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The eternal punishment of the spirit is earned by denying Christ. Good works and sin do not determine our salvation.
Would you prefer to be in a place where your eternal close relationship with God is dependent on your personal ability to obey God (the Garden) or be in a place where your eternal close relationship with God is dependent on your just humbly accepting God's charity (where you are today)?
Standard Christian belief is that we are saved via the holiness of Christ ...
2 Corinthians 5:21 He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.
Agreed ...
This was said to the rich young ruler, prior to the sacrifice of Christ to atone for all sin ....So Jesus was wrong by when He said, "if you will enter into life, keep the commandments."?
Actually, it was Jesus talking to His disciples after the unbelievers had left, so ...
This was said to the rich young ruler, prior to the sacrifice of Christ to atone for all sin ....
Jesus does say this.
However, every believer has, in believing, produced fruit pleasing to God ...
Luke 15:7
I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent.
This is after the second coming ...Sorry. That does not help you. Revelation 22 says,
"Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie." (Revelation 22:14-15).
Osas is a subject for another threadSo Jesus was wrong when He said, "if you will enter into life, keep the commandments."?
I am saying: I just have to humbly accept God’s charity as pure undeserved charity to obtain God’s Love. Once I obtain Godly type Love, eternal life and the indwelling Holy Spirit, then out of Godly type Love (Gratitude) I will do good stuff with the Spirit’s help. What is your motivation?Things are not in the way that we prefer them to be. God's narrow way is not a comforting message that we can sin and still be saved. There are too many warnings against sin and in being fruitless to in Scripture to ignore so as to have a shallow belief alone in Jesus for salvation. It simply does not work like that if one were to look at the whole counsel of God's Word.
Yes, we are saved by God's grace. That is where it starts. That is also the foundation. But God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (See: Titus 2:11-12).
This is after the second coming ...
The dawn of the post-return kingdom is like the Earth after the flood. Only Noah and his family survived ... and they survived ... because they had the faith to get on the ark ...How convenient. So God is a respecter of persons? Meaning, will God really let a certain age of believers slide in regards to their sin and yet He will not do so in another age or time period? Come on now.
This is after the second coming ...
I don't think that there are any accidents ... in God's economy.So you must believe that a Christian can never hate his brother (even by accident).
The Bible says that God can be seen through creation so man is without excuse. I think that doesn’t seem to apply to infants or babies because they can’t really observe with understanding.I get that but my belief and what scripture seems to support is that eternal punishment is only for the sins that you personally commit. A baby doesn't commit sins, so why would it be condemned? Adults are condemned because we commit sin. Some people try to reach out and say that an "innocent tribesman" on say the Sentinel Islands shouldn't be condemned because they never heard the Gospel so they never had a chance to be saved. But they are condemned because they are living in sin, there is no such thing as an "innocent tribesman". When a missionary tried to contact them they murdered him, they've shown hostility to anyone who tried to contact them. We don't know about their religion or worship but I'm 99.99% sure it isn't the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and has nothing to do with Jesus Christ, so likely they have other Gods. So when final judgement came, you'd see the condemnation of people who worshiped idols and devils, who murdered anyone who tried to come to them in friendship, much less preach them the gospel, and you'd think "that's a just punishment"
Would you honestly be able to say the same thing about a stillborn baby who never did anything much less anything wrong being condemned to the lake of fire? Does someone who has never sinned because they were never born need a savior to redeem them form their sins?
The verses quoting Jesus Himself lead to young children being innocent in God's eyes and the verse from David leads to God bringing the spirits of young innocent children to His presence
For the following people, please specify if you think they are saved or not and what leads you to think so. Also please indicate if you believe in single or double predestination or not.
1. A miscarried baby
2. A 5 year old who dies before becoming a Christian
3. A 15 year old who dies before becoming a Christian
4. A Christian who develops Alzheimer's or other dementia, rejects that they were ever a believer and passes away
5. A Christian who injures their brain, suffers permanent amnesia, forgets they were ever a Christian, dying many years later having never remembered
6. A person with split personality where one personality identifies as Christian and the other rejects Christianity
7. A Christian who drinks too much one day, while drunk rejects their faith and is killed in an accident before they can remember and repent
Once you start requiring works into the system, you start having to make exceptions. So a cripple can't do works, are they hopeless then?Titus 2:11-12 says that God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live godly and righteously in this present world.
The purpose and reason Christ died for us was that He might sanctify and cleanse the church with the washing of the water of the Word (Scripture) so that He may present to Himself a church that is holy and without blemish (Ephesians 5:25-27).
Paul says a person can deny God by a lack of works (Titus 1:16).
The author of Hebrews says that without holiness, no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14).
Jesus says any branch that does not bear fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire (John 15:1-6).
In the Parable of the Talents: The servant who was faithful over a little was told to enter into the joy of His Lord (Matthew 25:21); Yet, the unprofitable servant was told to be cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth (Matthew 25:30).
We're going to be in an eternal close relationship with God by accepting His charity and when we come to the new earth, we will also be obeying Him, we won't be able to disobey Him. Right now we're on a cursed world, in a cursed body that thinks it loves to disobey Him. But when it comes down to it, we'll have personal life lessons and character building that young children who died early won't have. They'll know that they're to obey God, but won't know why disobeying God carried consequences. We'll know why because we'll have experienced it. We'll be able to personally testify that God's way is better. A lot of times I've wondered why God didn't just create the world perfect the way it will be in the new Earth to begin with. That's the reason why. Because without personal testimony of just what sin leads to, eventually, someone will sin, because they don't understand consequence of doing it. We'll have had thousands of years of experience of death, disease, hardship, persecution, loss, and suffering to say "you don't even want to think about disobeying God, because it led to misery, you have it good here, in fact beyond good, perfect here."Would you prefer to be in a place where your eternal close relationship with God is dependent on your personal ability to obey God (the Garden) or be in a place where your eternal close relationship with God is dependent on your just humbly accepting God's charity (where you are today)?
well are you going to say that you never sin?I don't think we agree on Titus 2:11-12 because you no doubt hold to the OSAS view of 1 John 1:8 that says we will always have some kind of sin in our lives 24/7. If I am wrong on 1 John 1:8, then you have my apologies.
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