to be saved by his will, not some false teaching free-will doctrine. You are correct that God is not arbitrary nor is he partial. God never does anything without it being a part of his plan.God's character doesn't change, only our perceptions of it as we study his word.
He isn't arbitrary and he isn't partial. Every human has the opportunity to believe and obey the gospel.
yeah rebuke free will unto salvation because its a pagan doctrine that slipped in to the RCC long ago.No His character does not change, this is why bad theology should be rebuked.
Be blessed.
Yes in John:17:12 KJV Jesus, in reference to Judas Iscariot, says that of all his disciples, none has been lost except the "son of perdition". All who believe in Jesus are his disciples and they are also the elect.. ... The New International Version translates the phrase as "the one doomed to destruction." This verse refers both to Judas' character and to his destiny.
God allowed Judas to do what he did by His plan and purpose for Christ to go to the cross.
you are spewing your presupposition that unconditional election must be arbitrary and that is not what reformed theology teaches AT ALL, BOB. Once again, brother, you show you don't have a good grasp on reformed theology. You have arbitrarily added the word arbitrary.Don't have to. That's what TULIP teaches, plain as day.
We're Totally depraved, our "Election" is Unconditional (arbitrary), The Atonement is LIMITED to the Elect, God's grace is IRRESISTIBLE, and the Christian WILL PERSEVERE (OSAS).
What part of that is in error according to the "Reformed Paradigm"???
Uh that English word Devouring in the Hebrew is the word Akal and it means to entirely consume.
John 15 does not teach you don't have eternal security and John 15 is not the entire bible so synergists who take that chapter and create contradictions with the rest of the bible that is clear indication of eisegeting not exegeting the whole word of God. Scripture backs up scripture.
The most importat now is to know that the MAN of sin and son of perdition, a former Cherub, which will be enthroned in Jerusalem and will manifest himself as God, and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God, yea, this MAN was born decades ago, called Eliyahu. He will manifest himself very soon as messiah, an esoterical/spiritist/kabbalistic messiah, as a lamb, a false lamb, but speaks as Dragon.
2 Th.2:9-12
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
Be ready
OF COURSE He knew (Omniscience will do that for you). But that's not the question at all!! The question is: - Is the "U" (UNCONDITIONAL) in Reformed Theology an accurate presentation of God's CRITERIA, or not. Did He Thousands of years ago (according to reformed theology) Arbitrarily "Elect"/REJECT people based on NO CRITERIA , other than His personal decision at the time, or is there more involved?? Reformed Theology eliminates "Choice", since it's all been decided.
Yes that is what adbide means but we must see context as well. abide can also mean that you do so because of who you are positionally with God. Its like enduring to the end and you will be saved. Being saved drives one to endure or abide. The term does not support the idea that one can lose their salvation If they fail to abide because that would be possible with the new nature. Scripture backs scripture and there are so many verses in the bible that speak to the assurance of salvation its amazing.Romans 11:20-21
"Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you (baptized Christian) either."
John 15:6
"If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."
That word abide means to remain. Interesting that when Paul reminds Christians that their condition and position cannot be expected to be permanent, he uses the exact same analogy that Christ does about one being a branch that can be cast from the vine.
Hebrews 6:4-7
"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.
7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned."
You're right that scripture confirms itself.
These people he's referring to THOUGHT that they were Christians.
Matthew 7:21-23
“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’
That is not what the bible says. Every human does not have the opportunity to believe. I disagree with this premise and consider it to be an unbiblical false teaching.
According to his foreknowledge. There is no place in the scriptures where it says that he created every soul beforehand having chosen that it should be saved or not saved at that time. That is an absurd reading of Romans that cannot be supported by the text itself. The logical conclusion one has to draw from such an assertion is that there is absolutely no need whatsoever to preach the gospel. Not only is this patently unnecessary, the "good news" is no good news at all.God before the foundation of the world began chose whom he would save according to the whole counsel of his will.
The only ones who are ever saved are those God predestined to be saved by his will, not some false teaching free-will doctrine. You are correct that God is not arbitrary nor is he partial. God never does anything without it being a part of his plan.
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