Where are we now in the book of Revelation?

[iamlamad]

Since the Tribulation hasn't started yet and since "The Day of the Lord" - or WWIII - is near the end of Tribulation, "The Day of the Lord" is nowhere near happening.
In fact, NOTHING is near happening until the antichrist makes his appearance.

I disagree. Nothing except the pretrib rapture which you will MISS.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

The fact that the 7 last plagues are now being poured out is proof that all prior prophecies have been fulfilled. Hitler was the antichrist.

An unbelievable answer! This is beyond preposterous.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

You must enjoy constantly being wrong.

John, thanks for the chuckle! Now THIS I can agree with!

 

[iamlamad]

On the verge in God's view, or on the verge in the view of Humans?

I never can tell what you guys mean when you say stuff like that... one day yall'll get blue in the face screaming that soon means 1000's of years, and the next day you'll casually use it to refer to a period of just few years, or even few months...

I suppose requesting just a little linguistic consistency would be to tall an order, eh?

Good question: "a little while" is something different to God than to us!

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

We are between chapters 3 and 4. Rev. 1:19 provides the division of the book into the things which are (i.e., present to John) and the things which will be after these things (i.e., future to John). Chapters 2 & 3 are obviously present to John, and chapter 4 begins the things future to John. They're still future to us, too. So we have to be between 3 and 4.

I disagree, but good try. The thing is, John did NOT write that he would write ONLY of things future. Indeed, there are some things written that were even past tense to John. Case in point: Rev. 12:1-5 is about the birth of Christ. It is history, and was when John wrote. Another: both chapters 4 & 5 are a history lesson also. It is a vision of the throne room before Jesus rose, then AS He rose and ascended.

In fact, he does not get to future events until later on, in chapter 6.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

We are currently in the 1000 year reign of Christ. We in the church are reigning with Christ. His work is being accomplished through the church by the power of the Holy Spirit.

Jesus told the apostles He would not leave them as orphans...He built His church on the foundation of the apostles and prophets with Himself as the Cornerstone.

The church is the temple of the living God!!!

I disagree. Preposterous. SUPER-preposterous.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Hi LAMAD

You asked an excellent question. It's a tough one because Revelation is not in chronological order. Sometimes the bottom page of one chapter seems to belong at a latter point in the story. If I said we are at the top of Revelation 7, it might lead you to assume that Rev.12 is in the future. It likely is not. This is just my back of the envelope calculation.

Revelation 7:1-6 is going on right now or is the very next thing to happen. When this begins it will be fast, just a matter of days.

(Days in the view of humans)


The 144,000 of Israel Sealed

7 After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth, that no wind might blow on earth or sea or against any tree. 2 Then I saw another angel ascending from the rising of the sun, with the seal of the living God, and he called with a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm earth and sea, 3 saying, “Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until we have sealed the servants[a] of our God on their foreheads.” (ESV)

I disagree. Especially with your statement about Chronology. My Axiom on Revelation:

ANY theory that must rearrange John's God given chronology is immediately suspect and WILL be proven wrong.

However, that being said, you are closer than anyone yet has come. You are HOT! Good post!

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

My two cents:

"And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
"And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
"And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled."
Rev 6:9-11 (KJV)

We're waiting for the fulfillment "that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled"

What's next is the sixth seal:

"And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
"And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
"And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
"And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
"And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
"For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand? "
Rev 6:12-17 (KJV)

WOW! WOW! WOW!!!! You have GOT IT! Hallelujah! Praise the Lord FOREVER!

The 5th seal is for the martyrs of the church age. They were told they would have to wait for the last martyr to be killed as they were, as church age martyrs. What will make the last martyr of the church age? Of course, the pretrib rapture will END the age of the church. The door to the born again road will close forever.

The rapture is the first event of the 6th seal, or it happens as the trigger for the 6th seal.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Nowhere, the gentile church gets raptured before it begins.

I disagree.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Are you saying that the rapture will happen between the 5 th and 6 th seal? The traditional way of thinking is that the rapture takes place in rev 4:1 where it says ' come up hither' . I am not saying that I believe that way. I am really not sure. I need to study and pray more on this and trust in the guiding of our great teacher, the Holy Spirit .

He was and is right - tradition is wrong. Tradition does not understand chapters 4 & 6 are HISTORY, a time before Jesus rose, up to the time He rose and was found worthy to break the seals, then the time of His first ascension.
This CONTEXT sets the timing for the first seals. Miss it, and you will certainly miss what the 1st seal is about.

If you don't believe me, READ IT! See what is the first thing Jesus does after He ascends into the throne room. (I am writing this for the naysayers.)

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

The question in the OP is an interesting one I think..

It requires a couple more questions I think..

What are the things which are?

What are the things which shall be here.. after...?

We obviously need to understand the things which are if we're going to understand the things which shall be hereafter.

What is Christ doing now at this present time?

The obvious answer should be that He is building His church upon confessing Jesus of Nazareth being the Christ, the son God.

So how does that reveal what's going on with respect to the revelation of Jesus Christ..

Interesting topic imo.

Many people don't see the "history lessons" (things that were history to John when he wrote) mixed in with future events. However, they are there. Chapter 12:1-5 is a parenthetical history lesson about the birth of Christ.

If people think this is a hereafter passage, they will remain confused.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Where are we now in the book of Revelation?

It seems the news of Islamic atrocities leading to the end is always suppressed.

Some of the recent ones that most Christians are unaware of is this...

What happened in Sadad is the most serious and biggest massacre of Christians in Syria in the past two years and a half… 45 innocent civilians were martyred for no reason, and among them several women and children, many thrown into mass graves. Other civilians were threatened and terrorized. 30 were wounded and 10 are still missing. For one week, 1,500 families were held as hostages and human shields. Among them children, the elderly, the young, men and women…. All the houses of Sadad were robbed and property looted. The churches are damaged and desecrated, deprived of old books and precious furniture… What happened in Sadad is the largest massacre of Christians in Syria and the second in the Middle East, after the one in the Church of Our Lady of Salvation in Iraq, in 2010.

‘Largest Massacre of Christians in Syria’ Ignored | Raymond Ibrahim

And this...

Terrorists kidnap more than 200 Nigerian girls....

Terrorists kidnap more than 200 Nigerian girls

And I can't let the evening pass without exposing Islam's Latest Contributions to Peace.

Islam: Making a True Difference in the World - One Body at a Time

After all. What other peace religion would have it any other way.

Hows this for a weekly jihad report.

Weekly Jihad Report

Between Apr 12 - Apr 18 there were 42 Jihad Attacks in 19 countries with 5 "Allahu Akbars", with 327 Dead Bodies, and 607 Critically Injured.

The stats for last month...over 2,000 dead. Want the stats for 2013? Want more news?

And yet so many of you see no reason why Islam is the religion of the beast.

BLACKSHEEPPROPHECIES.COM - HOME PAGE

How disappointing! You never answered the question! However, GREAT post exposing the religion of the Beast.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

This is where I think we are at...

The First Seal - BLACKSHEEPPROPHECIES.COM

I disagree. The first seal was broken in 32 AD or close. It was HISTORY to John as he wrote.

LAMAD

 

[bibletruth469]

WOW! WOW! WOW!!!! You have GOT IT! Hallelujah! Praise the Lord FOREVER! The 5th seal is for the martyrs of the church age. They were told they would have to wait for the last martyr to be killed as they were, as church age martyrs. What will make the last martyr of the church age? Of course, the pretrib rapture will END the age of the church. The door to the born again road will close forever. The rapture is the first event of the 6th seal, or it happens as the trigger for the 6th seal. LAMAD

If the rapture happens at the 6th seal, wouldn't that event time frame be classified as pre- wrath instead of pre- trib? The abomination of desolation happens at mid trib and the Jews are told to run for their lives. Doesn't the sudden destruction of Matt 24 happen at midpoint also? I myself believe pre- trib, but I really don't follow you . Please explain how you can still believe in a pre- trib rapture that happens at the 6 th seal. Thanks

 

[iamlamad]

The first horsemen is always a real person. A white horse is Male Thumos. Alegory of the Chariot. Nebekenezer and Hernando Cortez were examples of the first horsemen. War, plague, and famine are stressor. They stress us so that we learn to listen to God while his chosen one brings God's wrath.

The spirit is pointing me to Putin. He has a bow. Nukes. He is conquering. Russia was spared Feminism, humanism, and a lot of other false idols that corrupt God's word by the Iron Curtain.

The big show starts in 2015. UN created in 1945 and usurps God's rightful place. UN is tower of Babel. America has become Babylon, poisoning the rest of the world through mass communication and spreading idolatrous ideologies. 1945+70=2015.

I disagree. Hardly worth answering. But at least you tried. Keep studying!

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Soon to be third seal (global financial "collapse").

Think a light show is happening now with the tetrads...we haven't even made it to the trumps.

I disagree.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

We are in the church of Philidelphia era. None of the seals have begun yet.

I disagree. The first five seals were opened as soon as Jesus ascended.

LAMAD

 

[Old Timer]

Many people don't see the "history lessons" (things that were history to John when he wrote) mixed in with future events. However, they are there. Chapter 12:1-5 is a parenthetical history lesson about the birth of Christ.

If people think this is a hereafter passage, they will remain confused.

LAMAD

And once again I'll remain confused.. simply because the book itself declares that these are the things which shall be hereafter.. specifically chapters 4 onward.

What or who gives you the right to make them the things which were or the things which are?

 

[Old Timer]

Once again.. here are a few reason why I believe that all of Revelation 12 (and Rev 4-22 for that matter) pertains to the things which shall be... and not the things which were OR which are..

1. The book specifically says so.

2. Paul tells us that the Day of the Lord shall come as travail upon a woman with child.. this is clearly future.

3. Michael standing up for Daniel's people in the time of the end.

IMO that's pretty strong scriptural support.

 

[Lollerskates]

I disagree.

LAMAD

I know you do. Just watch the show.