Where in the NEW TESTAMENT does it say being gay is a sin?

[BryanW92]

More to the point. Why do some people HATE homosexuals so much,

You'll have to ask those people. Perhaps you could give Westboro a call. No one here is even coming close to saying or even hinting that they HATE homosexuals.

You have an agenda. If you want to discuss, then discuss. If you want to keep repeating your talking points, then you can check off CF on your list of those who have heard the talking points.

 

[theophilus777]

You have an agenda.

Or, she might just need to vent? Lord knows our culture can create all sorts of needs to blow off steam, or heal, or ...

 

[Alithis]

OK Jaded and Corrupt--RE: michaelmynameIs comment "what if my adult nephew is consistently committing adultery ...i still love the person and he happens to be your husband.....
.........-that still ok with you?"
I did misunderstand. But YES, it is still OK with me that you LOVE YOUR NEPHEW-- But if your nephew is MY husband and is cheating on ME breaking OUR vows to EACH OTHER-- I will divorce him, AND most likely always love him. SO half that response still applies. I will not hold up banners that say "GOD HATES ADULTERERS" etc.

No one was suggesting you do.
But if your husband's brain is genetically wired to be unfaithful what right do you have to judge him and divorce him... or does that genetic (false) argument only apply to men who sleep with men and not men who sleep with woman?

Yes..I'm making a point.
Sin is imprisoning but the lord Jesus came to set us free from it.not left locked in it.

By the way.the sect that hold up gay hate signs are extremely small ,mostly not Christian and always over represented by the media.. where an unequally high number of sodomites work.interesting that.

 

[staceylee67]

Gee, so sorry Brian. I guess I am. It allowed to defend my question. I am. It repeating myself any more than the haters are.
I am mature enough for discussion. Apparently you are not. Why would I have an agenda?? I try to understand other peoples point of view. The people spewing hate here are not contributing to my understanding.
Why are you being mean to me, Brian?

 

[seeingeyes]

Way to go-- SEEINGEYES-- you are exactly my problem with "religion". Why don't YOU read your bible-- many people of the bible have questioned their faith. Many pastors have questioned their faith. A TRUE Christian would do as some others have done here---- you don't have to agree with my statements/ questions but many here have offered a kind word and a "bless you".
IF you are a true Christian you should be there to HELP strugglers rather than PUSH THEM AWAY.

Hmm..perhaps you read it in a sarcastic tone? I certainly didn't intend that.

I really meant that it is good for you to ask questions, and I'm honestly asking why you don't just throw it all out. What draws you to Christianity?

 

[staceylee67]

OK Michael I see your point. I am not a very good communicator so let me clarify that most of the Christians I know are real Christians who behave as Christians should.
But also I thing that being wired to being a cheater is nonsense. And I think sometimes ppl do choose to be gay.
But not always a choice. If it were always a choice why then do people kill themsces over being gay?
People say this is not the place for this discussion. Maybe not. But my nephew being gay has really, really, upset me. It hits home. He is a good man. And with all the death in my family the last few years my Christianity is shaken up. I will always be a believer. I was and maybe still am angry at God. I was very depressed and maybe venting a little with my last few posts on Christian Forums. I am grasping at straws and my world has been punched in the gut.
Thank you to those who have offered kind words. I also appreciate a good argument- ppl don't have to agree with me to get my approval.
I am angry at those questioning my intentions, but I suppose I understand.
I ask tough questions here because I feel safe to do so. Please believe me when I say I am sincere in my question for better understanding. I I cannot go here then where can I go??

 

[staceylee67]

Oh SEEING EYES I am so sorry. I am sarcastic sometimes so I guess I read it into others. I am so hurt and angry lately and am usually very positive.
What draws me I Christianity? I've always been a Christian. I believe with all of my heart. I get mad at God for a while bit still believe. But have never been so angry and confused. My world has been shaken a little.
So sorry. I know I'm acting like a little kid here.

 

[Alithis]

And I am sure you have sin that I hate as well. I am not gay-- far from it. But I cannot stand judgemental homophobes. Hypocrites-- you know what I am saying? Why do you hate gays so much but not other sinners, like drunks, for instance?

You keep saying this hate word,yet no one here has expressed any hate.
Jesus said the world would hate his followers for expressing the truth.
Expressing the truth ..is love. As it leads to life.

As to drunks etc... interestingly enough most of the organisation's that fight drinking laws are Christian and are also the ones running most of homeless shelters..which is where drunks end up .the anti gambling drives ,as gambling addiction ruins lives.
But hate????

There's no hate.
Sodomy and anything which leads to it is sinful.
It literally violates the cycle of life.
Putting the seed of life in the waste pipe of humanity....
Its not hate to say so.

Its Just saying what it is.
......
The Lord Jesus said "I am the way the truth and the life"
His word is truth.
He desires life for us all.
We must admit our wrong to accept his right.
Do you love your nephew?
Really?????
Do you really.. if so why would you perpetuate
A lie that leads to death and not life.
How it that loving him .

 

[Alithis]

I cannot imagine the storm I would go through
Should a child of mine declare they were gay.
..in text we can sound so harsh...

I'd be devastated and angry and hurt and so wanting to love that child

 

[seeingeyes]

Oh SEEING EYES I am so sorry. I am sarcastic sometimes so I guess I read it into others. I am so hurt and angry lately and am usually very positive.
What draws me I Christianity? I've always been a Christian. I believe with all of my heart. I get mad at God for a while bit still believe. But have never been so angry and confused. My world has been shaken a little.
So sorry. I know I'm acting like a little kid here.

Ooo girl, I've shaken my fist at God a bit myself. One time I shook it so hard it fell right off. God in His grace picked it up, dusted it off and stuck it back on. Then I went back to shaking it at Him! So don't worry about me, I ran out of rocks to throw.

What exactly is it that you believe with all your heart?

 

[staceylee67]

OK hate is not he right word. And I only got that vibe from a couple of people.

 

[seeingeyes]

Oh SEEING EYES I am so sorry. I am sarcastic sometimes so I guess I read it into others. I am so hurt and angry lately and am usually very positive.
What draws me I Christianity? I've always been a Christian. I believe with all of my heart. I get mad at God for a while bit still believe. But have never been so angry and confused. My world has been shaken a little.
So sorry. I know I'm acting like a little kid here.

Ooo girl, I've shaken my fist at God a bit myself. One time I shook it so hard it fell right off. God in His grace picked it up, dusted it off and stuck it back on. Then I went back to shaking it at Him! So don't worry about me, I ran out of rocks to throw.

What exactly is it that you believe with all your heart?

 

[theophilus777]

I cannot imagine the storm I would go through
Should a child of mine declare they were gay.
..in text we can sound so harsh...

I'd be devastated and angry and hurt and so wanting to love that child

I don't have to imagine, and yet it didn't change my stance on any aspect of the issue. That's because I thought it through first.

 

[staceylee67]

Well, Seeing Eyes, it means that no matter what I believe that Jesus Christ died for our sins. For a few hours I have questioned the existence of God only to find myself defending Christianity, God and the bible. I see the little signs God sends me just when I think I am going to lose it. I wonder how anyone could ever be an atheist. I try hard to live a Christian life, one of goodness,generosity, grace and thankfulness.
Even when my heart is aching and I am angry at God, I know I will get over it eventually.

 

[seeingeyes]

Well, Seeing Eyes, it means that no matter what I believe that Jesus Christ died for our sins. For a few hours I have questioned the existence of God only to find myself defending Christianity, God and the bible. I see the little signs God sends me just when I think I am going to lose it. I wonder how anyone could ever be an atheist. I try hard to live a Christian life, one of goodness,generosity, grace and thankfulness.
Even when my heart is aching and I am angry at God, I know I will get over it eventually.

Maybe you are getting a spirit-nudge to stop getting over it and start digging in further. God is trying to tell you something here, sister.

 

[BryanW92]

Gee, so sorry Brian. I guess I am. It allowed to defend my question. I am. It repeating myself any more than the haters are.
I am mature enough for discussion. Apparently you are not. Why would I have an agenda?? I try to understand other peoples point of view. The people spewing hate here are not contributing to my understanding.
Why are you being mean to me, Brian?

What??

Show me evidence of "hate" in this forum. Not disagreement with your position, but actual hate. People are disagreeing with you, but there is no "hate".

I am disagreeing with you, but am not being "mean". Instead of responding to what I've told you, you respond with a personal attack by calling me "mean".

When you load your comments with emotion-charged words like "hate", you make it hard to have a mature discussion because anyone who disagrees with you is "hating".

A question was asked in the OP and has been answered. People have repeatedly tried to explain the difference betwen hating the sinner (which no one does here) and hating the sin (which many do). Do you think that you are going to shame us into thinking that gay sex is not a sin just by calling us names (remember Romans 1:26-28)?

I'm 51 years old and the use of peer pressure doesn't work on me anymore. You can't give me some teenage logic: "if you don't agree with MEEEE, then you're a HATERRRRRR!" and expect me to change what I know to be true.

 

[staceylee67]

BRIAN-- if you read all of my posts you will clearly see that I am not calling people haters because they disagree with me. My husband disagrees with me. not a hater, he loves my nephew.

THEN I retracted and agreed that hate was too strong a word AND I ONLY GOT THAT VIBE FROM A COUPLE OF PEOPLE. read "VIBE". It was that gut defensive reaction when ppl start off by saying it is an abonination and then go further---- so maybe I read too much between the lines.

There are people here whom I have had a good conversation with, back and forth, you know, a debate. MOST of the reports here I see as a friendly disagreement-- a two way conversation that has actually HELPED my understanding. YOURS, I am sorry, feels condescending.

You said "You have an agenda. If you want to discuss, then discuss. If you want to keep repeating your talking points, then you can check off CF on your list of those who have heard the talking points."
SO you are basically telling me there is no room for debate because I keep repeating talking points.
*You said I have an agenda. Is that not a personal attack... like the one you accuse me of because I said you were being mean?

**You said I am trying to shame people-- also a personal attack on me.

***You said I am using peer pressure-- I don't even know what to say to that.

I have also said that maybe I am not the best communicator. Someone else mentioned that in text things can come accross differently-- I AM GUILTY of that-- both in the things I try to say AND the things that I read.

I AM emotionally charged-- I admit tht and maybe I have a problem with my mouth. I am thankful to those MANY people on this thread who have seen past that and HELPED me to understand things. Those who have offered support--- even while telling me that homosexuality IS a sin.

I am so very thankful to those who have offered kind words and listened to me, who responded to my snark with love--and diffused me, encouraged to THINK and take a step back. It is a trait that I LEARN from and appreciate.

 

[Rubiks]

No one is condemned merely for having a homosexual orientation, but its homosexual activity, regardless of whether the participant is heterosexual or homosexual or anywhere in between, that is sin

Us Chrisitians are commanded to love other people, even if their lifestyle is sinful. Yes, that means we are commanded to love LGBT people.

 

[tremble]

THEN I retracted and agreed that hate was too strong a word AND I ONLY GOT THAT VIBE FROM A COUPLE OF PEOPLE. read "VIBE". It was that gut defensive reaction when ppl start off by saying it is an abonination and then go further---- so maybe I read too much between the lines.

I don't see outright hate happening, but quite often there is this kind of glib lack of empathy that happens; like, "the Bible says it's wrong so deal with it".

While that is technically true, it's a statement which doesn't make much effort to really communicate with the target audience.

Imagine that you are in a heterosexual relationship with someone you love very deeply. Maybe you've been together for a year, or maybe 40 years. And then, for whatever reason, God asks you to forsake that relationship. Maybe you will agree with the reason and maybe you won't. Maybe the reason will bring you some comfort to you or maybe you will not understand the reason at all, but the bottom line is that God is asking you to forsake the relationship.

That is what homosexuals are facing. We've got Christians on this forum who will argue tooth and nail that Jesus didn't really mean what he said about forsaking materialism. It's only stuff, material possessions, but they will argue as though it's their life they are being asked to give up. We all have difficulty in letting go of some aspects of life.

God is asking homosexuals to give up the physical manifestation of their love for their partners. He's asking them not to hold hands, not to kiss, not to be intimate or romantic; everything that heterosexuals get to enjoy. God has that right, as the creator.

But try to remember how incredibly painful it will be for them to make that kind of sacrifice. If we can convince a homosexual that we understand what they are going through, and we care about the pain they feel when we lay down a biblical ultimatum on their love life, they may be more willing to hear us and be less reactionary.

 

[KrAZeD]

I just wanted to make a quick comment about the subject.

Others have stated homosexuality is a sin and where in scripture, with that I agree full heartedly. Others have mentioned we are to "hate" the sin, love, respect the sinner which is obvious.

The main issues I have getting across to homosexuals is it's not the "love" but the engaging in sex that's wrong. You can love the same sex and still G intimate without having to engage in a sexual activity. Because one is not attracted to the opposite sex does not give one a "free" pass. It means that when God created you, you were given an obstacle to either refrain from sex or to overcome thinking your not compatible with the opposite sex.

The other is getting them to understand I'm not judging you as a person, I'm judging exactly what is shoved down my throat. And all I'm judging is that it's wrong because God speaks against it. I don't need to see make out sessions, butt grabbing, and every other flamboyant identifier to their sin. What one does behind closed doors is between them and God, leave me out of it completely. But that is always the issue, it's brought openly into public, and because I want nothing to do with sin I'm wrong.....

And this goes for every sin flaunted in my sight. I struggle everyday with my own demons and struggles, I don't want any extras thrown in my direction. If ones overly drunk, stealing, lying, committing adultery, cursing God I have no issues in asking someone to refrain from the sinful activity till I'm done with whatever I'm doing, or leaving myself. Sadly though one can't stay hidden from sin, we just have overcome it, avoid it, and not participate in it. The "gay" movement is one of those things that we just can not avoid, and will always get put against.