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ok.. why did Abraham do that?Um, Lord Lord has nothing to do with Abraham speaking to 2 personhoods.
I don't know the answer to that one... it is like how many does it take to make "us" in the beginning?
ok.. why did Abraham do that?
I think you need to learn the origin of Genesis and ancient Hebrew theology. Yahweh was originally part of the Ugaritic pantheon. He was the God of Israel, but one of many gods worshiped by the ancient Hebrews at the time. (They were polytheistic originally). The "us" being referred to is most likely referring to this pantheon of Caananite gods. It was incorporated into the Tanakh by the Hebrews as their theology progressed and they sought to eliminate the other gods, leaving only Yahweh.
Ugarit and the Bible
El was the chief god at Ugarit. Yet El is also the name of God used in many of the Psalms for Yahweh; or at least that has been the presupposition among pious Christians. Yet when one reads these Psalms and the Ugaritic texts one sees that the very attributes for which Yahweh is acclaimed are the same for which El is acclaimed. In fact, these Psalms were most likely originally Ugaritic or Canaanite hymns to El which were simply adopted by Israel, much like the American National Anthem was set to a beer hall tune by Francis Scott Key. El is called the father of men, creator, and creator of the creation. These attributes are also granted Yahweh by the Old Testament.
Other deities worshipped at Ugarit were El Shaddai, El Elyon, and El Berith. All of these names are applied to Yahweh by the writers of the Old Testament. What this means is that the Hebrew theologians adopted the titles of the Canaanite gods and attributed them to Yahweh in an effort to eliminate them. If Yahweh is all of these there is no need for the Canaanite gods to exist! This process is known as assimilation.
I hope you don't believe that rubish.
I thought it was pretty interesting myself
I highly doubt that God would allow no distinction in the "us"... especially since He is very animate about "other gods" before Him... The "us" of Genesis is told by Moses who got his story directly from God Himself.
I hope you don't believe that rubish.
My bro Paul agrees with thatOne man's trash is another man's treasure.
How is that? Wouldn't that be saying that The Father is the Son and the Holy Spirit? If so wouldn't that be denying the trinity?He spoke to all three, when you address God you address everyone; the father, the son and the spirit.
Hi everyoneHow is that? Wouldn't that be saying that The Father is the Son and the Holy Spirit? If so wouldn't that be denying the trinity?
Hmm! I don't know. The angel seems to have appeared within the flame because it says appeared in a flame.At first the scripture say "the angel of the LORD" - messenger of God (v2) but then when Moses turned aside to see God called unto him. So was the angel (messenger) sent to start the "flame of fire" to get Moses' attention so God could/would speak to him?
Exodus 3:4 . . . . God called unto him out of the midst of the bush. . . . .
3:6. . .I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. . . . .
Will you please identify the Us in Genesis 1:26? Thanks. I think it is the trinity and not God and something else besides God which would include the two other Memebers of the trinity. The Septuagint transcript changes the Us to He, I think.Well, since Moses is part of the Old Testament, there was no such thing in the Tanakh regarding any Trinity or Jesus, so the only scriptural conclusion is God.
So my question is Who was Jesus' Father? I thought the Scripture clearly says that God the Father is in Luke 1. Isn't that correct? Did Jesus only become the Son of God after His birth? Remember many things were a mystery (not revealed) before the NC came into existence.That was a vision not reality although it is a forgone conclusion that both Moses and Elijah will be in God's Kingdom when Christ returns.
Actually He was not the Son of God yet He was the Word, the one that was with God and was also God from eternity.
I'm sorry but I need much more to understand what you're saying.When you consider the narrative through the lens of the NT, it seems clear that it was the Son. The Lord - kurios, the "IAM" - ego eimi. These titles are assumed by Jesus Christ and it seems clear that the application of the titles to Him Himself shows that it was indeed Him in the OT.
Really? That is interesting. I would ask why do you say this?The trinity has nothing to do with this.
Where? I donlt see any Scripture. At least your statement acknowledges that Jesus isn't The Father.Jesus told us that no one had ever seen the Father or heard His voice.
The Word, the Spoksman of the godhead, was the one dealing with the people of the OT.[/qupte]I'm looking for some Scripture to basck this up. Do you have any? I don't see them.Where is this? John 8:58? If so please explain the statement made there. I think this is merely a statement that He existed then and not saying that He is the I AM THAT I AM. Quite a difference there.Jesus claimed to be the I Am of the OT and is said to be that Rock that followed them in the wilderness.Great then you must have some Scripture to support this indoctrination. Or didn't they teach sabbath school from the Bible? It is possible.This is sabbath school stuff for little ones.
Strange stuff. Sorry but my version of the Bible doesn't say what yours says in 32:4 for instance. What version are you using?From Scratch, Patience 7 has it right. I will expand on her comments. Taken from my web-site, www.seekfirstwisdom.com
The Greek Definite Article, "The, this, that," originally a demonstrative pronoun, but in Attic Greek, and in later usage mostly a prepositive article, (the," meaning the one and only, no other.)
1. As a demonstrative pronoun, "this, that."
1-a. Skimpily once in the words cited from the poet Aratus, Acts 17:28, "For we are also his offspring," for of this one (him,) we are also the offspring."
Jesus in the O.T. is at times referred to as, "The Angel of the LORD," or "Angel of Jehovah." Meaning He is revealing the will of His Father, as the #1 messenger. This appearance is called a, "Theophany," meaning "God appearing."
If you see, "An angel of the Lord," An, being an indefinite article, meaning more than one, it is making reference to other angels, or people.
The angel of God, is a title and office of Jesus, when He would temporally manifest Himself in a visible form in the O.T. Example:
Moses at the burning bush, Ex.3:2, "The angel of the LORD appeared unto him = (Moses) in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush."
Ver. 4, now the angel of the LORD is called, "The LORD saw that he (Moses) turned aside, and see this great sight."
Then Scripture states, that it was God who called unto him = (Moses) out of the midst of the bush.
Then the voice said in
ver.5, "I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God."
Ver.7, "The LORD said." ver.8, "I am come down."
ver.14, "God said unto Moses, I Am that I Am."
Read through chap.4. So in this one example of the burning bush, the angel is called, The angel of the LORD, the LORD, God, and, I Am, that I Am. These are all offices, titles, and attributes of our Lord Jesus.
The LORD appeared to Abram many times. In Gen.21, Hagar the mother of Ishmael heard the voice of, "the angel of God," who said, "I will make him = (Ishmael) a great nation."
Judg.13:3, Zorah the mother of Sampson, had an encounter with the angel of the LORD. Also Judg.13:11-13-22-23, "Manoah (the father of Sampson) said unto his wife, We shall surely die, because we have seen God." Then his wife said, "if the LORD were pleased to kill us, He would not have received a burnt offering and a meat offering at our hands."
ver.19, where the angel of the LORD ate their offering with them. These are only a few examples of those who had physical, up close encounters with Jesus, "The angel of the LORD," in the O.T.
Hope this helps you.
Phil LaSpino
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