Where Did Humans Come From?

[BPPLEE]

I figure humans existed before Adam and Eve. They were the first two given living souls by God. I don't see the figurative language in Genesis to be a literal description. For one thing, if Eve was cloned from Adam, she would have only one x chromosome, and thus be male rather than female.

God could give her whatever chromosomes he wanted

 

[Anthony2019]

Frankly, I'll have to go on record and say that I'm one of those persons who doesn't think that Genesis chapter 1-11 (at least) should be taken as any sort of literal history, and at the same time, I think that what mainstream scientists say about the long natural history of our world in Evolutionary terms is approximately correct, even where modern humankind is concerned.

As for the issue of "the soul," that is a separate issue. If God exists then it's rational to think that we can be more than just walking meat sticks as well (and we can have spirit and soul) and none of this is specifically dependent upon God's Word.

No, it's dependent upon God Himself.

So, all in all, I wouldn't even worry about the Theory of Evolution. Just focus on Jesus Christ and all that we know about Him as Lord and Savior.

"Walking meat sticks" - that made my day!

 

[FaithT]

God could give her whatever chromosomes he wanted

Yes, He could, but is it reasonable to believe He did based on the overwhelming evidence?

 

[Jonaitis]

I was curious as to how divided posters are on this topic. As a former Catholic, now Lutheran, (who is still unsure if I’m in the right church) I learned from the writings and some communication via email with Edward Feser, that humans may have started as part of a population of hominids but that God gave Adam and Eve souls, making them human. Then their offspring interbred with these other hominids and so on. I’m probably oversimplifying Feser’s theory and it’s been a long time since I’d read it, but what are your thoughts on this idea?
Or do you believe we came from Adam and Eve, whose children interbred with one another and so on?
Other theories?

We have actual remains of other hominid species other than homo sapiens, so we cannot deny the obvious. Some will tell you that the Neanderthals, for example, were a branch of homo sapiens, but this is further from the truth in its DNA-analysis. If Scripture be true, then it cannot deny what is true factually outside of the canon.

I had a theory a long time ago that the other hominid species that existed before their extinction were descendants of Cain, or rather, distant relatives of Noah's family that perished in the Flood. However, even this cannot work. All modern humans share between 0-6% of a few of the other hominid species, and there is no Y/X chromosome marker present in any human today that is inherited from them. These other kinds of humans are almost alien, and they died long before we could record anything about it.

 

[Jonaitis]

There I am afraid you are wrong. The bible is a history book and like any book or statement has the right to be taken as truth untill shown not to be correct.
Check out what prof Robert dick Wilson wrote as a result of his studies of the anctient languages in the near east and of the bible.

I don't think you spent enough time proving that. You will find many historical problems, but that's because the Scriptures aren't meant to be taken literally in the historical sense.

 

[FaithT]

We have actual remains of other hominid species other than homo sapiens, so we cannot deny the obvious. Some will tell you that the Neanderthals, for example, were a branch of homo sapiens, but this is further from the truth in its DNA-analysis. If Scripture be true, then it cannot deny what is true factually outside of the canon.

I had a theory a long time ago that the other hominid species that existed before their extinction were descendants of Cain, or rather, distant relatives of Noah's family that perished in the Flood. However, even this cannot work. All modern humans share between 0-6% of a few of the other hominid species, and there is no Y/X chromosome marker present in any human today that is inherited from them. These other kinds of humans are almost alien, and they died long before we could record anything about it.

Every Christian site I’ve read that talks about Neanderthals say that they were human. They interbred with us.

 

[JAL]

Yes, He could, but is it reasonable to believe He did based on the overwhelming evidence?

I didn't get this post. Overwhelming evidence of what? All we are told is that God used Adam's body as raw material for Eve, right?

Personally I'm a staunch materialist. I think what Paul inferred here is that God was mostly interested in extracting a fragment of Adam's physical soul, to serve as Eve's soul. Notice Paul says that sin entered the world through Adam, even though Eve sinned first. This is true because Eve WAS Adam (i.e a piece of him).

Incidentally, after the Fall, I believe that God decided to fragment Adam's soul even further. EACH of us is a piece of Adam, hence born with his sinful nature. Thus I agree with Millard J. Erickson's statement, "We were all [physically] present within Adam, such that we all sinned in his act." We suffer for Adam's sin because we are the Adam who sinned.

 

[FaithT]

I didn't get this post. Overwhelming evidence of what? All we are told is that God used Adam's body as raw material for Eve, right?

Personally I'm a staunch materialist. I think what Paul inferred here is that God was mostly interested in extracting a fragment of Adam's physical soul, to serve as Eve's soul. Notice Paul says that sin entered the world through Adam, even though Eve sinned first. This is true because Eve WAS Adam (i.e a piece of him).

Incidentally, after the Fall, I believe that God decided to fragment Adam's soul even further. EACH of us is a piece of Adam, hence born with his sinful nature. Thus I agree with Millard J. Erickson's statement, "We were all [physically] present within Adam, such that we all sinned in his act." We suffer for Adam's sin because we are the Adam who sinned.

Overwhelming evidence of science.

 

[Jonaitis]

Every Christian site I’ve read that talks about Neanderthals say that they were human. They interbred with us.

What a Christian website may say doesn't change what the material evidence reveals.

Yes, they interbred with us, but we inherited imperfect genes from them, this we know. We are distantly related to them, but we are not an exact match. If a literal Adam and Eve existed, they may have been an earlier kind of hominid species, but even that is problematic.

 

[FaithT]

What a Christian website may say doesn't change what the material evidence reveals.

Yes, they interbred with us, but we inherited imperfect genes from them, this we know. We are distantly related to them, but we are not an exact match. If a literal Adam and Eve existed, they may have been an earlier kind of hominid species, but even that is problematic.

The way I understood it, one can’t breed with someone from another species. No?

 

[Jonaitis]

The way I understood it, one can’t breed with someone from another species. No?

Actually, hybridization does exist in the animal kingdom, and humans have been practicing selective breeding for thousands of years, including plants. Did you know that a lemon is a crossbreed between two different citrus fruits?

 

[FaithT]

Who were the Neanderthals?

 

[JAL]

Overwhelming evidence of science.

Still too vague.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I was curious as to how divided posters are on this topic. As a former Catholic, now Lutheran, (who is still unsure if I’m in the right church) I learned from the writings and some communication via email with Edward Feser, that humans may have started as part of a population of hominids but that God gave Adam and Eve souls, making them human. Then their offspring interbred with these other hominids and so on. I’m probably oversimplifying Feser’s theory and it’s been a long time since I’d read it, but what are your thoughts on this idea?
Or do you believe we came from Adam and Eve, whose children interbred with one another and so on?
Other theories?

I admit this my thinking as well. It makes perfect sense as to why Cain was so scared to be put out into the world, and his wife? Its weird to marry your sister. I could go on with more reasons.
Blessings

 

[FaithT]

Still too vague.

Science seems to support that we came from a group of people instead of two, like Ed Feser’s belief.

 

[JAL]

Science seems to support that we came from a group of people instead of two, like Ed Feser’s belief.

I'm OEC. Where is the tension? Genetic patterns of the early hominids could easily have been the technology reused later by God for a special creation of Adam and Eve, right?

 

[FaithT]

I'm OEC. Where is the tension? Genetic patterns of the early hominids could easily have been the technology reused later by God for a special creation of Adam and Eve, right?

How would that work?

 

[JAL]

How would that work?

There's nothing that needs to "work". The prediction in my OEC model is:

....(1) Many special creations. (Regardless of any intermittent adaptations).
....(2) Similarities between special creations, for example a likely increase in complexity but still having much in common with earlier creations/species. If it helps, picture God as an engineer engaged in a process of learning and experimentation, with Adam and Eve being His crowning achievement.

 

[FaithT]

There's nothing that needs to "work". The prediction in my OEC model is:

....(1) Many special creations. (Regardless of any intermittent adaptations).
....(2) Similarities between special creations, for example a likely increase in complexity but still having much in common with earlier creations/species. If it helps, picture God as an engineer engaged in a process of learning and experimentation, with Adam and Eve being His crowning achievement.

Sorry, but like I said earlier, this is starting to go over my head. Do you agree that there were probably other humans or human like beings prior to A and E?

 

[JAL]

Sorry, but like I said earlier, this is starting to go over my head. Do you agree that there were probably other humans or human like beings prior to A and E?

I'm not disputing the fossil record. Just interpreting it from an OEC perspective. Over your head? I don't think I said anything complicated. Scientists tend to view the Cambrian Explosion as consistent with evolution/adaptation. I would suspect it's more likely an example of special creations.

I'm not being clear?