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PaleHorse said:It is the fourth commandment. So it is not non-sequitar.
Oblio said:Check your Scriptures. The Sabbath is not a commandment. For pre-Ressurectional Jews to keep the Sabbath Holy was their commandment.
I have checked my scriptures and I know that the Sabbath commandment was put in place on the 7-day of creation. Even the Catholic catechism clearly states that the seventh-day Sabbath is a commandment of God, the only difference is that the catechism says it is the 3rd commandment and not the 4th.Oblio said:Check your Scriptures. The Sabbath is not a commandment. For pre-Ressurectional Jews to keep the Sabbath Holy was their commandment.
Yes, Christ has risen and for that we know that we will also one day be ressurected.Oblio said:And Christ is risen (last time I checked) and we are not Jews.
- It is not a Jewish institution, for it was made about 2,300 years before Jews existed, right at creation. Genesis 2:2-3. To say the Sabbath is just for Jews is to say that marriage is just for the Jews as well since both the Sabbath and marriage were given to Adam and Eve in the beginning.Oblio said:And Christ is risen (last time I checked) and we are not Jews.
applepowerpc said:The Ten Commandments DO command us to honor the Sabbath. However, Colossians states in no uncertain terms:
Colossians 2:16
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Let's not major in minors here. If you're offended by Sunday not being the seventh day, then just reorder your calendars and move Sunday over to the right side! Sunday still follows Saturday either way and everybody's happy. Next question.
And of course you realize that the feasts outlined in Lev 23 were also called 'sabbaths' and that they were put "beside" (in addition to) the Sabbath of the Lord (Lev 23:38).applepowerpc said:The Ten Commandments DO command us to honor the Sabbath. However, Colossians states in no uncertain terms:
Colossians 2:16
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Let's not major in minors here. If you're offended by Sunday not being the seventh day, then just reorder your calendars and move Sunday over to the right side! Sunday still follows Saturday either way and everybody's happy. Next question.
I don't judge, its not my place - it is God's place to do that. Also, the feasts were not for judgment either; but the commandment of God, well, that's a different story.applepowerpc said:I stand by my point, that what day it's on is not worth arguing about. So, in accordance with Colossians 2:16, I will celebrate Sabbath on Sunday. If you don't agree with it, well...that verse says it's not for you to judge. Feel free to honor it on Saturday, though.
A fine example of OT ignorance leading to NT misunderstandings.applepowerpc said:> I think you are confusing which sabbaths are being talked about.
So the Sabbath isn't really the Sabbath? Come on.....
TrustAndObey said:The reason Sunday was specifically mentioned there is because that was the day before Paul was leaving for good and the story of him bringing a young man back to life was very important. It wasn't to say that Sunday was special...not at all....in fact, the speech started on Sabbath...it lasted until midnight so it ran into Sunday. The Jewish days began at sundown.
Paul traveled the next day and didn't rest. No mention of him making that Sunday holy at all.
Isaiah 53 said:7On the first day of the week we came together to break bread. Paul spoke to the people and, because he intended to leave the next day, kept on talking until midnight. (Acts 20:7)
Then why was Sunday specifically mentioned?
Isaiah 53 said:I have provided Biblical support but, as Catholic, you are well aware I do not derive all my theological thoughts from the Bible alone. Why have you not addressed the writings of the Early Church fathers? Are not the actions of the early Church valid?
On the Lord's own day, assemble in common to break bread and offer thanks, but first confess your sins so that your sacrifice may be pure." Didache, 14 (A.D. 90).
Isaiah 53 said:"If, therefore, those who were brought up in the ancient order of things have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord's Day, on which also our life has sprung up again by Him and by His death--whom some deny, by which mystery we have obtained faith, and therefore endure, that we may be found the disciples of Jesus Christ, our only Master." Ignatius, To the Magnesians, 9:1 (A.D. 110).
Isaiah 53 said:"The seventh day, therefore, is proclaimed a rest--abstraction from ills--preparing for the Primal Day,[The Lord's Day] our true rest; which, in truth, is the first creation of light, in which all things are viewed and possessed. From this day the first wisdom and knowledge illuminate us. For the light of truth--a light true, casting no shadow, is the Spirit of God indivisibly divided to all, who are sanctified by faith, holding the place of a luminary, in order to the knowledge of real existences. By following Him, therefore, through our whole life, we become impossible; and this is to rest." Clement of Alexandria, Stromata, 6:16 (A.D. 202).
Isaiah 53 said:Or should we follow the beliefs of a church founded in 1863? The Catholic Church as been observing the Lord's Day, on Sunday, since the beginning...
PaleHorse said:But if the argument is that the Sabbath was "nailed to the cross" then this makes no sense for the nailing took place on a Friday, not Sunday, and that is the question. No one disputes that the Christ rose from the sepluchre on a Sunday - but that isn't the argument being stated.
Simply said, if Sabbath was nailed to the cross (which happened on Friday) then there is no reason in the world that Mary would have observed it on the following Saturday - for it would be gone already.
Isaiah 53 said:Since we are playing the 'why' game. Why then was the day mentioned at all? Why not say the day before he left...why does it specify the first day of the week when they were gathered?
PAX CHRISTI
Cliff2 said:Do you have any support from Scripture to show that this is right.
This take is a new one on me.
I am just cathing up with what was posted as for most of the day I have not been near a computer.
TrustAndObey said:Isaiah, I think for now we should just keep our discussion Sola Scriptura. You can reference the early church fathers, but it really doesn't help. First of all because this is a discussion about WHO changed the Sabbath day to Sunday....and really you're just cementing the fact that it was not God.
The Word of God never calls Sunday the "Lord's Day". That's the point I'm trying to make and I think you agree with me on that.
And PaleHorse is right, if the Sabbath were nailed to the cross then Mary wouldn't have kept it the next day. The resurrection really has nothing to do with her keeping the Sabbath the day AFTER Christ was nailed to the cross, right?
I have checked my scriptures and I know that the Sabbath commandment was put in place on the 7-day of creation.
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