Who is the first Christian to deny the Primacy of Peter or his successors?

[Fireinfolding]

I was going to answer Paul, due to Galations 2.

It was 14 years before Paul ever went to talk to Peter. He says in verse 6 that people who seem to be of high reputation make no difference to him, and those who were of reputation contributed nothing to me.

Then it seems from verse 9 that there are two main apostles, Peter (for the Jews) and Paul (for the Gentiles).
But then Paul opposes Peter in verse 11. So again, I would answer Paul was the first to deny the primacy of Peter.

Then I realized that in Paul's time, the Primacy of Peter hadn't been invented.

I said something to that effect earlier the first to reject the primacy of Peter and was laughed at but I see its TRUE, WHO IS CEPHAS?? Paul said, one SAITH I FOLLOW CEPHAS (he was like "big deal") even as it pertains to HIMSELF (another saith) I FOLLOW PAUL lol then discerns their condition AS CARNAL (in their divisions) Dividing on so called HOLY MEN IS CARNAL thats what I get a chuckle over.

But yeah I see the same thing, the invention of it wasnt even there, excellent point.

 

[chestertonrules]

You've got a point, Tonks. It does rather remind you of James and John wanting to be first and Christ reminding them that to be first means to be the servant of all--in other words, to be first isn't a position of power, it is a position of being the servant of all. In other words, to be first in God's Kingdom is totally different than it is here on earth, where to be king is to have everyone serving you.

Peter matters because without him Jesus knew that the Church would not be unified. He established a hierarchy so that we could be united.

Once you deny this any matter of doctrines and practices becomes possible.

That's why there are thousands of denominations outside of the Catholic Church.

 

[chestertonrules]

Not a trick question, just curious. I don't know the answer.

Lots of spinning and theories, but still no answer.

 

[RND]

Lots of spinning and theories, but still no answer.

There have been plenty of answers. I would say that God Himself rejected Peter as head of the church.

 

[Unashamed Jesus Freak]

There have been plenty of answers. I would say that God Himself rejected Peter as head of the church.

Yes, there have been plenty of answers, just not the ones they like.

 

[Hentenza]

Peter matters because without him Jesus knew that the Church would not be unified. He established a hierarchy so that we could be united.

Once you deny this any matter of doctrines and practices becomes possible.

That's why there are thousands of denominations outside of the Catholic Church.

LOL!!! Thanks for your opinion. Peter is not the head of the church. Christ is. Peter is not the vicar of Christ. He never made such a boast.

 

[Fireinfolding]

Jesus gave Peter primacy and Paul never denied it. In fact, he spent 15 days with Peter learning about the faith.

Paul said otherwise though Chestertonrules

Gal 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

Gal 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Gal 1:15-17 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood: Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus. Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days. But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother.

 

[RND]

He established a hierarchy so that we could be united.

Who? Peter or Jesus?

Once you deny this any matter of doctrines and practices becomes possible.

Listen to a sinful man as final arbiter of doctrine that claims ti be infallible? Seriously you jest.

That's why there are thousands of denominations outside of the Catholic Church.

These "thousands of denominations outside of the Catholic Church" are more united with Rome and doctrine than you realize.

Just take Sunday for instance. Rome claims by her power she changed Sunday sacredness and the whole world follows her lead. Her positions on death, hell, the sabbath and other things have been accepted by most of Christianity when scripture clearly speaks differently.

 

[Hentenza]

Lots of spinning and theories, but still no answer.

They question really should be, when did your church made such a claim first.

 

[Fireinfolding]

I forgot to add that Peter also confirms Paul and speaks of the wisdom GOD has given him (not He himself has given him)

 

[Timothew]

Peter matters because without him Jesus knew that the Church would not be unified. He established a hierarchy so that we could be united.

Once you deny this any matter of doctrines and practices becomes possible.

That's why there are thousands of denominations outside of the Catholic Church.

I know just what you mean, there are thousands of denominations outside of the Baptist Church, too.

 

[Fireinfolding]

LOL!!! Thanks for your opinion. Peter is not the head of the church. Christ is. Peter is not the vicar of Christ. He never made such a boast.

Yes is says...

Ephes 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

He espoused them to one husband, one head, to Christ not another.

Acts 20:30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.

 

[Unashamed Jesus Freak]

More Scripture!

 

[Fireinfolding]

More Scripture!

Yeah, let every man be a liar and God be true even as Paul said

Prov 30:6 Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.

Rev 2:2... thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Justified by his sayings

 

[Unashamed Jesus Freak]

Fireinfolding, please feel free to post as much Scripture as your little heart contends.

 

[lighthouse_hope]

Aren't you abusing the length of the signature line?

 

[Unashamed Jesus Freak]

No, I'm a site supporter. As far as I'm aware, there is no limit on the length of signature. If I am told by staff that I have extended (not abused) the limit, I will then shorten my signature.

 

[MrPolo]

Fireinfolding, please feel free to post as much Scripture as your little heart contends.

May I also chime in with more fun?

Matthew 10:2 The names of the twelve apostles are these: first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zeb'edee, and John his brother...​

Now in the Greek in which Matthew was originally written, the word there for first is "protos" (also written πρῶτος in Greek). That word refers to first in time, place, rank or honor. According to John 1:40-42 that Peter was not the first Apostle to follow Jesus in time. And we know Peter is not a "place." So the term likely refers to Peter having a first rank or honor.

 

[lighthouse_hope]

Life is more than rules. Care to imagine what would happen if everybody did the same?

 

[Unashamed Jesus Freak]

If you don't like the length of my signature, you do have the option of turning the signatures off. God bless.