why a service?

[blackribbon]

I didn't want to turn the prayer thread into discussion, so this one is open for any related topic.

Why is a service important? I think a poorly attended service is often sadder than none at all. A service is for the living, not the dead...and it usually turns out to be very expensive. My husband's was ~$11,000 and we really didn't get any "frills" beyond he was embalmed and put in a casket (his preference) - it was one of the bottom package deals.

I did pay for the VFW to play taps and do a 21 gun salute but that was less than $100...but I felt it was an important way to honor his military service and it was for our kids.

I am sure he will be cremated because it is cheaper and he will be able to be buried in a military graveyard. He will be marked and have a place to come visit him. There is probably a minimal graveside service also provided for anyone who wants to attend.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

You are correct. The service is for the living. It helps with the grieving I'm guessing.

My FIL was not embalmed (because it was extra and we were broke and he had no insurance) We got the cheapest casket they had back then (1991). They did do the 21 gun salute and he is buried in the Military cemetary, although I have never been to his gravesite.

My mom was cremated by her request.

My husband was also not embalmed (what's the point of that except to look at him being deceased?) and I think it was around 8,000 bucks in 2005 and thankfully we had insurance although I can still remember having to call each of my credit card companies to see what my balance was so I could tell them how much to charge on that card while all my relatives were sitting there. It was very humiliating. And my husband is buried right down the street, so he's close if I need him. He chose the place before he died thankfully. Oh and then I had to get his headstone which was almost 1,000. His mom and sister said they would help pay for it and didn't. And then my SIL complained, not to me, but to someone else, that SHE would have gotten a bigger stone and SHE woulda did this or that. I was GLAD she didn't contribute after I heard that.

 

[blackribbon]

I chose to embalm to meet the need of the people grieving. His visitation was several hours long and on a different day than his funeral to accommodate the schedules of his friends from work and his best friend flying in. I was told that his funeral procession was over 2 miles long and they had to call in extra police to manage it. (Police escort was $450 and probably should have been more based on the number of cops needed in the end). If I had my chance for a redo, I think I would have cremated him so I could taken him with me but I didn't have time to consider that. But he is where his family is most happy. I don't know if I would have given up the procession though...hearing those sirens as the various cops flew by and ungodly speeds was kind of exciting at something he would have enjoyed. I know my kids did.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

my husband died on Sunday and we didn't have the funeral until the following Saturday. I told the funeral people that my husband wanted us to view him before we took him out and they were all like "oh well we could have him ready for you to view on Tues, but since he's not getting embalmed, he might not look that good." I was like "look! I know he's dead OK? My husband wants me to make sure he looks OK and I am going to honor his request". So they set him up in the chapel and we went in there for a few minutes. Then they took him outside to the site and that was that. They acted like his face was going to be all eaten away or something and I know they keep them in the freezer so I had to challenge them.
BUT.....if we would have had a long viewing like my friend did (it was all day and she was apparently on ice the whole time) I would have had him embalmed.

 

[LilyMJ]

I'm sure there are many people who cared about him, if nothing else just in his military family. Just the logistics of getting them together may be a little tough though. You're right it might just be better not to have one. Sad.

He didn't seem to paint his ex-wife in a bad light, so I hope she is not the type of person who would not let the boys know and cause unnecessary drama elsewhere. I know she has got to be feeling very bad right now though.

All in all I just pray that his family can come together enough to get what needs to be done, done, so that the federal government doesn't have to do it up completely generic. I think he deserves a little better than that. And I pray that Dan really did know Jesus and that he has been reunited with his oldest son, and also that his younger boys will remember the good times with their dad and just how much he loved them.

 

[blackribbon]

His Marine brothers died the day he got injured. Four of them. If he is correct about making a bad decision that contributed to their death...or they believe he did, he might not have a lot of military "family" left. And even if they don't hold him responsible, many may not live in the same area anymore as they move forward with their lives.

As for his wife, she needs a lot of prayer. He did a lot to her. He went behind her back and recommitted for 4 more years without consulting her. That means she had 4 MORE years of solo parenting and living with the non-stop anxiety of waiting to have that person show up on her doorstep to say that "I am sorry to report....". Then he went and actually got injured...very badly. And four men that she also most likely cared for (along with their wives and families) had to be buried. And he was brain injured as well as suffering from extensive PSTD...either of which could be responsible for the violent temper that he came home with. And he physically hit her...to the point she went to the hospital...and everything traumatized her eldest boy to the point he killed himself.

It will be a long time ... if ever, before she forgives him even if she loves him. That is a lot. And as a loving mother, she really may decide that there has been enough death in her boys' live and postpone telling them...but she may not. I don't know but I'd understand either way. She may even feel some relief even if she loved him.

I liked Dan. I really do think that he suffered from some extreme injuries ... both physical and emotionally. I did believe that with help, he might have been able to slowly work or rebuilding his relationships and his life ... but he had dug himself a pretty deep hole and I don't know what areas of his brain were really injured. If it was the emotional center...he might have always been a bit dangerous and emotional labile. Who knows?

I do believe that Dan is with Jesus. I had an experience that makes me honestly believe it. Maybe I imagined it but I don't think I did. I believe he was a man worth helping and saving. And he is a man I will miss talking with. For someone so young, he had already lived a full life.

I really hope that the family can find forgiveness and understanding and come together over this sad event. And may the shadow of death leave them alone for a long time in the future.

Yes, a service would be nice...but really it is not that important in the whole scheme of things. The important thing is will anyone remember him...and which "Dan" will they remember.

 

[blackribbon]

I will say that after talking to Dan, I have started thinking very seriously about pursuing a job at the Veterans Hospital instead the big nice one close to home.

 

[exitstageright]

I didn't want to turn the prayer thread into discussion, so this one is open for any related topic.

Why is a service important? I think a poorly attended service is often sadder than none at all. A service is for the living, not the dead...and it usually turns out to be very expensive. My husband's was ~$11,000 and we really didn't get any "frills" beyond he was embalmed and put in a casket (his preference) - it was one of the bottom package deals.

I did pay for the VFW to play taps and do a 21 gun salute but that was less than $100...but I felt it was an important way to honor his military service and it was for our kids.

I am sure he will be cremated because it is cheaper and he will be able to be buried in a military graveyard. He will be marked and have a place to come visit him. There is probably a minimal graveside service also provided for anyone who wants to attend.

My father,when I was a teenager,told us that he did not want a fancy service. He said,"It is all just a show."

The irony is,that when actor has a funeral,that the funeral is called the "Actor's Last Show".

Everytime, that I am on stage .I perform as if is was my "Last Living Show."



Let the sideshow begin
Hurry, hurry, step right on in
Can't afford to pass it by
Guaranteed to make you cry

So let the sideshow begin (Hurry, hurry)
Hurry, hurry, step right on in
Can't afford to pass it by
Guaranteed to make you cry

Let the sideshow begin (Step right on in)
Hurry, hurry, step right on in
Can't afford to pass it by
Guaranteed to make you cry (Hurry, hurry)

Let the sideshow begin (Step right on in)

 

[bobross]

I will say that after talking to Dan, I have started thinking very seriously about pursuing a job at the Veterans Hospital instead the big nice one close to home.

I think that sounds like a wonderful plan, blackribbon. I imagine it would be very rewarding.

 

[bobross]

I have to say it's pretty amazing how much he was able to touch all of our lives in just a few short days. He will be missed.

I'm holding onto hope that he really did know Jesus in his heart and that the family is able to come to terms with this whole situation and move on with their lives, remembering mostly the good times.

 

[blackribbon]

I

My father,when I was a teenager,told us that he did not want a fancy service. He said,"It is all just a show."

A funeral shouldn't be "a show". It is a place to say good-bye. Life is about relationships and when someone dies, it is very hard on the living. This is the ultimate good-bye ... at least for while we are in our earthly bodies. If the deceased knew God, then they are really alive now. However, the rest of us are left with a rope that just dangles. We can no longer reach out and touch them... It is a great emptiness and void in our lives.

A funeral is a place to say good-bye and to let the people who loved them know that they mattered and will be missed. It is for the living and shouldn't just be an award ceremony for the dead.

My husband would have had a heart attack if he had known how expensive a funeral is....but I wouldn't have done it any different. The decisions I made were to meet the needs of the people who loved him. His brother helped me pick the coffin...it was a beautiful wooden one that reminded me of a beautiful gun cabinet....and that comparison made his brother smile. I buried him in one of his dad's shirts because I couldn't deal with his closet...turns out the one I picked was one of his dad's favorite shirts and that made him very happy. My father-in-law has a brother they have disowned and some family members tried to get him "banned" from the funeral. I said he could come and say good bye to his nephew. To my knowledge, he didn't come but sent a beautiful flower arrangement that had a big brass deer statue with it. I couldn't deal with all the plants so they stayed at my in-laws. 5 years later, that brass deer is still sitting on my in-laws fireplace mantle. You do not know how big it is that my FIL even allowed that in his house.

Funerals are a time to adjust our priorities and say our good-byes. They are a place to celebrate the lives of our loved one and remember them. I think they also should be a place where they are allowed to be remembers as they REALLY were and not turned into some false version of perfection. I guess my song choices really threw some people for a loop. I opened the service with "Thank God, I'm a country boy" by John Denver....my husband had loved that song in high school and I thought it really expressed who he was. I closed the service with "Jesus loves me" for my kids and found out that all the adults in the family ended up crying through that song because at one point his extended family used to close every big family gathering by singing that song. I never witnessed this in the years I was married to him. It was the ultimate closing to his life.

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

I didn't want to turn the prayer thread into discussion, so this one is open for any related topic.

Why is a service important? I think a poorly attended service is often sadder than none at all. A service is for the living, not the dead...and it usually turns out to be very expensive. My husband's was ~$11,000 and we really didn't get any "frills" beyond he was embalmed and put in a casket (his preference) - it was one of the bottom package deals.

I did pay for the VFW to play taps and do a 21 gun salute but that was less than $100...but I felt it was an important way to honor his military service and it was for our kids.

I am sure he will be cremated because it is cheaper and he will be able to be buried in a military graveyard. He will be marked and have a place to come visit him. There is probably a minimal graveside service also provided for anyone who wants to attend.

A funeral service for a Loved One is an optional way of giving honor to the Person and to celebrate their life, what they stood for, to bring all Loved Ones and Friends together at one location for support of one another and to remember the good things about the Deceased. I think this is all good. However, my personal experience with Funeral Home gatherings...is that it quickly turns into a Country Club atmosphere with people laughing , getting caught up on the family news because they haven't seen one another in some time, and/or looking forward to the Meal that often follows the funeral ceremony --- I find all that a tad disrespectful when done in the very presence of the Deceased and their immediate Family. The time for getting caught up on the News is at the meal table which is a far more appropriate venue.

Many choose to forego a typical Funeral Ceremony due to needing to save a lot of money. A simple Cremation in my locale runs $1,200 and if you go thru the County, I understand you can get the actual Cremation done at no cost and the only cost incurred are transportation costs from the Medical Examiner or Funeral Home to the Cremation site , plus cost of Urn if one is desired.

It is left up to the Loved One(s) to decide which they want or to fulfill the wishes of their Loved One who has passed . None of my family wants a formal Funeral Ceremony nor Service conducted due to the cost ; we wish to be remembered IN LIFE and not in the picture of death . Further, all of Us fully realize that a deceased person isn't a person any longer and his/her Shell of a Body is now empty , for, the Soul which is the real Person has moved onto an eternal existence . Therefore, we place no value with the Body ... but we choose to keep the Person 'alive' in our thoughts and memories for our time with them on earth...and we choose never to let that cease.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

I will remember Dan. But I know he is in a much better place now. I hope to meet him in eternity. Blackribbon, do you think maybe your husband was helping you pick things? Funny story...we didn't know for awhile IF my husband had life insurance or not and when he found out he DID have one times his annual salary 30,000, he said OK! Now DON'T spend it all on my funeral! And I remember thinking I would never spend that much on a funeral LOL

 

[dayhiker]

lol ... that is funny.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

To me, I don't think it makes any difference if you have an elaborate funeral or not, and I never fault anyone for not attending either. My husband's mother did not come to his funeral because her sister had died the day after my husband and she had been taking care of her sister so she stayed there and did that funeral. Her other kids were kind of miffed that she didn't come to her own son's funeral, but not me. My husband was the 3rd child that died. The other two were very young but being at or not being at someone's funeral does not define how much you loved or didn't love that person. They are gone! They are with the Lord hopefully if they knew him. They do not care about earthly matters any longer. I think it's sad that her other two kids hold this against her. I sure don't.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

A funeral service for a Loved One is an optional way of giving honor to the Person and to celebrate their life, what they stood for, to bring all Loved Ones and Friends together at one location for support of one another and to remember the good things about the Deceased. I think this is all good. However, my personal experience with Funeral Home gatherings...is that it quickly turns into a Country Club atmosphere with people laughing , getting caught up on the family news because they haven't seen one another in some time, and/or looking forward to the Meal that often follows the funeral ceremony --- I find all that a tad disrespectful when done in the very presence of the Deceased and their immediate Family. The time for getting caught up on the News is at the meal table which is a far more appropriate venue.

Many choose to forego a typical Funeral Ceremony due to needing to save a lot of money. A simple Cremation in my locale runs $1,200 and if you go thru the County, I understand you can get the actual Cremation done at no cost and the only cost incurred are transportation costs from the Medical Examiner or Funeral Home to the Cremation site , plus cost of Urn if one is desired.

It is left up to the Loved One(s) to decide which they want or to fulfill the wishes of their Loved One who has passed . None of my family wants a formal Funeral Ceremony nor Service conducted due to the cost ; we wish to be remembered IN LIFE and not in the picture of death . Further, all of Us fully realize that a deceased person isn't a person any longer and his/her Shell of a Body is now empty , for, the Soul which is the real Person has moved onto an eternal existence . Therefore, we place no value with the Body ... but we choose to keep the Person 'alive' in our thoughts and memories for our time with them on earth...and we choose never to let that cease.

And some Christians have these gatherings to celebrate that the deceased has graduated. And if people are catching up, why is that a bad thing and disrespectful? Wouldn't the deceased loved one approve even if it took their death to bring everyone together? Plus people need a release from the stress and anxiety of the death. Why wouldn't people catch up?

 

[blackribbon]

My husband's wake/visitation was EXACTLY what you described ... it was a family gathering and neither him or I would have had it any other way. The kids were playing tag a quiet form of tag around the side of room...our kids included. Many had drawn him pictures and written him letters which they left in his casket. I remember listening to the children during his ceremony and the saddest sound was listening to our 3 & 4 year old niece and nephew crying for him. (I don't think I have ever actually heard anyone that young crying for the loss at a funeral). It was a celebration of his life and family is life. I wanted to hear laughter and was glad that I did. I cannot imagine it any other way. Maybe it is just a "southern" thing but it is one of those things I love about that culture and his family. It wasn't about "respect", it was about "love".

 

[dayhiker]

My grandfather always said he didn't want a funeral. So none was planned.
But at the funeral home his daughter said she thought those of us that were left
here earth needed something, so she asked me to step to the podium at the funeral home to lead it. Well, I did, but since I had nothing prepared there wasn't much to it.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

Black I hear ya, my little son was only 7 when his daddy died and the older one was almost 11. My younger one cried so hard during the ceremony it was heartbreaking. He also told me he wanted to wear a suit, which of course I obliged. Afterward we went back to our house and had food that the lovely ladies of our church provided and like you said the kids were all running around. And it was so surreal because at the funeral while we were under the covering during the funeral it poured rain! Then it quit before the funeral ended, and then when we went home it hailed! and then it snowed! and we live in AZ it don't snow here except once in a million years so the kids had a blast with all that. The hailstones were almost golf ball size. We played music because we have a lot of musicians in our group and laughed at old memories, AND caught up with each other. I needed that.

 

[exitstageright]

I

A funeral shouldn't be "a show". It is a place to say good-bye. Life is about relationships and when someone dies, it is very hard on the living. This is the ultimate good-bye ... at least for while we are in our earthly bodies. If the deceased knew God, then they are really alive now. However, the rest of us are left with a rope that just dangles. We can no longer reach out and touch them... It is a great emptiness and void in our lives.

A funeral is a place to say good-bye and to let the people who loved them know that they mattered and will be missed. It is for the living and shouldn't just be an award ceremony for the dead.

My husband would have had a heart attack if he had known how expensive a funeral is....but I wouldn't have done it any different. The decisions I made were to meet the needs of the people who loved him. His brother helped me pick the coffin...it was a beautiful wooden one that reminded me of a beautiful gun cabinet....and that comparison made his brother smile. I buried him in one of his dad's shirts because I couldn't deal with his closet...turns out the one I picked was one of his dad's favorite shirts and that made him very happy. My father-in-law has a brother they have disowned and some family members tried to get him "banned" from the funeral. I said he could come and say good bye to his nephew. To my knowledge, he didn't come but sent a beautiful flower arrangement that had a big brass deer statue with it. I couldn't deal with all the plants so they stayed at my in-laws. 5 years later, that brass deer is still sitting on my in-laws fireplace mantle. You do not know how big it is that my FIL even allowed that in his house.

Funerals are a time to adjust our priorities and say our good-byes. They are a place to celebrate the lives of our loved one and remember them. I think they also should be a place where they are allowed to be remembers as they REALLY were and not turned into some false version of perfection. I guess my song choices really threw some people for a loop. I opened the service with "Thank God, I'm a country boy" by John Denver....my husband had loved that song in high school and I thought it really expressed who he was. I closed the service with "Jesus loves me" for my kids and found out that all the adults in the family ended up crying through that song because at one point his extended family used to close every big family gathering by singing that song. I never witnessed this in the years I was married to him. It was the ultimate closing to his life.

I think that those two songs were appropiate for your late husband's funeral. Now,on the other hand,when we kids were acting up,our mother would say," You all are doing nothing but preaching your funeral."

She was so right. As I have gotten older,I have gone to more funerals.What I have said about the deceased are the same things that others have said. No one talks about how much money the deceased made,what kind of house he or she lived in,and or what kind of car the person drove. However,everyone,including myself,talked about how that person influenced our lives. People will talk about how you lived your life. For example,when I was a child,I told my parents that I wanted to be a scientist,when I grew up. My parents did not respond. But,when I told Deacon H. that,he said,"You can be anything that you want to be,if you try hard enough." I needed that encouragement. His family,after the funeral,told me that they really appriciated the kind words that I had spoken about their loved one,and how he encouraged me to become a scientist.
By the way,in Jesus' time,there would be Professional Criers or Grievers at a funeral if the deceased had no relatives. This was a Hebrew custom.

So,one cannot "order" a good funeral. If one wants to have a good funeral,one has to................live it.