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Truth Files

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Ezekiel
38:2 Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him

38:17 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Art thou he of whom I have spoken in old time by my servants the prophets of Israel, which prophesied in those days many years that I would bring thee against them?

+ The Lord addresses "gog" in Ezekiel 38 and 39 with respect to Israel's return to the land of Israel at the end of this current age. The vision begins by addressing satan and his early involvement with the post flood inhabitants of the land area of Magog, son of Japheth, and his brothers. [Genesis 10:1-2]

Careful study of Ezekiel's vision and other related scriptures are necessary in order to identify gog [satan] and his involvement with humanity over a very broad time frame.

This includes his connection to both the spirit world, human kings, and the human organizations contained within the dominions of the human kings and their kingdoms.

There are some identifiers and other links to be considered which will lead to the realization that gog is not human. This entity has angelic characteristics which can be determined by studying the identifiers and the links given in scripture.

Gog is identified by other biblical prophets as being connected with different human rulers, in different geographical areas, at different times, over periods which exceed the limitations of human life span. [Ezekiel 38:17]

The Lord's angelic creatures do not age and are the same today as they were at their creation in the beginning. This angelic trait allows for perpetual involvement over vast time periods. [Job 38:4-7; Ezekiel 28:11-19; Revelation 20:1-3]

He notes that gog is a subject of many of the prophets, yet he is referred to as "gog" in only one other place in scripture .... in the 20th chapter of the book of Revelation. This must mean that he is identified by different profiles and agencies in the visions of the other prophets. [Ezekiel 38:17]

All other references refer to him or his agents by some other name or title. For example, Daniel sees the "prince that is to come" [Abaddon-Apollyon] in the little horn [a human king]. Both of these entities will be empowered and directed by satan. [Daniel 7:7; 8:9-12; 8:25-25; 11:36-45; 12:7; Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 17:8]

Gog is described as the chief angelic prince, in this case, of Mesheck and Tubal [the early post flood settlements of Magog's brothers]. The term "prince" is generally applied to an angelic ruler in prophetic scripture who rules over, influences, and operates through human kings [horns]. [Ezekiel 38:2]

The term "chief prince" indicates that gog is the ruler or leader of others of the same kind. The Hebrew word "rosh" used for "chief" is not in reference to "Russia" as some teach, but should be translated as "chief" or "head" prince. [Revelation 12:3-4; 12:9]

The title of "prince" is revealed to Daniel in describing angelic activity related to the archangel Michael's battle against the opposing forces of the princes of Persia and of Grecia. [Daniel 10:13-20]

The title of prince is used by the Lord when addressing the human king of Tyre. The message goes beyond the king to another entity [satan] who apparently has interaction and control over the king. [Ezekiel 28:11-19]

Isaiah contains references addressed to the prince of Babylon and to Lucifer. These are descriptions of satan's existence as an angelic being and his connection and influence with humanity. [Isaiah 14:12-17]

The angelic prince that "shall come" will be revealed at the end of this age during Israel's 70th week [the tribulation period of the Lord's coming judgment]. Daniel contrasts this entity with the Lord, the Messiah, the Prince that was "cut off". [Daniel 9:26-27]

This prince will stand against [oppose] the Prince of Princes, who is the Lord Jesus Christ. The result of the conflict will be the destruction of this prince [first beast of Revelation] in the lake of fire at Armageddon. [Revelation 19:20]

Other references to satan and his agents in the visions of the prophets include the Assyrian, prince of Persia, prince of Grecia, the beast, Abaddon-Apollyon [angelic king of the abyss] the destroyer, the man of lawlessness, and son of perdition. [Micah 5; Daniel 10; Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 13:1, 17:8; 2Thessalonians 2:3-12]

Satan plays the role of "chief prince" when his angelic agents are functional. He is the power behind them as they do his bidding on the earth in relation to the influence and control of human kings and their dominions. [Ezekiel 38:2; Revelation 12:3-12; 13:1-2; 17:8]

Abaddon-Appolyon is satan's [gog's] angelic agent for all seven heads [human dominions, kingdoms, and related human king positions] as they are defined in Revelation 13 and 17. He is the beast from the abyss .... the first beast of Revelation. [Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 17:8]

It is clearly stated that this "beast" [Abaddon-Apollyon] has seven heads [kingdoms]. Five have fallen [are historical], and the other two will exist in sequence during the 70th week decreed for Israel ... the Lord's hour of trial and the time of "Jacob's trouble". [Jeremiah 30; Revelation 3:10; 17:7-13]

Abaddon-Apollyon's connection with the seven human king "positions" is limited to influence and control. He is "of the seven" and is connected with all of them.

This limitation will change when the Lord allows him to become the eighth king himself by an actual incarnation. This is the "lie" and strong delusion that the Lord will send against an unbelieving world [2Thessalonians 2].

It will occur during the little horn's [human king's] rule in the seventh king "position". "Of the seven" can also be translated "of the seventh" which more specifically describes Abaddon-Apollyon's connection with the little horn at the time of the end. [Revelation 17:11]

He will then become the 8th king himself. This manifestation will be exceptionally unique to humans who experience his presence. [2Thessalonians 2:3-12]

The little horn will expand his sixth Middle Eastern dominion toward the south, the east, and toward Israel by forming alliances and by conquest. [Daniel 8:9; 8:23-25; 11:36-44]

He will be occupying the seventh king position of his seventh dominion when Abaddon-Apollyon becomes the eighth king himself by incarnating [possessing] the little horn. [Revelation 17:11]

Abaddon-Apollyon will rule directly as an angelic king over most of the Middle East for a 42 month period [1,260 days] which will occur during the last half of the 70th week decreed for Israel. [Daniel 11:36-45; 12:7]

This entity will have an astounding presence and those who follow him will worship him as a god. His presence wil be like nothing that humans have experienced in the past.

This angelic beast wll be destroyed by the Lord in the lake of fire at the end of the next 30 day period, and satan will be captured and sent to the abyss for 1,000 years. [Daniel 12:11-12; Revelation 19:20, 20:1-3]

Revelation 20 also records satan's future release after the 1,000 years and his attempt to deceive the nations once again. He is referred to as "gog" again, and all of the nations involved are referred to symbolically as "Magog". [Revelation 20:7-10]

The Lord addresses satan as gog in Ezekiel and Revelation because of his early connections with the inhabitants of the land of Magog shortly after the flood.

The focus of Bible prophecy presents the view of satan's activities specifically in the northern regions of the Middle East [upper Tigris River basin]. [Ezekiel 38:15; Micah 5:5-6]

I believe this is because of the area's position in relation to Eden, Mount Ararat, and its northern interface with the land of Israel. There have been no valid archeological discoveries related to these inhabitants of the immediate post flood era so we must rely upon the scriptures for identification

The larger land areas of the early habitations of humans in the Middle East shortly after the flood are described in the Bible as the land of Egypt, the land of Canaan, the land of Magog, and the land of Shinar.

These lands formed a crescent shape from the Mediterranean to the Persian Gulf starting with the land of Egypt and ending with the land of Shinar [southern Babylonia] in clockwise order.

The land of Israel was developed later which replaced part of the land of Canaan on the eastern seaboard of the Mediterranean.

The general area of the ancient land of Magog today includes parts of northeastern Syria, eastern Turkey, northern Iraq, northwestern Iran, and Armenia and Georgia.

It is currently inhabited by a mixed group of original ethnic tribal ancestry plus genetic lineage from the other land areas of the Middle East.

The current populations located in the original ancient land of Magog are mainly Turkoman, Assyrian, Kurdish, Iranian [Medes and Persians], and Arab. The predominant religion is Islam. This common theology will have significance with regard to the coming end time events. [Psalms 83; Ezekiel 38]

This is the geographical area where satan's beast [Abaddon-Apollyon incarnated in the little horn] will arise to power in the Middle East at the beginning of the time of the end of this present age .... ten other kings will rise with him. [Daniel 7:19-20; 8:9-12; 8:23-25; Revelation 13:1, 17:12-18]

Why does the Lord addressed satan as gog, connect him with the land of Magog, and identify him as the chief prince of Mesheck and Tubal?

Why does the Lord call him out of his place in the northern Middle East to attack a regathered Israel in the land of Israel at the end of this age?

The Lord has allowed satan to rule over this northern geographical area, from shortly after the flood and continuously through Greek rule just before the first century.

The visions of the prophets indicate his presence in the same geographical area at the time of the end. Included are the original land of Magog, the Akkadian/Assyrian Empire, and the subsequent empires of neo-Babylon, Persia, and Grecia.

All of these human dominions were centered in the ancient Middle East with connections to the northern area of the fertile crescent. This same area will be satan's base of operation at the time of the end.

His human agents will come from his place out of the north, the ancient area of the land of Magog [northern Iraq], with the objective of gaining control of the Middle East and destroying the nation of Israel.

Satan's strategy for this event will include Abaddon-Apollyon, the false prophet who will appear in the land of Israel, and the little horn who will become the human manifestation of Abaddon-Apollyon.

The little horn is seen in the visions coming out of the same land area of the northern division of Alexander's ancient divided empire at the time of the end. There is a breach in the scope of the visions from the ending of the ancient Syrio/Babylonian domination and the beginning of the little horn's appearance at the time of the end. He will expand his control over most of the Middle East. [Daniel 8:9-12, 8:23-25]

The important identifier will be the location of his original base of operation at the time of the end, and not necessarily his ethnic origin. He does not have to be a direct descendant of Magog, although this is a possibility, but he must appear in the area of the ancient land of Magog. [Ezekiel 38, 39]

Satan is the "chief angelic prince", as indicated in one of his former relationships with the ancient trading centers of Mesheck and Tubal. Magog's younger brothers were the founders of these two early and prominent commercial centers of trade. [Ezekiel 27:13; 38:2]

The Lord addresses satan as gog in Ezekiel 38 and satan is called gog again in Revelation 20. The ancient land of Magog in the Middle East has been and will be satan's point of origin and focus upon the earth at the time of the end during the coming tribulation period. He will be released again after 1,000 years to cause another human rebellion and then he will be destroyed in the Lord's lake of fire.
 

Biblewriter

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Gog is “of the land of Magog.” Josephus said that Magog founded the Magogites, but that the Greeks called them Scythians. The Scythians were a well known nomadic tribe in what is now called Russia. So we know Gog will come from Russia.

There is a problem in the translation of the next phrase. The Hebrew word rosh means top, or chief. (word number 7218 in Strong’s Hebrew Dictionary) If we assume this is only a word, the proper translation is “chief prince of Meshech and Tubal.” If, however, rosh is a name, the proper translation is, as given in our translation, “prince of Rosh, Meshech, and Tubal.” The various translations are divided on this point, some giving one reading, some the other. Some might ask, was the R a capital letter, indicating a name? But ancient Hebrew did not have capital and small letters. We know the ancient Jews considered this a name from the Septuagint, a Hebrew translation of the scriptures into Greek, believed to date from the second century B.C. In The Septuagint, the word was transliterated into Ros, as opposed to translation it into chief. From ancient times to the present, it has always been standard practice to transliterate names, rather than to translate them.

It is well known that this is commonly thought to mean Russia. But is this correct? It was taught as early as the mid fifth century. I had long heard this was commonly believed in Russia, so I decided to test it on a Russian I once knew. The man was not someone who would have had any prior instruction in the meaning of this passage. He was, in fact, an atheistic engineer trained in communist universities in the former USSR. I handed him a Russian Bible opened to this passage and asked him to read it and tell me in English what it said. He read it thus: “See, I am against you, oh Gogae, uh– uh– second step.” I asked, “prince?” he answered, “Yes.” He continued reading, “prince of Russia, Meshchovsk, and Tobolsk.” I asked, “Russia, is that what it says?” He answered, “Well, no, not exactly, but that’s what it means.” Then he wrote on a slip of paper the word “Rosh” and said “people.” He then wrote “Rosha” and said “country.” He was therefore saying that it called Gog the “prince of the people of Russia.” It is interesting that without hesitation he read Meshech as Meshchovsk and Tubal as Tobolsk.

Meshech and Tubal are a study in themselves. They are often seen in ancient writings and are almost always mentioned together. On the basis of ancient Greek and Persian accounts, modern historians believe the Moschi (the Greek form of Meshech) lived near the Black Sea, just north of Armenia and a short distance south of the Caucasus Mountains. Ptolemy’s atlas shows the Mosthici Mountains in this area.

These mountains are now called the Moschii Mountains, or sometimes the Suram Mountains. The “Barrington Atlas of the Greek and ·Roman World” shows them as the Moschici Mountains. It also shows them inhabited by the “Moschoi.” This area is now in Caucasian Georgia. (Not the American Georgia, but part of the Commonwealth of Independent States, the former USSR.) In 1944 the Soviet government deported approximately 100,000 Moslem “Meskhi” from this region to distant parts of the USSR for fear they would side with Turkey in a war.

But Josephus said Meshech was the Cappadocians. As noted above, modern historians favor the Greek and Persian accounts. But ancient Christians considered Josephus very reliable. How could both Josephus and the Greek and Persian writers be correct about where these people lived?

Cappadocia originally stretched all the way to the Mosthici Mountains. It therefore originally extended from southern Turkey to the area where the Greek and Persian writers located the Moschi. Pontus, which lay between these two nations at the time of Josephus, was not a different race. It had been created for political reasons from the northern part of Cappadocia. Thus we see that these two nations have a common root. If this were the case, it would have been only natural for Josephus to name the largest branch of the race, that is, Cappadocia, even though the name Meshech was better preserved in a different place.

But this raises the question, how did these people end up in Russia? Cappadocia remained a nation until the Moslem invasion in the mid to late eleventh century. During this period the Moslems conquered almost all of modern day Turkey, Armenia, and Georgia. The inhabitants were forced to convert to Islam or face intolerable persecution. This caused widespread panic and most of the population fled to foreign lands. The name Moscow first appears in Russian history about a hundred years later, as an entry for the year 1147 in “The Nikonian Chronicle.” This chronicle was written in the years 1520-1550. It lists the Meschera as a tribe living along the Oka River, which passes about 60 miles south of Moscow. “The Russian Primary Chronicle,” written in 1116, lists the tribes in this area, but this name is not included. The absence of any form of the name Meshech from a description of this area made at approximately the time of the Moslem invasion, coupled with its appearance soon after, strongly suggests that Moschi refugees from Cappadocia and Pontus settled there. Their name is still preserved in this area by the name Meshchovsk.

Josephus also wrote that Tubal was the Iberians. From this we would naturally conclude that Tubal was Spain and Portugal, as it is commonly known that these two nations occupy the Iberian Peninsula. But in ancient times there was another Iberia, which can be plainly seen in Ptolemy’s atlas and the Barrington Atlas. This nation was between Armenia and the Caucasus Mountains, northeast of the Moschi in present day Georgia. The name Tubal is preserved to this day in the name Tbilisi, the capitol of Georgia. As the Russian city Tobolsk was not founded until the middle of the sixteenth century, it is quite possible that refugees from the Moslem invasion of Georgia settled in this region, becoming the source of the name of Tobolsk. Thus we understand that Meshech and Tubal are very possibly the root stocks of the peoples around Moscow and Tobolsk. Even if this is not correct, Meshech and Tubal definitely fled to locations within the borders of the present day Commonwealth of Independent States, the former USSR.

Armenia claims to be the house of Togarmah. This is recorded in detail in “The History of the Armenians,” written by Moses of Khronosis only fifty years after the development of the Armenian alphabet. Armenia was once much larger than it is today. When everyone was being forced to convert to Islam or face persecution, most Armenians fled to other lands. Many medieval Armenian manuscripts were copied in various places along the northern shores of the Black Sea, in the region of present day Ukraine.

Many think Gomer is Germany, but Josephus clearly identified Gomer as the Galatians. From this we might think Gomer is Turkey, as Galatia is well known as a province in Asia Minor. But Galatia was so called because it was a settlement of Gauls. Further, Biblical Gomer was called Gamer in Armenia. The Assyrians called this people the Gamerraaa and described them sufficiently to identify them as the people whom the Greeks called Cimmerians. It is common knowledge that the Gauls were descended from the Cimmerians. Today, this people group is called Celts or Kelts.

As to the others, the name of Persia persisted into the twentieth century, when it was changed to Iran. And the names Ethiopia and Libya continue to the present day.

From all this we can safely conclude that Gog is from the land of the Scythians, that is, present day Russia. And that Rosh, Mesech, and Tubal all refer to Russia or to lands dominated by Russia. Gog’s associates include Ethiopia, Libya, Iran, Armenia, and the Celtic peoples (most of western Europe, including the British Isles, with their North American and Australian descendants).
 
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The Lord's Word tells you who gog is and I am presenting it for understanding [Ezekiel 38:17]

Other prophets who refer to the same do not use "gog" in their descriptions, but all of them expose the one who is behind those who have and will attack Israel during the coming 70th week decreed for the nation

The Lord addresses and exposes satan as the one and in this particular passage of scripture satan's attack will result in his defeat at Armageddon at the end of the coming tribulation period

Satan [gog] will then be imprisoned in the abyss where he cannot deceive the nations of the Lord's coming millennial kingdom which will be established immediately after Armageddon

The term "gog" is then used to identify Satan and those who will follow him when he causes a second human rebellion upon his release 1000 years later from the abyss at the end of the Lord's millennial kingdom .... the term "magog" is used again to symbolize human rebellion against the Lord

Only a fallen angelic can live over vast time lapse and continue to interfere with humanity

Gog is Satan who stands behind his angelic rebels and related human kings, and rules as the "god" of this present world [Isaiah 12; Ezekiel 28 Revelation 13:1-4]
 
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granpa

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Gog might be associated with the gigantes or more likely with Gyges (a 100 hander)

Hekatonkheires - Religion-wiki

The Hekatonkheires, or Hecatonchires (pronounced:ˌhɛkətəŋˈkaɪriːz; Greek: Ἑκατόγχειρες "Hundred-Handed Ones," Latinized Centimani), were figures in an archaic stage of Greek mythology, three giants of incredible strength and ferocity, that surpasses that of all of Titans whom they helped overthrow. Their name derives from the Ancient Greek ἑκατόν (hekaton; "hundred") and χείρ (kheir; "hand"), "each of them having a hundred hands and fifty heads" (Bibliotheca).

Their names were Briareus Βριαρεύς the Vigorous, also called Aigaion Αἰγαίων (Latinized as Aegaeon) the "sea goat", Cottus Κόττος the Striker or the Furious, and Gyges Γύγης (or Γύης Gyes) the Big-Limbed.
 
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Biblewriter

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prince of Ti-ras, Meshech, and Tubal (spain, france, and italy)

Magog is india.

'Gog' is therefore the spiritually 'black' aryan leader of rome.

(notice that javan is left out)

Where did you get the ideas that Ti-ras is Spain, Meshech is France, And Tubal is Italy?

I devoted literally years to the study of the ancient history of these nations, not in books about prophecy, but in the actual ancient literature itself, and never once came across even one reference that would support any of these ideas.
 
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granpa

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just followed the migration routes.
we know the sons of japet started out near the black sea and reached greece at the time of javan

tubal, meshech, and tiras came after javan.

tiras matches Tartessos which is in spain, which is the logical place for their migration to end.
 
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John S

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Spain and Portugal and their "children" (Central and South America), France, and Italy, are 3 of the Tribes of Israel.
In my opinion, Italy is the Tribe of Dan, which is listed in Genesis Chapter 49 but NOT in the Book of Revelations because the antichrist will come from Dan. He, along with the false prophet (the Pope?), will rule from the city of 7 hills - Rome, Italy.
 
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yeshuasavedme

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The table of nations in the Book of Jasher, chapter 10, is more detailed than the redacted version of Genesis.

 
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John S

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In my opinion, the antichrist will bring about 6 years of worldwide peace.
In the 7th year, known as the "Day of the Lord", God will destroy that peace. The country (Russia) that invades Israel will be annihilated. This will be followed by an invasion by China(?). This will lead to Armageddon.
 
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dana b

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Excuse me if this is not American Church politically correct, but Gog and Magog have already invaded. They are the Askenazis who are Japheth's kids from Gog. Look in any old Biblical textbook and you will see that Magog is in Russia just above the Caucase Mountains. That is where the Kazars converted enmass to Judaism in the 7th Century.

In the last few years more than a million of them have indeed invaded the land of Jerusalem from the North-East. It has nothing to do with the Russian Orthodox Christians!
 
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Biblewriter

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This is supposition. The information I gave in post 2 of this thread is the result of literally years of study of ancient books, records, monuments, and maps. After my studies were completed, I checked my conclusions against the opinions of modern historians, and found that they coincided 100%.
 
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trumpeter

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Excellent recomendation to search the OT prophets for the idenity of Gog from the land of Magog.He certainly is not the Khazars or Russia.
 
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