Which Day of the Week is the Sabbath? (2)

Normann · Dec 19, 2005

Cliff2 said:
The Sabbath is Saturday and was NEVER meant to be Sunday.

That is the issue here, some think it is Sunday when no Biblical support for a Sunday Sabbath can be found in the Bible.

If it was so easy why don't these people who think Sunday is the Sabbath just come up with a text to say it is so and that would be the end of the story.

Dear Cliff,

If it was so easy why don't you who think Saturday is the Sabbath just come up with a text to say it is so and that would be the end of the story???????????????????

Normann

Cliff2 · Dec 19, 2005

Normann said:
Dear Cliff,

If it was so easy why don't you who think Saturday is the Sabbath just come up with a text to say it is so and that would be the end of the story???????????????????

Normann

I have given you a link to 55 New Testament Sabbath texts and 8 first day texts.

You will find so much support for the 7th day Sabbath if only you will look.

I can post so much support for the 7th day Sabbath but you cannot find one text for the change of the Sabbath or for Sunday which is the first day of week as being the SABBATH.

As you worship on the first day of the week I think it is up to you to show where the change is and when it was made and by whom.

That would be an interesting task to see if you can come up with some answers.

md6597 · Dec 19, 2005

The callander has changed many times over the years... With specific breaks being noted. When the current callender was put into use in the 1500's, the date jumped from the 4th to the 15th.

However there is no significant record of the days of the week being broken throughout history. So while the actual date may have changed to fix the lunar cycle and re-align the calender, the day of the week has never been recorded to have changed.

This holds true back to the times of Moses.

So basically the day of the week and the fact that there are 7 days in a week has never changed, however the dates have.

English Portuguese Russian Meaning of Russian name Monday segunda-feira ponedelnik After "do-nothing" Tuesday terça-feira vtornik Second Wednesday quarta-feira sreda Middle Thursday quinta-feira chetverg Fourth Friday sexta-feira pyatnitsa Fifth Saturday sabado subbota Sabbath Sunday domingo voskresenye Resurrection

I would also state that It would not matter what day of the week it currently was, or even if the dates in the history of time have ever been shifted in there order. Whatever date we hold to be the 7th day of the week no matter if its called Saturday, or Wednesday.. That day because of the order we put it on would be the Sabbath.

Just my .02 cents

~MD~

oldsage · Dec 20, 2005

Cliff2 said:
I have given you a link to 55 New Testament Sabbath texts and 8 first day texts.

You will find so much support for the 7th day Sabbath if only you will look.

I can post so much support for the 7th day Sabbath but you cannot find one text for the change of the Sabbath or for Sunday which is the first day of week as being the SABBATH.

As you worship on the first day of the week I think it is up to you to show where the change is and when it was made and by whom.

That would be an interesting task to see if you can come up with some answers.

Cliff, he is just arguing the point the word Saturday doesn't appear in the bible, it is really a non-argument

Chris

Cliff2 · Dec 20, 2005

oldsage said:
Cliff, he is just arguing the point the word Saturday doesn't appear in the bible, it is really a non-argument

Chris

I know the wrod Saturday does not appear in the Bible.

The word Sunday also does not appear.

To me the names of the days of the week is not even important.

What we do know is that the 7th day is the Sabbath.

Today we just happen to call that Saturday.

moicherie · Dec 20, 2005

Cliff2 said:
I know the wrod Saturday does not appear in the Bible.

The word Sunday also does not appear.

To me the names of the days of the week is not even important.

What we do know is that the 7th day is the Sabbath.

Today we just happen to call that Saturday.

Perhaps we should get 'Saturday''s name changed to 'Sunday' and change 'Sunday' to 'Shopping Day' that may solve the problem...... (weak attempt at humour)

Normann · Dec 20, 2005

Cliff2 said:
The word Sunday is not in the Bible.

Does that mean it is not the first day of the week?

Not at all.

The word Sabbath is in the Bible and we all know that the Sabbath that Jesus kept was the 7th day of the week.

No one even disputes that fact.

Which is the First day of the week according to scripture and which is the seventh day of the week.

Just because a paper hanging on the wall has the days in a row and one of them appears in the seventh slot, does not prove which one is the first, second or seventh!

Give us scripture.

rstrats · Dec 20, 2005

Normann,

re: "If the fifteenth day of Abib is when Israel left Egypt, which was on the sabbath, was Saturday, then the seventh-day sabbath would fall on Saturday for seven weeks or forty-nine days. The fiftieth day, Sunday, would be Pentecost. The next seventh-day sabbath after Pentecost would then fall on Sunday, and so on until Pentecost of the following year which would change the seventh-day sabbath again, this time to Monday. So there was no such thing as the sabbath always being on Saturday throughout the year, or perpetually."

Why would the next weekly Sabbath after Pentecost fall on the first day of the week?

rstrats · Dec 20, 2005

Normann,

You still havent explained how that calendar change affected the continuity of the seven day cycle.

rstrats · Dec 20, 2005

Normann,

Did the Messiah need to observe the Sabbath commandment in order to remain sinless?

md6597 · Dec 20, 2005

Interesting stuff i found on the Hebrew Calendar

The Hebrew Calendar

In Biblical times, Jewish communities used a lunar calendar which included intercalary months at times determined by the Sanhedrin, the council of religious leaders. By the fourth century of the Christian era, this had been replaced by a calendar which followed explicit rules. It was still based upon the lunar month, but intercalary months were inserted according to the Metonic cycle which made 19 tropical years equal to 235 lunar months. The first month of the Hebrew year is named Tishri, and it falls in the autumn. The second and third months, named Heshvan and Kislev, may have 29 or 30 days. In a leap year, the sixth month, Adar, is repeated, the first time (Adar I) with 30 days and the second (Adar II) with 29.

The length of the Hebrew year is therefore rather variable. In an ordinary year, it can be 353, 354 or 355 days long; in a leap year, it may be 383, 384 or 385 days. Years of 353 or 383 days are called ``deficient'' years whilst those of 355 or 385 are called ``complete''.

Leap years occur in years 3, 6, 8, 11, 14, 17 and 19 of the 19-year Metonic cycle.

There are a number of rules, known as dehiyyot, which are used to decide whether the first day of the new year (i.e. Tishri 1) must be postponed. These rules prevent Hoshana Rabba and Yom Kippur from falling on the Sabbath, and ensure that the adjustments do not cause the length of the year to fall outside the acceptable range.

md6597 · Dec 20, 2005

Normann said:
Which is the First day of the week according to scripture and which is the seventh day of the week.

Just because a paper hanging on the wall has the days in a row and one of them appears in the seventh slot, does not prove which one is the first, second or seventh!

Give us scripture.

Look in the following Scriptures....

Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Exo 23:12 Six days thou shalt do thy work, and on the seventh day thou shalt rest: that thine ox and thine ass may rest, and the son of thy handmaid, and the stranger, may be refreshed.

Exo 31:15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.

Exo 34:21 Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest: in earing time and in harvest thou shalt rest.

Exo 35:2 Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death.

Not ONCE does it mention a particular days, just a number. From this I would say that if for some reason the callander was shifted to make Tuesday the first day of the week and Monday the last, so the order went like this: Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday...

Monday being the 7th of the week would be the Sabbath

Tuesday being the day after would be the day that Christians go to church

I say it matters not what you call each day or what there order are. The bible clearly states that whatever you hold to be the 7th day of your week is the Sabbath. It matters not where that was back then....

~MD~

Normann · Dec 20, 2005

Cliff2 said:
............
...As you worship on the first day of the week I think it is up to you to show where the change is and when it was made and by whom.

That would be an interesting task to see if you can come up with some answers.

Cliff, I don't keep the Sabbath for two reasons; one the command to keep the Sabbath is not in the N. T.

Two: I don't work, so therefore it is impossible to keep the sabbath unless I first work six days.

Exodus 20:9-10 Six days shalt thou labour...

Another note, I worship every day not just on Sunday. Please note that the commandment in the O.T. mentioned work and rest and nothing about worship services.

We have church services on Sun, Tue, Wed, Sat and sometimes Friday.

IN THE MASTER'S SERVICE,
Normann

woobadooba · Dec 20, 2005

Normann said:
Cliff, I don't keep the Sabbath for two reasons; one the command to keep the Sabbath is not in the N. T.

The reason why the NT is silent on this issue is because it wasn't an issue. From the very beginning of their introduction to Christ, the Gentiles kept the
Sabbath day holy. They had no problem with this doctrine. In fact, they were anxious to go to the synagogue on Sabbath to hear the word of God. Acts. 13:44

Two: I don't work, so therefore it is impossible to keep the sabbath unless I first work six days.

The Bible never says that work is a prerequisite for keeping the Sabbath. It just simply states that, work you will, but keep in mind, there is a time to rest, and that time to rest is on the 7th day, because that is the day that God blessed, and sanctified, and you are to keep that day holy.

Another note, I worship every day not just on Sunday. Please note that the commandment in the O.T. mentioned work and rest and nothing about worship services.

1. And we should worship God every day, but there is only one day, according to the Bible, that God blessed and sanctified, and that day is the 7th.

2. What else does it mean to "keep the Sabbath day holy", but to worship God on that day?

And notice that it doesn't merely state that we should rest from our work on that day, but that we should keep it holy. So rest, according to the context of the command, doesn't denote the idea of lying in your bed the whole day and enjoying a few Zzz, but resting for the purpose of devoting one's entire attention to the purpose for which the Sabbath was given, as a gift from God for man to enjoy His presence without the interruption of worldly cares, thus keeping it holy. Hence, "the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath." Mk. 2:27

oldsage · Dec 20, 2005

woobadooba said:
The reason why the NT is silent on this issue is because it wasn't an issue. From the very beginning of their introduction to Christ, the Gentiles kept the
Sabbath day holy. They had no problem with this doctrine. In fact, they were anxious to go to the synagogue on Sabbath to hear the word of God. Acts. 13:44

The Bible never says that work is a prerequisite for keeping the Sabbath. It just simply states that, work you will, but keep in mind, there is a time to rest, and that time to rest is on the 7th day, because that is the day that God blessed, and sanctified, and you are to keep that day holy.

1. And we should worship God every day, but there is only one day, according to the Bible, that God blessed and sanctified, and that day is the 7th.

2. What else does it mean to "keep the Sabbath day holy", but to worship God on that day?

And notice that it doesn't merely state that we should rest from our work on that day, but that we should keep it holy. So rest, according to the context of the command, doesn't denote the idea of lying in your bed the whole day and enjoying a few Zzz, but resting for the purpose of devoting one's entire attention to the purpose for which the Sabbath was given, as a gift from God for man to enjoy His presence without the interruption of worldly cares, thus keeping it holy. Hence, "the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath." Mk. 2:27

I have shown him the text that says the Sabbath is to be a day of Holy Assembly, he just ignored it, just as he will ignore everyones post.

Chris

rstrats · Dec 20, 2005

Normann,

You have questions directed to you in post numbers 388, 389 and 390.

rstrats · Dec 20, 2005

Normann,

re: "...the command to keep the Sabbath is not in the N.T."

One more time; Hebrews 4:9 - "It is therefore the duty of the people of God to keep the sabbath" (Holy Bible from the Ancient Eastern Text).

strikerchris0411 · Dec 20, 2005

rstrats said:
Normann,

re: "...the command to keep the Sabbath is not in the N.T."

One more time; Hebrews 4:9 - "It is therefore the duty of the people of God to keep the sabbath" (Holy Bible from the Ancient Eastern Text).

How many of you actually keep the Sabbath?

md6597 · Dec 20, 2005

I dont and cant keep the sabbath my work is constant... Unfortunately people with dissablilities like to eat on sunday and saturday. They also like to have there meds...

Welcome to my life...

Note: I wasn't saying you should do anything, or pointing out anyones faults myself. I am just saying it clearly points out when it is...

oldsage · Dec 20, 2005

strikerchris0411 said:
How many of you actually keep the Sabbath?

me

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