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Which Day of the Week is the Sabbath? (2)

Dragons87

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If Monday is our first working day, then naturally Sunday would be our last day of the week.

Frankly, I don't think it matters because weeks are in cycles, and you can begin and end your starting work day any day of the week. It's just that Sunday now has a more significant meaning than Saturday, so we keep it on Sunday.
 
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linssue55

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visionary said:
so how do you keep the commandments and the faith of Jesus as it is spoke of in Revelation?
In THIS church age, quite simple. Take in doctrine daily, grow, filling of the Holy Spirit, with Epignosis doctrine resident in the soul of the believer produces divine good. The Lord gives us only one day at a time, and in each day we are to praise and worship Him through his written word, prayer, fellowship, and divine thinking. What verse in Rev.?
 
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Oblio

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winslow said:
Have you looked at a calander lately, it han't changed in thousands of years and the daily cyle remains as it was before it was changed. Sunday is the first day of the week, not the last.


I just looked at mine. Sunday is not the first day, but then again, I'm not a Jew.
 
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Cliff2

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Dragons87 said:
If Monday is our first working day, then naturally Sunday would be our last day of the week.

Frankly, I don't think it matters because weeks are in cycles, and you can begin and end your starting work day any day of the week. It's just that Sunday now has a more significant meaning than Saturday, so we keep it on Sunday.

I do not agree with everything on this site but one thing is right and that is that Sunday is thr first day of the week.

http://www.kencollins.com/Holy-05.htm
 
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linssue55

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jochanaan said:
Oh really? What about the other Nine Commandments? Are they irrelevant too?
The filling of the Holy Spirit (1 John 1:9) is how we fullfill ALL of God's mandates.


Exegesis..........
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Note: The Mosaic Law was not an addition to the unconditional promise to Abraham . . . that salvation was by faith in Christ. In Paul's day a contract was binding! There was NO changing it! Even unbelievers kept their word. So, how much stronger was a promise from the Almighty GOD? Would He do less? And in this context, Paul is saying the Mosaic Law was NOT about salvation. It did not add or detract from God's unconditional promise to Abraham in the Abrahamic covenant - and it goes and on forever - faith in Christ will result in salvation - always was, always will be. Second point is by adding anything (legalism) to faith, one is saying God wants to add to the contract. This concept is blasphemy!}
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]18~~For if the inheritance . . . {be} of the law[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{then it is} no further by means of promise [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] {because it would be by means of law}. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]But God gave {the promise of inheritance} [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]to Abraham by means of promise [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] {and since it is God's unconditional contract and He will NOT renege}.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Reasons the Mosaic Law is Inferior to the Law of Grace - [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] 1) Mosaic Law is Temporary}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]19~~ What is the purpose of the {Mosaic} law? [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]It was added [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]'because of'/'for the sake of' transgressions [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] {so mankind could recognize they were breaking God's laws} - ordained through the instrumentality of angels[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]in the hand of a mediator[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]until the Seed {Jesus Christ} should come . . .[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]to Whom {the Seed - Jesus Christ} the promise was made.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Reasons the Mosaic Law is inferior to the Law of Grace - [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] 2) The Mosaic Law has an Inferior Mediator}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]20~~ Now a mediator is not a mediator of one {many angels}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]but God is one {in essence}.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Reasons the Mosaic Law is inferior to the Law of Grace - [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] 3) Mosaic Law Can Not Give Life}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]21~~ Is the {Mosaic} law then against the promises of God? [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]Let it NOT be SO! [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]For if there had been a law given which could have given life[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]- but there isn't - [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]verily righteousness should have been from the source of the law![/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Note: The Mosaic Law was trememdous. If any law could have given eternal life, it would have been the Mosaic Law. But there is no following of any law sufficient to give anyone eternal life. All eternal life is in the Son.}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Reasons the Mosaic Law is inferior to the Law of Grace - [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] 4) Mosaic Law is a Jailer - Not a Savior}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]22~~ But the scripture has concluded once and for all [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]the human race is under the control of sin[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]for the purpose that a promise {of eternal life}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]by faith in Jesus Christ[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]might be - once and for all -[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]given to them who believe.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Why Do We Have the Mosaic Law? [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2] What is the Purpose of the Mosaic Law?}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]23~~ But before [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]The faith/doctrine came {before we were saved} [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]we were kept under the law {guarded by a jailer}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]shut up outside the area of the faith/doctrine[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]which should afterwards {after salvation} [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]about to be revealed.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Note: The Mosaic Law is for all humanity - believer and unbeliever alike. If an unbelieving society adopts the 'laws for establishment' set up in the Mosaic Law, they will develop a strong society in which evangelism can thrive. In the Church Age, bible doctrine can only be understood under the ministry of the filling of God the Holy Spirit. Unbelievers can not understand doctrine until they are saved. And, believers can not grow spiritually without the use of rebound (I John 1:9) restoring fellowship and the filling of God the Holy Spirit.}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]24~~ Wherefore the law became our 'paidagogos'[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]which lead us to Christ[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]that we might be justified by faith/doctrine.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Note: A 'paidagogos' was a slave that took the children to[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]school . . . an olden day 'school bus'. Coming up, we will see that until salvation we are minor children - hardly greater than slaves - at salvation we go through a change or 'adoption' and become 'adult sons' in union with Christ.}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]25~~ But after that[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]faith/doctrine is come[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]we are no longer under a paidagog.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Note: Means we get off the bus! See the previous verse.}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]26~~ For you keep on being[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]all the children of God[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]through the instrumentality of faith in Christ Jesus.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Verses 27-29 Principal of Inheritance}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]27~~ For as many of you as have once and for all [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]received baptism {of the Holy Spirit} [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]into {union with} Christ {spiritual baptism}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]have once and for all put on Christ.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]{Note: The 'toga' of adulthood'.}[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]Gal 5---[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]3~~ For I keep on witnessing again to every one of you [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]that is circumcised {under the Jewish ritual}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]that he keeps on being a debtor to do the whole law.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]4~~ You all {legalistic Jews} [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]have become null and void [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]from the ultimate source of Christ [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]whosoever are being vindicated [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]by means of the law {religious crowd}[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Times New I2]you have drifted off course from grace.[/FONT]




[/FONT]
 
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Cliff2

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winslow said:
John 14:15- If you love Me, you will keep my commandments.

People seemingly look at this verse backwards, thinking that if they try hard enough to keep the commandments they will develop a love for Jesus. Or that to prove your love for Jesus you must try as hard as you can to keep His commandments.


In reality if we develop our love for Jesus through a relationship with Him, then "keeping His commandments", or obedience, is a natural result. You are not focusing on the obedience, you are focusing on Jesus. Obedience is the natural outgrowth of our love for Him.

An apple tree doesn't produce apples to prove it's an apple tree. It produces apples because that is what it isb

Agree!

 
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Dragons87

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winslow said:
Have you looked at a calander lately, it han't changed in thousands of years and the daily cyle remains as it was before it was changed. Sunday is the first day of the week, not the last.

Why would that matter if we're still doing it one day after six? Would you be happier if the calendars simply published with "Sunday" at the end of the week?

Let's take this a bit more internationally, shall we? In Chinese, "Monday" is called "First day of the week", "Tuesday", "Second day of the week"... so Saturday, your Sabbath, is only the "Sixth day of the week". Sunday is called "The Sun Day of the Week", where everybody gets a rest - and Christians go to church.

I still don't see what the big fuss is. The functions of Sunday is exactly the same as the Sabbath - with the added value that it's the Lord's Day, the day on which our sins were washed away with Jesus' resurrection. Even the frequency is the same - one day every six passing days. It's not as if people are being infrequent about it. It would be a problem if people decided for this week, Sabbath would be a Monday, or a Wednesday next week.
 
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linssue55

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winslow said:
John 14:15- If you love Me, you will keep my commandments.

People seemingly look at this verse backwards, thinking that if they try hard enough to keep the commandments they will develop a love for Jesus. Or that to prove your love for Jesus you must try as hard as you can to keep His commandments.


In reality if we develop our love for Jesus through a relationship with Him, then "keeping His commandments", or obedience, is a natural result. You are not focusing on the obedience, you are focusing on Jesus. Obedience is the natural outgrowth of our love for Him.

An apple tree doesn't produce apples to prove it's an apple tree. It produces apples because that is what it isb

Ok, I see that you did not understand my post, the law is dead. It was replaced by Grace. By using 1 John 1:9 we fullfill EVERYTHING that God wants us to do in this Christain life, if you wish to live by the law, that is your choice. For by doing to you have rejected God's grace.......

Rom 7:5
For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

- Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes. (Rom.10:4).


- For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace. (Rom.6:14).


Since the Lord Jesus Christ fulfills the Law by His person and work, believers are under a new law; the obligation to walk by the Spirit of Life through faith (Rom. 8:2-4). If we are led by the Spirit, then we are not under the Law (Gal. 5:18).

The believer in Christ who functions under the filling of the Holy Spirit (1 John 1:9) takes up where Christ left off and fulfills the Law. Believers in the church age are under a higher law of spirituality: Rom.8:2-4; Gal.5:18,22,23; ICor.13.

1Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,
2because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death.

3For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man, 4in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit. (Rom.8:1-4).


Yes, Jesus has not violated the Law nor even ignored it; He has fulfilled it! The Law pronounced the sinner’s doom (Ezekiel 18:4). Christ, the sinner’s Substitute, died under that Law (Galatians 3:13), completely satisfying the demands of that Law (1 John 2:2), fully paying the wages of sin for the sinner (Romans 6:23).

The Great Problem of the Law...

God's perfect Law could not declare the sinner righteous; it could only condemn and execute him:

- For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. (James 2:10)... Nobody could fulfill the whole Law, not even Moses!

- Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin. (Rom.3:20).

- I would not have known what sin was except through the law... For apart from law, sin is dead. Once I was alive apart from law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. (Rom.7:7-10).


God gave His perfect Law to demonstrate to sinners that we cannot stand before Him on the basis of our own merit...on law ground. Law can only condemn the law breaker; it cannot save him. The sinner must not seek his salvation on the grounds of law keeping, for, even if he kept the entire law and committed just one infraction, the Law would justly demand his doom (James 2:10). No, the sinner can only approach God on the grounds of God's Grace.

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. (Galatians 3:24-25).

The Law and Grace do not Mix!:

If we live under the Law, we die under the Law... if we live under Grace, we have live under Grace... they do not mix, we can't live under both... but if we just live under Grace, we have the Law!.

Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. (Gal.5:4).


When any member of the Body of Christ seeks to approach God on the basis of human merit rather than God’s Grace, he is rejecting God’s plan in favor of Satan’s!

There is the great problem with seeing the Grace of God as something that helps us get to heaven, as if we put forth the best we can, and then grace supplies the rest. Never! Grace doesn’t help, it does it all. All of our righteousness comes from the work of Jesus for us.

The barren ground of Law has been replaced by the fertile ground of Grace (Romans 7:4).

I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. (Galatians 2:21)

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.(Galatians 2:16).


ALL THIS IS ABUNDANTLY CLEAR, YOU REJECT GOD'S GRACE YOU ARE REJECTING GOD HIMSELF........YOUR CHOICE, I PRAY TO THE FATHER YOU MAKE THE RIGHT ONE. BE WELL.....
 
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jochanaan

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linssue, I have heard that logic. And as far as salvation goes, it is right: we cannot expect that following the Law will save us no matter how carefully we do it. But this is not a matter of salvation; it's a matter of obedience because we have been saved and declared His children.

If you followed such logic to its conclusion, only two laws might stand at all: to love God with all our beings, and to love our neighbors as ourselves. Would we then find that we could set aside the regulations against murder? Or using the Lord's name to curse another? (That's only one way of taking His name in vain.) Or taking what is not ours?

As it happens, Paul himself warned strongly against such an interpretation. "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." (Romans 3:31) "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid...." (ch. 6:1-2) "For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another." (Galatians 5:13)

So what did he mean when he said that the Law was no longer in force? It would seem he meant that the Law's penalties no longer applied--not that the Law itself was done away with, as Jesus agrees in Matthew 5:17: "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets..." The clearest passage I can find on this matter is Colossians 2:13-15: "And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it." In this verse it is not the Law itself that is "nailed to the cross" but rather "the handwriting of ordinances," the indictment against us that declares us guilty to death. Praise God that He paid the price His own justice demands!

So the Law's principles remain, even though their penalty is voided.

Then do we keep them all unaltered, or do we let some of them slip or adjust them to differing conditions? Well, there do seem to be differences; Jesus Himself speaks of "one of these least commandments" (Matthew 5:19) and readily answered when asked which was the greatest. In at least one case, circumcision, Paul says that if Gentiles obey it at all, their salvation is voided. (See Galatians 5:2-12) As for the food laws, Jesus' parable in Mark 7:14-23 and Peter's vision in Acts 10 seem to indicate that they are not, or are no longer, strictly in force.

But the Sabbath is not like that. It is one of the Ten original Commandments, and it was ordained by God Himself as early as Genesis 2:2-3, in the "Days of Creation." (Please; I'm not insisting they were literal days!:) ) And I find no indication of any change in this commandment in the New Testament, as we have discussed extensively.

So as long as we're keeping one day in seven, I for one will continue to observe it, not according to my own whim, but agreeing with the day that some of the world's best record-keepers, the Jews, agree is the Seventh Day of Biblical times.
 
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Cliff2

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ethereous said:
I don't remember anywhere it saying what exact day the Sabbath is on. Just the fact that you should rest on the 7th day instead of working a 7 day work week.

Go back to the Garden of Eden and see when God said that the 7th day was holy.

Genesis 2


1Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Creation had just taken place, we have no doubt as to what day God sanctified, which means to set apart for holy use.
 
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linssue55

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jochanaan said:
linssue, I have heard that logic. And as far as salvation goes, it is right: we cannot expect that following the Law will save us no matter how carefully we do it. But this is not a matter of salvation; it's a matter of obedience because we have been saved and declared His children.

If you followed such logic to its conclusion, only two laws might stand at all: to love God with all our beings, and to love our neighbors as ourselves. Would we then find that we could set aside the regulations against murder? Or using the Lord's name to curse another? (That's only one way of taking His name in vain.) Or taking what is not ours?

As it happens, Paul himself warned strongly against such an interpretation. "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." (Romans 3:31) "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid...." (ch. 6:1-2) "For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another." (Galatians 5:13)

So what did he mean when he said that the Law was no longer in force? It would seem he meant that the Law's penalties no longer applied--not that the Law itself was done away with, as Jesus agrees in Matthew 5:17: "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets..." The clearest passage I can find on this matter is Colossians 2:13-15: "And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it." In this verse it is not the Law itself that is "nailed to the cross" but rather "the handwriting of ordinances," the indictment against us that declares us guilty to death. Praise God that He paid the price His own justice demands!

So the Law's principles remain, even though their penalty is voided.

Then do we keep them all unaltered, or do we let some of them slip or adjust them to differing conditions? Well, there do seem to be differences; Jesus Himself speaks of "one of these least commandments" (Matthew 5:19) and readily answered when asked which was the greatest. In at least one case, circumcision, Paul says that if Gentiles obey it at all, their salvation is voided. (See Galatians 5:2-12) As for the food laws, Jesus' parable in Mark 7:14-23 and Peter's vision in Acts 10 seem to indicate that they are not, or are no longer, strictly in force.

But the Sabbath is not like that. It is one of the Ten original Commandments, and it was ordained by God Himself as early as Genesis 2:2-3, in the "Days of Creation." (Please; I'm not insisting they were literal days!:) ) And I find no indication of any change in this commandment in the New Testament, as we have discussed extensively.

So as long as we're keeping one day in seven, I for one will continue to observe it, not according to my own whim, but agreeing with the day that some of the world's best record-keepers, the Jews, agree is the Seventh Day of Biblical times.

I never said anything about salvation. I was talking of the law and the law only, there are no salvation verses in my post. Where did you get that from? If all those verses, the words of God, didn't convince you, then the issue is really between you and the Lord. For it REALLY is going to have to be HIM to wake you up, to rid you of your human beliefs, and take up the His Divine word. Amazing how the words are so crystal clear, and yet us lowly sinners REFUSE to believe HIs words. Wow! It never ceases to amaze me.

One might as well just slap the Lord in the face and say, "Sorry God, I will stick to what you gave the jews in the wilderness, and won't accept this wonderful grace package that you have given us today in the church age. After all Lord, I do prefer what you gave in the old testement better, so thanks, but NO THANKS Lord". This takes B_lls! For what you told me, the Lord is ALSO KNOW'S. I would be very afraid the Lord would strike me with a bolt of lightning. Unbelieveable!!

Today in this church age, we are to take in doctrine DAILY. This means EVERYDAY, not just on Saturday or Sunday. The sabbath was set into effect for the exodus generation, (because for 400 yrs. they NEVER had a sabbath) as was the law, but if you knew sound cronology you would know this, or should. If you are going to follow the sabbath as it was with the jews, shouldnt you be a Jew? AND if you are a Jew?, shouldn't you follow ALL of the sabbath rules?, no cooking?, no cleaning?, or doing dishes?, or making your bed?, or going to the store?, or watering your lawn?, or driving your car?, or bathing?, or ALL of the ton's of other things you do on the sabbath? I mean?, IF you are going to do it?, shouldn't you do it RIGHT? If you don't do it ALL, you ARE violating the sabbath! Period!

We are to live "EVERYDAY AS UNTO THE LORD", this also means worship. I give a least an hour everyday to the worship of the Lord, listening to my bible tapes, taking notes, exegeting, praying, etc. Most so called Christains only worship 1 day a week for a couple of hours. He gives us one day at a time, so in EACH of those day's we give back by worship EACH DAY. So much greater then those that give ONLY around 2 hours a week. Don't you think the Lord deserves more from His children? He most certainly does!!!
 
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jochanaan

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Let me make sure I'm understanding you, linssue. Are you saying that NONE of the Biblical laws, Old Testament or New, apply to us who are saved by grace? Or any other laws at all? That we're free to disregard any rule, whoever makes it?

If so, how can you avoid any mention of law when you "take in doctrine"? If not, whose laws still apply, and whose can we disregard freely?

(Note: I'll be out of town for the next few days, so I probably won't be able to reply immediately.)
 
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visionary

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One might as well just slap the Lord in the face and say, "Sorry God, I will stick to what you gave the jews in the wilderness, and won't accept this wonderful grace package that you have given us today in the church age. After all Lord, I do prefer what you gave in the old testement better, so thanks, but NO THANKS Lord". This takes B_lls! For what you told me, the Lord is ALSO KNOW'S. I would be very afraid the Lord would strike me with a bolt of lightning. Unbelieveable!!
What the Jews were given in the wilderness is the grace package ... given in symbolic messages, that Yeshua lived in truth and spirit when He walked the earth. That is why Yeshua could say to the lawyer who was asking about eternal life...
Luke 10:25 And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? 26 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? 27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. 28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.
There was grace offered to the lawyer by the Lord Himself.
 
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linssue55

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jochanaan said:
Let me make sure I'm understanding you, linssue. Are you saying that NONE of the Biblical laws, Old Testament or New, apply to us who are saved by grace? Or any other laws at all? That we're free to disregard any rule, whoever makes it?

If so, how can you avoid any mention of law when you "take in doctrine"? If not, whose laws still apply, and whose can we disregard freely?

(Note: I'll be out of town for the next few days, so I probably won't be able to reply immediately.)
You are not understanding. The law was abolished and replaced by Grace. When we are is FELLOWSHIP (rebound 1 John 1 :9) we ARE fullfilling the law Already.

For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace. (Rom.6:14).

God the Holy Spirit Indwells us now, THROUGH the FILLING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT (1John one 1:9) we are at that point SINLESS, we can do no wrong........Because God the Holy Spirit is doing the work through us ( we are not doing it).

Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes. (Rom.10:4).


The jews in the exodus NEVER had the "FILLING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT", (the grace package) they only had their HUMAN abilty to serve the Lord, that is why almost all of them failed. God KNEW this, THAT is why the law was obolished. This is the part of the mystery doctrine for the church, this is what put's us above any other generation before us. We are unique. We have more than any other people, His GIFT to us!
 
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visionary

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linssue55 said:
The jews in the exodus NEVER had the "FILLING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT", (the grace package) they only had their HUMAN abilty to serve the Lord, that is why almost all of them failed. God KNEW this, THAT is why the law was obolished. This is the part of the mystery doctrine for the church, this is what put's us above any other generation before us. We are unique. We have more than any other people, His GIFT to us![/I][/B]
It was offer just as it was offered to us, it still is up to us to accept. As Moses said...
Numbers 11:29
And Moses said unto him, Enviest thou for my sake? would God that all the LORD'S people were prophets, and that the LORD would put his spirit upon them!
God wants the same then as He does now, for all of us to walk in His Spirit.
 
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